Nordland

[Mr S]

Thanks all !!! But Ludwig, I DONT agree about the famous Berlin picture, have you any evidence for this?????? Fred, Ihave seen a drawing of an alternativ symbol, a white dronshio on a black bachground, think it never been used..Mr S

[Fred]

Sorry for my lack of the english "lingo":

symbol, a white dronshio on a black bachground, think it never been used..Mr S

I do not understand what a dronshio is

however I agree that some sort of evidence is called for by Mr. Ludwig.

Fred.

[Mr S]

Sorry Fred, it was supposed to say "dragonship", the longships used by the vikings!
Mr S

[Fred]

Sorry Mr S, the only dragonship that I know of is the one used by Kampfgruppe 100(luftwaffe).

[Peter J. Hertel]

Hi all,

The symbol for the "Nordland" Division is the sun wheel (sonnenrad)


Peter

[Mr S]

No Peter, look at http://www.skalman.nu/waffen-ss/11.htm
A "sunwheel" is a circel with a cross in it (for exampel used by Quislings Norwegian nazis during the war...) Mr S

[Peter J. Hertel]

No you, Mr S,

There are two versions of the sun wheel, version (a) is a circular swastika - [this is the version I was referring to] and version (b) a diagonal cross inside a circle. Version (a) is the most common one used by Nordland and also to some extent by Wiking Division on their vehicles and also by the Germanische SS Norge.

The Quisling movement used a type of sun wheel, which is a horizontal cross inside a circle with two swords on either of the cross.

Check out the following references, Hugh Page Taylor's book "Uniforms, Organisation and History of the Waffen-SS" volume 3, pages 90 and 93. The front cover of Wilhelm Tieke's book "Tragedy of the Faithful" and David Littlejohn "Foreign Legions of the Third Reich" volume 1, pages 14, 17, 52, 56 and 59.


Peter

[Peter J. Hertel]

Mr S,

The "dragonship" that you are referring to in your post above, is in fact the prow of of Viking ship.
It was authorised by Heinrich Himmler on 3 March 1943, too late to be worn by the "Nordland" regiment as it had already left the "Wiking divsion to be come part of the cadre for the "Nordland divison. It was manufactured, but never worn by anybody. It is not sure whether Himmler intended this collar patch to be worn by the whole "Wiking division or for only the Norwegian contingent of the "Nordland" regiment. Therefore, it could only be categorised as a ‘projected insignia'.


Peter

[David Lehmann]

A reduced battalion of French waffen SS from the "Charlemagne" division and Kampfgruppen of the "Norge" and "Danmark" regiments from the "Nordland" division were among the last defenders of Berlin between 28th April and 2nd May 1945.

[Snafu]

"The photo of a knocked out half-track in Berlin, surrounded by fallen soldiers, shows a Sd.Kfz.250 Neu - not a 251 - actually."

If I remember correctly, Ragnar Johansson belonged the mortar company of the Aufklärungsabteilung 11 (Divisional Recon Bn), in fact most swedes of the "Nordland" division did. 250's were used to mount 81mm mortars in the late war (Sd.Kfz 250/7).
Secondly, the house in the Hintergrund makes it possible, according to Swedish journalist Bosse Schön, to identify the street as Friedrichstrasse, which some remnants of the Freiw. SS-Panzergrenadierdiv. "Nordland" used in order to try and cross the Spree and break out to the north, after having defended Anhalter Bahnhof south of the Reichskanzlei.
Thirdly, Johanssons own comrades claim that his halftrack was set ablaze running, because of tankfire from one of the adjoning streets to the east of the Friedrichstrasse, killing the crew.
Think there is a lot that makes it quite plausible that the photo does in fact portray the viechle of the Swedish volunteer.

[Mark C. Yerger]

The volumes done by Jan Vincx are excellent, detailed and have a lot of vet supplied material.

Best
Mark

[David Lehmann]

I don't exactky know where is the photo you are talking about but I have a book from Jean Mabire about the Nordland division and there is also a photo of a knocked out Sdkfz 250 Neu or 251/1 HT in Berlin, surrounded by fallen soldiers.
In the caption it is said that it is a reco vehicle but no info about the names of the crew members

There is a totally black Sonnenrad in a black circle on the front.
The Sunwheel Swastika was the Norse symbol of the Sun.

You find it for the Nordland division but also the Wiking and the Langemarck divisions :

Nordland :


surrounded by a circle like on the photo
but on the vehicle there is no shield behind and the Sunwheel Swastika is totally black.


Wiking :



Langemarck :



By the way if it can help the Nr of the halftrack is SS-900915 ... but I have no mean to clearly identify the HT whith that, perhaps others ?

[Fred]

surrounded by a circle like on the photo
but on the vehicle there is no shield behind and the Sunwheel Swastika is totally black.

Yes it´s the vehicle insignia of the 11th SS , It was an enclosed swastika within a yellow circle. The Div. insignia was the shild or am I wrong?

[David Lehmann]

I found the same photo on the web :



caption :

A knocked-out "Nordland" SPW 250 in Berlin, May 1945:
The knocked out Nordland vehicle pictured has been identified by a Swedish historian as belonging to the Swedish platoon of the "Schwedenkompanie". The vehicle in question is said to have been used in a final attempt to escape from Berlin during the last day of the war. The assault was headed by the commander of the company, Hauptsturmführer Hans Pehrsson, who eventually became a POW in the Soviet Union but managed to escape some two years later. Not so lucky was the driver Ragnar Josephsson who can be seen lying dead in the street (probably Friedrichstrasse) on the right.

[Polynike]

where did you find it panzermeyer and can any post some goos photo websites thanks