Tigre, I really enjoy every post of yours! Keep going the good job.
BR
Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Thank you very much for your warm words BR 
. Cheers. Raúl M 
.
. Cheers. Raúl M .Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Hello to all 
; the story follows...................................
The course of the battle - July 14, 1943. Actions.
The GD Pz Bde jumped off punctually at 0400, together with the 677th Gren Regt of the 332d ID, from Pt 1.5 SW of Beresowka toward Hill 233.3. Strong Luftwaffe strikes at Krassnij Usliw brought good results, but the brigade advanced slowly because of heavy flanking fire from the N and S. At 0550 the Panther Bde CO requested another dive bomber strike at the woods S of 233.3 and at Krassnij Usliw. At 0600 the lead tanks of the Panther Bde approached 233.3. By 0720 the Panther Bde, with the 677th Gren Regt, 332d Recon Bn, 3d Kp/332d Pi Bn, and a platoon of the 332d AT Bn attached, captured 233.3 and then engaged in combat with Russian tanks and artillery N of the hill. At that point the bde halted to let the infantry catch up, while beginning combat recon of Hill 240.2.
Again the Panther Bde requested Luftwaffe support against the W and NW edge of the Tolstoje Woods, and the answering dive bomber groups were directed from the air by Stuka command. At 0815 they bombed the Tolstoje Woods, and another strike was planned for between 1030 and 1100. At 0835 the Panther Bde reported the Soviets withdrawing from the Tolstoje Woods toward Nowenkoje, but the bde was still fighting Russian tanks.
At 0840 Corps sent orders for GD and 3d PzD to begin attacking along the entire front. The Panther Bde was to push ahead at once without awaiting the arrival of the infantry. By 0920 the Panther Bde was l.5 km NW of Krassnij Usliw, advancing to the NE. By 1000, the Panther Bde was having a difficult time holding the ridge between the woods; nevertheless the bde fought its way slowly ahead meter by meter toward the commanding Hil 240.2. As it did so, at 1100 the GD Pz Regt was engaged in a tank battle N of Hill 258.5, screening the N edges of the Tolstoje Woods in order to prevent the Soviets from escaping.
Then at 1110 strong Soviet forces launched an attack on a broad front from the Corps right wing to the Obojan highway and on to the W. By 1200 the Soviet attacks had shifted westward. At 1230 the Panther Bde was still held up by heavy flanking fire from both sides and hoped that 3d PzD's attack through the Tolstoje Woods would be successful in easing this pressure.
By 1700 the Panther Bde was still in combat S of 240.2. Corps orders for the night were that the Panther Bde was to block the N edge of the Tolstoje Woods while the Recon Bn blocked the NE corner, N of 258.5. The div reported as operational 8 Pz Kw III longs, 9 flamethrower tanks, 3 Pz Kw IV shorts, 18 Pz Kw IV longs, and 36 Panthers.
At 2120 14 July the advance of the Panther Bde to the forest NW of the Tolstoje Woods failed because of heavy fire from 30 Soviet tanks from the Ravine just E of Nowenkoje and flanking fire from the Tolstoje Woods. Without waiting for div orders, the Panther Bde CO moved his bde to Hill 237.6 N of Beresowka, in order to replenish his tanks with fuel and ammunition. Unfortunately, this opened a gap in the encirclement of the Tolstoje Woods between the small wooded area and 240.2, and the Russians used this gap to try to break out of the woods during the night. The Panther Bde then assembled in the S part of the Kubasovskij Ravine.
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
Cheers. Raúl M.
; the story follows...................................The course of the battle - July 14, 1943. Actions.
The GD Pz Bde jumped off punctually at 0400, together with the 677th Gren Regt of the 332d ID, from Pt 1.5 SW of Beresowka toward Hill 233.3. Strong Luftwaffe strikes at Krassnij Usliw brought good results, but the brigade advanced slowly because of heavy flanking fire from the N and S. At 0550 the Panther Bde CO requested another dive bomber strike at the woods S of 233.3 and at Krassnij Usliw. At 0600 the lead tanks of the Panther Bde approached 233.3. By 0720 the Panther Bde, with the 677th Gren Regt, 332d Recon Bn, 3d Kp/332d Pi Bn, and a platoon of the 332d AT Bn attached, captured 233.3 and then engaged in combat with Russian tanks and artillery N of the hill. At that point the bde halted to let the infantry catch up, while beginning combat recon of Hill 240.2.
Again the Panther Bde requested Luftwaffe support against the W and NW edge of the Tolstoje Woods, and the answering dive bomber groups were directed from the air by Stuka command. At 0815 they bombed the Tolstoje Woods, and another strike was planned for between 1030 and 1100. At 0835 the Panther Bde reported the Soviets withdrawing from the Tolstoje Woods toward Nowenkoje, but the bde was still fighting Russian tanks.
At 0840 Corps sent orders for GD and 3d PzD to begin attacking along the entire front. The Panther Bde was to push ahead at once without awaiting the arrival of the infantry. By 0920 the Panther Bde was l.5 km NW of Krassnij Usliw, advancing to the NE. By 1000, the Panther Bde was having a difficult time holding the ridge between the woods; nevertheless the bde fought its way slowly ahead meter by meter toward the commanding Hil 240.2. As it did so, at 1100 the GD Pz Regt was engaged in a tank battle N of Hill 258.5, screening the N edges of the Tolstoje Woods in order to prevent the Soviets from escaping.
Then at 1110 strong Soviet forces launched an attack on a broad front from the Corps right wing to the Obojan highway and on to the W. By 1200 the Soviet attacks had shifted westward. At 1230 the Panther Bde was still held up by heavy flanking fire from both sides and hoped that 3d PzD's attack through the Tolstoje Woods would be successful in easing this pressure.
By 1700 the Panther Bde was still in combat S of 240.2. Corps orders for the night were that the Panther Bde was to block the N edge of the Tolstoje Woods while the Recon Bn blocked the NE corner, N of 258.5. The div reported as operational 8 Pz Kw III longs, 9 flamethrower tanks, 3 Pz Kw IV shorts, 18 Pz Kw IV longs, and 36 Panthers.
At 2120 14 July the advance of the Panther Bde to the forest NW of the Tolstoje Woods failed because of heavy fire from 30 Soviet tanks from the Ravine just E of Nowenkoje and flanking fire from the Tolstoje Woods. Without waiting for div orders, the Panther Bde CO moved his bde to Hill 237.6 N of Beresowka, in order to replenish his tanks with fuel and ammunition. Unfortunately, this opened a gap in the encirclement of the Tolstoje Woods between the small wooded area and 240.2, and the Russians used this gap to try to break out of the woods during the night. The Panther Bde then assembled in the S part of the Kubasovskij Ravine.
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
Cheers. Raúl M
.- Attachments
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- image019.png (95.17 KiB) Viewed 1516 times
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- Pz Kw V “Panther” Ausf. D Nº 434 of Pz.Abt. 51................................................
http://warspot.ru/3055-debyut-panter - image021.png (145.3 KiB) Viewed 1516 times
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Hello to all ; the story follows...................................
The course of the battle - July 15, 1943. Actions.
By 0730 the Recon Bn found the N part of the Tolstoje Woods free of Soviets. At 1030 GD received orders to expand and strengthen its positions so that it could turn over a stable defensive line to 3d PzD. After being relieved up to the S edge of Kalinowka at nightfall, GD was to commit its main forces to support the defensive efforts of 11th PzD. On the whole the day was quiet. GD fended off weak Soviet units trying to feel their way forward against the front of the Fus Regt. The von Wietersheim Battalion of the Panther Bde, which was deployed at the small wooded area NW of the Tolstoje Woods in order to screen against Nowenkoje, in a "spirited" attack on a Soviet armored force in the ravine E of Nowenkoje, reportedly destroyed 16 Russian tanks in a few minutes.
At 1910 15 July, GD received new orders to send its relieved elements (after 3d PzD relieved the div up to the S edge of Kalinowka at sunset) to the area Syrtsewo-Beresowka-Alexejewka-Luchanino. The division planned to move the Panther Bde to Beresowka. The German High Command ended Operation Citadel.
In this operation the "Panzerglocke" (armored bell) replaced the "Panzerkeil" (armored wedge). In the "Panzerglocke" heavy tanks marched in the center with medium tanks to the left and to the right rear, in a wide arc, with light tanks ready to chase behind the center. Commanders, along with observers from all weapons, marched behind the medium tanks and maintained liaison with the aviation support. Engineers marched behind the leading tanks ready to open gaps in the minefields.
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
http://www.ebay.de/itm/AJ88-Panzer-V-Pa ... rmvSB=true
Cheers. Raúl M.
; the story follows...................................The course of the battle - July 15, 1943. Actions.
By 0730 the Recon Bn found the N part of the Tolstoje Woods free of Soviets. At 1030 GD received orders to expand and strengthen its positions so that it could turn over a stable defensive line to 3d PzD. After being relieved up to the S edge of Kalinowka at nightfall, GD was to commit its main forces to support the defensive efforts of 11th PzD. On the whole the day was quiet. GD fended off weak Soviet units trying to feel their way forward against the front of the Fus Regt. The von Wietersheim Battalion of the Panther Bde, which was deployed at the small wooded area NW of the Tolstoje Woods in order to screen against Nowenkoje, in a "spirited" attack on a Soviet armored force in the ravine E of Nowenkoje, reportedly destroyed 16 Russian tanks in a few minutes.
At 1910 15 July, GD received new orders to send its relieved elements (after 3d PzD relieved the div up to the S edge of Kalinowka at sunset) to the area Syrtsewo-Beresowka-Alexejewka-Luchanino. The division planned to move the Panther Bde to Beresowka. The German High Command ended Operation Citadel.
In this operation the "Panzerglocke" (armored bell) replaced the "Panzerkeil" (armored wedge). In the "Panzerglocke" heavy tanks marched in the center with medium tanks to the left and to the right rear, in a wide arc, with light tanks ready to chase behind the center. Commanders, along with observers from all weapons, marched behind the medium tanks and maintained liaison with the aviation support. Engineers marched behind the leading tanks ready to open gaps in the minefields.
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
http://www.ebay.de/itm/AJ88-Panzer-V-Pa ... rmvSB=true
Cheers. Raúl M
.- Attachments
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- A Pz Kw V "Panther" and disabled Soviet tanks on the edge of a village - Kursk 1943............................
- image024.jpg (69.07 KiB) Viewed 1459 times
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- Pz Kw V "Panther" Ausf. D RO4 of the Pz.Abt. 52................................................
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y181/Sheeds/firstRO4ofStab39assignedtoPzAbt52.jpg - image042.png (283.82 KiB) Viewed 1459 times
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Hello to all ; just closing the ring...................................
The course of the battle - 15 till 17 July, 1943.
The OKH/GenStdH/Org.Abt. ordered the delivery of all the "Panthers" of the Pz.Abt. 51 to the Pz.Abt. 52. The Pz.Abt. 51 will receive in the coming days a new batch of 96 refurbished "Panthers".
Report sheet at July 18, 1943 at 16:00:
Pz Abt. 51:
33 in service.
32 repair at workshops
31 total loss (2 burned, 29 blasted)
Pz Abt. 52:
28 in service
40 repair at workshops
4 delivered to workshops in the country
24 Total loss (blasted)
Maintenence Services of the two "Panthers" detachments worked very well. The average daily maintenance was about 25. Due to the numerous failures which had taken place, a significant shortage of spare parts occurred. Headquarters helped a lot in moving by air particularly engines and fuel pumps. The situation of spare parts is improving by the quick arrival of the transport of supplies, so that is expected to achieve a short-term repair of most of the vehicles damaged in the maintenance services.
According to a report of the situation of tanks at the Headquarters (20 July 1943) the HQ of Pz.Rgt. 39 and the Pz.Abt. 52 has in total:
142 Pz. V (including 9 Pz.Bef.Wg.) and 4 recovery Pz. V (turret-less)
42 Pz. V and recovery Pz. V in service
104 Pz. V and recovery Pz. V repair short- and long-term
12 new Pz. V are allocated but not arrived yet
It follows that the Pz.Abt. 51 delivered 65 Panthers (07/18/1943 actual stocks) to Pz.Abt. 52:
5 (Pz.Rgt.Stb. 39) + 65 (Pz.Abt. 51) + 68 (Pz.Abt. 52) + 4 Panthers (sent to the country) = 142 Panthers
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
http://www.ebay.de/itm/AJ88-Panzer-V-Pa ... rmvSB=true
Cheers. Raúl M.
; just closing the ring...................................The course of the battle - 15 till 17 July, 1943.
The OKH/GenStdH/Org.Abt. ordered the delivery of all the "Panthers" of the Pz.Abt. 51 to the Pz.Abt. 52. The Pz.Abt. 51 will receive in the coming days a new batch of 96 refurbished "Panthers".
Report sheet at July 18, 1943 at 16:00:
Pz Abt. 51:
33 in service.
32 repair at workshops
31 total loss (2 burned, 29 blasted)
Pz Abt. 52:
28 in service
40 repair at workshops
4 delivered to workshops in the country
24 Total loss (blasted)
Maintenence Services of the two "Panthers" detachments worked very well. The average daily maintenance was about 25. Due to the numerous failures which had taken place, a significant shortage of spare parts occurred. Headquarters helped a lot in moving by air particularly engines and fuel pumps. The situation of spare parts is improving by the quick arrival of the transport of supplies, so that is expected to achieve a short-term repair of most of the vehicles damaged in the maintenance services.
According to a report of the situation of tanks at the Headquarters (20 July 1943) the HQ of Pz.Rgt. 39 and the Pz.Abt. 52 has in total:
142 Pz. V (including 9 Pz.Bef.Wg.) and 4 recovery Pz. V (turret-less)
42 Pz. V and recovery Pz. V in service
104 Pz. V and recovery Pz. V repair short- and long-term
12 new Pz. V are allocated but not arrived yet
It follows that the Pz.Abt. 51 delivered 65 Panthers (07/18/1943 actual stocks) to Pz.Abt. 52:
5 (Pz.Rgt.Stb. 39) + 65 (Pz.Abt. 51) + 68 (Pz.Abt. 52) + 4 Panthers (sent to the country) = 142 Panthers
Sources: http://www.panther1944.de/index.php/de/ ... uppenteile
Panzer Tactics – German Small-Units Armor Tactics in WWII.
U.S. War Department "Handbook On German Military Forces" (Mar'45) TM-E 30-451
Kursk – The German View
MINE AND COUNTERMINE OPERATIONS IN THE BATTLE OF KURSK. Mr. Andrew Remson and Ms. Debbie Anderson.
Scorched Earth-Hitler’s War on Russia. Vol 2.
http://www.military-info.de/wk2/wk2.htm
A MEASURE OF THE REAL-WORLD VALUE OF MIXED MINE SYSTEMS. Dupuy Institute
http://planetarmor.com/forums/showthrea ... 859&page=2
KOSAVE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/me ... Kursk+1943
http://www.ebay.de/itm/AJ88-Panzer-V-Pa ... rmvSB=true
Cheers. Raúl M
.- Attachments
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- Pz Kw V "Panther" Ausf. D 312 of Pz Abt. 51 rendered useless in the actions around Kursk (rear view) ................................................
- image069.png (144.57 KiB) Viewed 1413 times
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- The same Panther seen from the front (it seems one of the tanks referred to as "blasted" in the reports) ................................................................................
- image071.png (137.58 KiB) Viewed 1413 times
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
According to the reports to Gen/Insp. 65 Panthers have been lost during Zitadelle. How many of them were evacuated from battelfield?
- Attachments
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Look for it and you will find it...
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Thanks for sharing it . Cheers. Raúl M .
. Cheers. Raúl M .Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Probably only 9 Panthers have been evacuated from 65, only 49 Panthers are blown up from 56, 7 Panthers were under fire of the enemy and couldn't be blown up.
Russian sources have informed about 31 Panthers which have been inspected and tested by AT weapons in July 1943.
Russian sources have informed about 31 Panthers which have been inspected and tested by AT weapons in July 1943.
Look for it and you will find it...
Re: Panzer-Abteilung 51 and 52
Hello to all ; more................................
Panther Ausf D, summer 1943 Kursk area.
Sources: https://vk.com/wall-85523449?own=1&offset=780
Cheers. Raúl M.
; more................................Panther Ausf D, summer 1943 Kursk area.
Sources: https://vk.com/wall-85523449?own=1&offset=780
Cheers. Raúl M
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- image071.jpg (18.86 KiB) Viewed 879 times
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- image072.jpg (26.94 KiB) Viewed 879 times
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Hunter12396
- Member
- Posts: 7
- Joined: 29 Nov 2020, 20:16
- Location: Pennsylvania
Re:
I am in need of this report, I don't suppose you still have it?jmark wrote: ↑12 Jan 2006, 03:13Checking through my files, I've also got an 11-page report called "Fighting Withdrawal of 'Kampfgruppe von Sivers' as a 'Floating Bubble' in the Worskla Valley from Tomarowka via Borissowka-Graiworon-Pirasewka-Kirowka as far as Achtyrka in August, 1943". Whew, quite a title! As the title says, this report is about the unit's actions in August 1943, so it does not cover Kursk. It does, however, say this about the commanders...