Displaced family January 1945 from Gotenhafen? to Denmark

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Heimatschuss
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Post by Heimatschuss » 24 Jul 2006 15:32

Hi Jef,

regarding the 'Krankenhaus' I've two promising locations. In Oxhöft there was a 'Hospital' on the heights above the harbour and on the southside there was the 'Marine-Lazarett' just south-west of harbour basin IV
For details look up this map http://www.gotenhafen.one.pl/hafenundreede.html (Click on it to enlarge.)

About the Zweitausendeins thing:
They are selling a slightly edited version of the CCP (Catalogue of Camps and Prisons) of the International Tracing Service (ITS, Internationaler Suchdienst des Deutschen Roten Keuzes) in Bad Arolsen (Germany). The International Tracing Service was set up by various governments to trace fates of any kind of person deported by Germany. Amongst other things they questioned lots of foreign workers about the places where they had been held and for what companies they had been working. This is generally regarded as the most complete list of locations and employers but it's far from being complete.
The files of the International Tracing Service are often consulted when it comes to compensations, pensions and the like, too.

Best regards
Torsten

Hexengrund
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camps

Post by Hexengrund » 24 Jul 2006 23:33

Hello everyone,

So can we now accept this camp site (between the streets that Jef mentioned) as actually being there and that it was used for a while as a workers/labour camp for the shipyards or do we need more verification of its existance?

And Jef any information when you visit the man you mentioned above who lived through it all would be greatly appeciated. It is all history and it is all very interesting.

Many thanks, Nora

clavo
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Nussdorf - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 30 Jul 2006 09:13

Hello everybody,

The municipal museum of Gdynia gives me the following information concerning hospital and lazaret in Nussdorf.

The only one hospital was opened to the civil population during WWII was the municipal hospital in Kaszubski square,
= General Litzman Platz. There was also a monastery of Mercy of St Vincent ( klasztor Milosierdzia sw Wincentego with chapel located at no 2 Starowiejska street at the intersection with Kaszubski square.

There were also " lazarety " in Gdynia in 1939 and 1945.
The nearest " lazaret " to the camp was in the general school no 10 in Morska street.

Is there anyone who haves comment on it, or pictures and documents ?
Who haves a good situation-plan with this places?
Thanks.

Best regards,

Jef

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Heimatschuss
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Post by Heimatschuss » 30 Jul 2006 11:38

Hi Jef,

I must have been totally blind. The Krankenhaus at Litzmannplatz can be found in section I12 of this map
http://www.gotenhafen.one.pl/Gotenhafen_SW.jpg .
It's a high resolution map and will take some time to load.

Picture postcards of General-Litzmann-Platz including one or two of the hospital are exhibited here
http://www.gotenhafen.one.pl/glplatz.html#
For magnification click on each postcard.

(After comparing the Gotenhafen town map with the postcards and the 1944 OT map I'm under the impression that the german Krankenhaus consisted out of two seperate buildings. An old one facing General-Litzmann-Platz and a new on facing Frankenstrasse.)

Best regards
Torsten

clavo
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Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 01 Aug 2006 08:13

Hello everybody,

Looking to the postcards of Grabau ( concerning the place my father was working during WWII ) , I need more information about the following sujets:

STAUERMANNSCHULE / KASERNE / ARBEITSAMBT / KOSZARY

During 6 months ( 1942 - 1943 ) my father had a training in a technical school.
Who knows this school ?
Does it exists today?

As you know, on friday we start with some brothers and sisters to visit all this places.
We will see also the city of Gdansk ( of course ) and Stutthof.
We come back on 13 august.
Thanks for all your help and information.

Regards,

Jef

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Heimatschuss
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Post by Heimatschuss » 01 Aug 2006 10:35

Hi Jef,

the Steuermannsschule (note spelling) was run by the Kriegsmarine to train sailors. It seems to have been located at was was formerly the polish maritime academy in Grabau. This link http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=54.52500 ... &t=k&hl=en
provides satellite imagery. Today it's the Wyzsza Szkola Morska of Gdynia situated in the block between Morska, Kapitanska, Grabowo and Kaspra Denhoffa
For a short history go to http://www.wsm.gdynia.pl/index-e.html. If I understand them correctly, there were also workshops to train craftsmen for the shipbuilding industry.

The german "Kaserne" had previously been the polish emigration center now being used by the Gemans as a military barracks.
http://www.polish-online.com/polen/stae ... reshof.php says:
In Gdingen begannen nicht nur die "Reichen und Schönen" ihre Reise nach Nordamerika. Den Meereshof wurde für tausende von Auswanderern zur letzten Station auf heimatlichem Boden. Eigens für sie wurde in Grabówek (Grabau), einem Vorort von Gdynia, auf dem Gelände einer preußischen Kaserne aus dem 19. Jahrhundert, ein Abfertigungszentrum (poln. „Etap Emigracyjny“) errichtet. Es war durch eine
direkte Eisenbahnlinie mit dem Meereshof verbunden. Der Gebäudekomplex bestand aus Unterkünften,
einem Speisesaal, einer Küche, einer Kapelle und sogar einer kleinen Schule. Für Menschen, die
ansteckende Krankheiten hatten, wurde hinter der Stadt ein Spital gebaut. Die Kranken konnten sowohl
direkt vom Festland gebracht als auch von der Bucht mit einem eigens dafür zur Verfügung stehenden
Motorboot transportiert werden. Das Abfertigungszentrum für die Emigranten wurde zwar schon 1933 in
Betrieb genommen, aber erst 1935 in Anwesenheit von Außenminister Józef Beck und des Schatzministers
feierlich eröffnet. Vor der Errichtung des Abfertigungszentrums waren die Auswanderer in einer Holzbaracke in der Nähe des sich im Bau befindenden Hafens und in Wejherowo (einer Stadt bei Gdynia) untergebracht.
Translation:
In Gdingen (Gdynia) not only the 'rich and famous' departed for their voyages to North America. For thousands of emigrants the 'Meereshof' (literally :sea court, Seebahnhof) was also the last station in their homeland. Particularly for them there had been built a camp (Pol.: „Etap Emigracyjny“) in the suburb of Grabowek (Grabau) on the grounds of a former prussian military barracks. This camp was connected with the 'Meereshof' by a direct railroad line. The compound comprised accomodations, a refectory, a kitchen, a chapel and even a small school. [Omitted...] The emigration camp had already been in operation since 1933, but the opening ceremony took place in 1935 and was attended by the minster of foreign affairs Józef Beck and finance minister Eugeniusz Kwiatkowski. [Omitted...]

Best regards
Torsten

clavo
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Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 01 Aug 2006 18:50

Thanks for your information, Torsten.

Best regards,

Jef

clavo
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Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 01 Aug 2006 19:52

Hello everybody,


In the letters, I have from my father, written in his work-camp in Nussdorf ( 1942-1943 )
I can give you the following detail-information:

" It was a big " lager " with quite new baracs only partially occupied. Even there was central heating.
One barac had 18 rooms and in 1 room we had 8 persons.
Also there was a ward ( sick-room )
In Nussdorf there was a little simply church ( St Nicolas ??? )
Also in the technical school for training there was central heating.
After 6 months I had to work in the lowest part of the ship to maintain the motor full of grease and oil.
From time to time we had to work on sunday too. "

I'm looking for pictures of this camp !

Best regards,

history1
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Re: Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by history1 » 02 Aug 2006 18:41

clavo wrote:Hello everybody,
I need more information about the following sujets:

STAUERMANNSCHULE / KASERNE / ARBEITSAMBT / KOSZARY

As you know, on friday we start with some brothers and sisters to visit all this places.
We will see also the city of Gdansk ( of course ) and Stutthof.
We come back on 13 august.
Thanks for all your help and information.
Regards,
Jef
Hy Jef,
hope you get my infos before your travel!

"Koszary" is polish and means "Kasernen" (plural of Kaserne).

Die "Steuermannschule" (Steuermann = cox. or mate) you will find when you drive from Gdynia in the direction of Rumia on the left side nearly at the heigh of the railway station.
Best regards, Roman

history1
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Location: Austria

Re: Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by history1 » 02 Aug 2006 19:00

clavo wrote:Hello everybody,
In Nussdorf there was a little simply church ( St Nicolas ??? )

Best regards,
Hy Jef,
it´s a hard way to find this church :) but here ist the result :

Parafia rzymskokatolicka pw. Św. Mikołaja
81-062 Gdynia, Św. Mikołaja 1 tel.663-44-14
e-mail: spmikchy@diecezja.gda.pl

Msze święte:
w niedziele i święta: 6.30, 8.00, 9.00, 10.30, 12.00, 13.00, 18.00
w dni powszednie: 6.30, 7.15, 8.00, 18.00
w święta zniesione: 6.30, 8.00, 9.00, 10.30, 17.00, 18.00, 19.00

Source: http://www.trojmiasto.pl/s.phtml?&miast ... 8&strona=1
On page two.

And another one (with pics):
http://www.diecezja.gda.pl/modules.php? ... ia&par=387

It´s a roman-catholic church under the patronage of Santa Claus.
Wish you a beautiful und interesting travel!
Poles are very hospitable ( I know it by experience) :)

Best regards, Roman

history1
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Joined: 31 Oct 2005 09:12
Location: Austria

Post by history1 » 02 Aug 2006 22:56

Hello again,

I don´t remember but did somebody read this :

"Dowództwo Kriegsmarine przeprowadziło specjalną akcję ewakuacyjną, podczas której w ciągu pięciu godzin nocnych z 4 na 5 kwietnia przewieziono wszystkimi możliwymi wodnymi środkami transportowymi na Półwysep Helski około 30 tysięcy uciekinierów i 10 tysięcy żołnierzy, nie ponosząc strat w ludziach."

Source: http://www.pomorze.gd.pl/kepa_oksywska.htm

Translation: The head of the navy prepared a special operation for evacuation, within five hours in the night from april 4.to april 5 they brought with water - tramsportation possibilitis to the Hel - Peninsula about 30 000 refugees and 10 000 soldiers. Not counted the casualties.

What do you think about this? Can this be the evacuation of Nora?

Is the building on this pic http://www.pomorze.gd.pl/fot_gdynia/ima ... image3.htm the Torpedostation?

Best regards, Roman

clavo
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Location: Belgium

Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 03 Aug 2006 09:27

Hello Roman,

Thank you very much for your info about the St Nicolaschurch in Nussdorf.

Thanks also for your wishes about our travel.

Of course after the travel I let you know our experience.

Best regards,

Jef

history1
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Joined: 31 Oct 2005 09:12
Location: Austria

Post by history1 » 03 Aug 2006 13:16

Hy Jef,

here is a map of gdynia, in the top is Św. Mikołaja, north of Morska - street.
http://trojmiasto.pl/mapa/index.phtml?x ... 000&zoom=1
Use the zoom for orientation.
And if I will be on yours there I would speak with the priests of the church. They possibly know more about the Nussdorf - camp.
Best regards, Roman

clavo
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Posts: 19
Joined: 05 Jul 2006 19:48
Location: Belgium

Nussdorf - Grabau - Gotenhafen

Post by clavo » 03 Aug 2006 20:31

Hi Roman,

Thanks for your help.
I do my best.

Best regards,

Jef

Hexengrund
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Location: AUSTRALIA

Displaced family January 1945

Post by Hexengrund » 04 Aug 2006 02:06

Hi Roman, and all

The place my family evacuated would have been close to the Torpedo site, but not so close that you could see it, and the jetty leading to it, from where my family were. My sister said the only thing they could see in the water was their small jetty, and not a solid jetty.

But the interesting thing about that photo is that it has the Torpedo site on the right with the car in the water on it's left. So maybe where we were could have been even more to the left. There were military cars in the 'hanger?" at Hexengrund and if this photo was taken after the Russian attack on and around Hexengrund, maybe it could fit.

We visited my sister the other day and cleared up some things. It looks like the 'barge?' looked like a smaller version of a U-Boat picture listed earlier. Because she said that it was similar but probably only fitted around 80 people (could be wrong but not a large vessel). On the top above the cabin? were placed the stetchers of the wounded soldiers, then on the deck around the cabin? section were people standing, then next to them around the deck were more stretchers of wounded soldiers and then the refugees sat side by side holding on to the wire rope that surrounded the vessel, with their feet dangling towards the water. There was no room for anyone to walk and the people that were standing (also refugees) had to hold on to something because the water was choppy.

Also the distance from the jetty to the ship was not that far, because by the time it was their turn to be ferried out to the ship it was very early daylight, very early in the morning, (evacuation only took place in total darkness at night) and one could just see the shape of the ship in the distance. I am still trying to get some drawings made of the scene and the vessel.

Thank you for the information and have a good holiday Jef, you seem to be having a very hot summer this year.

Best regards, Nora

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