Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

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kon
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Post by kon » 23 Jul 2007 19:52

I bad speak english,but know that on 16 aprile germans on eastern front has 34 panzer divisions.In 9 army,3 and 4 panzer armies were onle 4 Pzd!!!Hitler in 1945 takes all tanks on south
http://www.truthforever.com/hitlerbritagent2.jpg
http://www.truthforever.com/Was%20Hitle ... 0Agent.htm

Gregory Deych
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Post by Gregory Deych » 23 Jul 2007 23:54

The above-linked page explains how Hitler was mind-controlled by British via Illuminati techniques. Hopefully I just spared several millions of your brain cells from needless death.

kon
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Post by kon » 24 Jul 2007 05:10

Hitler plan Ardennes+tanks in Hungary near lake Balaton=http://www.rkka.ru/maps/visla.jpg

When Model saw Hitler Ardennes plan,has told that approach will be unsuccessful.After Ardennes Hitler 16 january thrown 6 panzer army in Hungury

kon
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Post by kon » 24 Jul 2007 05:15


Art
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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 21 Jul 2010 15:53

Some scan of original documents.

Personnel losses of the 1st Belorussian Front, 11 April - 1 May 1945
http://i072.radikal.ru/1007/22/d5efe5eff70c.jpg
1-9 May 1945:
http://s47.radikal.ru/i115/1007/65/d9009a8680e2.jpg
These are the same data that were given on the first page of the thread.
For comparison losses for the period 1-10 April 1945:
http://s60.radikal.ru/i169/1007/8f/c21b91c21934.jpg
During the first 10 days of April the front lost 1277 men killed in action (+10 in the Polish Army), 3364 wounded (+43), 35 missing (+1), 4268 for other reasons - sick etc (+228), total 8944 (+282 in the Polish Army).
That is from appendices to the war diary, 1st Belorussian Front, TsAMO f.233, op.2356, d.739, ll.506-508. Available online via podvignaroda.ru

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 23 Jan 2016 14:37

A curious document quoting armored losses of the 1 Belorussian Front in the Berlin operation by units and types of vehicles:
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/dou/?docID=152125972
From 14 April to 5 May 1945 the following numbers of tanks and SP guns were lost:

61 Army
312 Self-Propelled Artillery Regiment – 23 SU-76 total including 7 write-offs
1811 Self-Propelled Regiment – 4/2 SU-76
1899 Self-Propelled Regiment – 7/5 SU-76
Total 34/14

47 Army
334 Guards Self-Propelled Regiment – 34/8 ISU-122
70 Guards Heavy Tank Regiment – 21/3 IS
1825 SPR – 31/6 SU-100
1892 SPR – 9/9 SU-76
1416 SPR – 20/8 SU-76
1204 SPR – 12/8 SU-76
Total 127/42

3 Army
344 Guards SPR – 12/2 ISU-152
1901 SPR – 15/11 SU-76
1888 SPR – 4/4 SU-76
1812 SPR – 7/5 SU-76
Total 38/22

69 Army
68 Guards Tank Brigade – 61/19 T-34, 15/3 ISU-152
12 Self-Propelled Brigade – 56/13 SU-76
33 Guards Tank Regiment – 15/12 IS
1205 SPR – 12/6 SU-76
1221 SPR – 46/13 SU-76
89 Guards Tank Regiment – 37/21 IS
1206 SPR – 3/2 SU-76
Total 249/90

3 Shock Army
85 Tank Regiment – 6/2 T-34, 5/1 IS
88 Guards Tank Regiment – 28/5 IS
351 Guards SPR – 19/4 ISU-152
1203 SPR – 14/11 SU-76
1728 SPR – 5/4 SU-76
1729 SPR – 10/5 SU-76
1818 SPR – 18/5 SU-85, 6/1 SU-100
Total 111/38

33 Army
360 Guards SPR – 24/9 ISU-152
361 Guards SPR – 18/6 ISU-122
257 Tank Regiment – 11/1 M4A2, 2/0 Mk-3
17 Self-Propelled Battalion – 7/3 SU-76
28 SPB – 6/3 SU-76
298 SPB – 5/4 SU-76
154 SPB – 7/2
397 SPB – 7/4 SU-76
97 SPB – 3/2 SU-76
121 SPB – 6/3 SU-76
48 SPB – 4/2 SU-76
406 SPB – 4/2 SU-76
Total 104/41

5 Shock Army
220 Tank Brigade – 51/12 T-34, 41/14 ISU-122
11 Guards Tank Brigade – 52/23 IS
67 Guards TBr – 97/33 IS
396 Guards SPR – 15/3 ISU-152
92 Engineer Tank Regiment – 5/0 T-34
1504 SPR - 7/4 SU-76
Self-propelled battalions/rifle divisions – 32/8 SU-76
Total 300/97

8 Guards Army
7 Guards Tank Brigade – 96/39 IS
34 Guards Tank Regiment – 25/13 IS
65 Tank Regiment – 13/8 T-34
259 Tank Regiment – 28/7 T-34
1200 SPR – 14/14 SU-76
1087 SPR – 9/6 SU-76
1061 SPR – 6/5 SU-76
694 SPR – 15/13 SU-76
394 Guards SPR – 16/11 ISU-152
371 Guards SPR – 25/17 SU-76
Total 247/133

1 Polish Army
4 Tank Regiment – 6/3 IS
13 SPR – 9/4 SU-85, 8/2 ISU-152
2 and 3 SPB – 4/3 SU-76
70 SPB – 2/1 SU-57
Total 29/13

1 Guards Tank Army
8 Guards Mechanized Corps – 125/64 T-34, 24/7 IS, 12/6 SU-100, 9/2 SU-85, 16/8 SU-76
11 Guards Tank Corps – 171/101 T-34, 6/3 ISU-152, 5/2 SU-100, 8/1 SU-85, 15/8 SU-76
64 Guards Tank Brigade – 28/17 T-34
11 Guards Tank Regiment – 9/5 IS
19 Self-Propelled Brigade – 1/1 T-34, 5/3 SU-57
Other units – 2/2 T-34
Total 436/230

2 Guards Tank Army
1 Mechanized Corps – 208/53 M4A2, 4/2 SU-76, 8/1 SU-85, 14/4 ISU-122
9 Guards Tank Corps – 109/49 T-34, 7/3 ISU-122, 7/3 SU-100, 4/1 SU-76
12 Guards Tank Corps – 180/84 T-34, 11/4 SU-100, 9/3 SU-76, 9/4 IS
6 Guards Tank Regiment – 5/3
16 Motorcycle Battalion – 1/0
Total 576/214

11 Tank Corps – 209/66 T-34, 22/4 SU-85/100, 20/4 IS, 8/2 SU-76
Total 259/76

9 Tank Corps
23 Tank Brigade – 80/24 T-34
95 Tank Brigade – 85/18 T-34
108 Tank Brigade – 73/20 T-34
36 Guards Tank Regiment – 22/3 IS, 5/0 ISU-122
1455 SPR – 7/2 SU-100, 8/1 SU-76
1508 SPR – 16/9 SU-76, 2/1 SU-57
1049 SPR – 12/4 SU-100
Total 310/82

2 Guards Cavalry Corps
184 Tank Regiment – 2/2 T-34
189 TR – 3/3 Mk-3
160 TR – 3/0 M4A2
1459 SPR – 1/0 SU-76
Total 9/5

7 Guards Cavalry Corps
114 TR – 5/5 T-34
57 TR – 2/1 M4A2
32 TR – 2/1T-34
1816 SPR – 1/1 SU-76
Total 10/8

Total 1 Belorussian Front:
471/179 IS
1239/502 T-34
225/55 M4A2
109/34 ISU-152
125/38 ISU-122
91/28 SU-100
74/17 SU-85
490/243 SU-76
8/5 SU-57
5/3 Mk-3
Total 2823/1105

Jan-Hendrik
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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 23 Jan 2016 14:42

Thank you ver much!

Jan-Hendrik

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pintere
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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by pintere » 23 Jan 2016 14:56

These numbers seem about right. Thanks for sharing.

Between this and the other figures on the new Tiger thread, I was wondering if there are detailed loss stats for Russian armoured units in 1944 like this on that site. Are there?

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 24 Jan 2016 12:47

pintere wrote: Between this and the other figures on the new Tiger thread, I was wondering if there are detailed loss stats for Russian armoured units in 1944 like this on that site.
It depends on the individual case, uploaded docs are fragmented.

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by pintere » 25 Jan 2016 01:11

Art wrote:
pintere wrote: Between this and the other figures on the new Tiger thread, I was wondering if there are detailed loss stats for Russian armoured units in 1944 like this on that site.
It depends on the individual case, uploaded docs are fragmented.
Can you check this kill claim?

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=215545

It concerns the losses of the 11th Tank Corps on 7 & 8 July 1944. According the the reports by the 5th SS Panzer division, it destroyed 103 tanks of this unit for minimal loss on those days.

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by GregSingh » 25 Jan 2016 05:44

Can you check this kill claim?
viewtopic.php?t=215545
It concerns the losses of the 11th Tank Corps on 7 & 8 July 1944. According the the reports by the 5th SS Panzer division, it destroyed 103 tanks of this unit for minimal loss on those days.
Let's post what we can find in the relevant section.
I already made a start for 11th Tank Corps at http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=215545
If we become increasingly humble about how little we know, we may be more eager to search.

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by pintere » 25 Jan 2016 14:20

GregSingh wrote:
Can you check this kill claim?
viewtopic.php?t=215545
It concerns the losses of the 11th Tank Corps on 7 & 8 July 1944. According the the reports by the 5th SS Panzer division, it destroyed 103 tanks of this unit for minimal loss on those days.
Let's post what we can find in the relevant section.
I already made a start for 11th Tank Corps at http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=215545
Thanks!

Art
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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 27 Jan 2016 09:23

For comparison operational armor in the 1 BF on the evening of 13 April 1945

1 Polish Army
4 Heavy Tank Regiment – 14 IS
13 Self-Propelled Regiment – 9 ISU-152, 11 SU-85, total 20
7 Self-Propelled Battalion – 7 SU-57
Separate Recon Battalion – 2 T-70
1, 2, 3, 4 Self-Propelled Battalions – 26 SU-76
Total 69: 14 IS, 2 T-70, 9 ISU-152, 11 SU-85, 26 SU-76,7 SU-57

61 Army
312 SPR- 21 SU-76
1811 SPR – 21 SU-76
1899 SPR – 11 SU-76
Total 53 SU-76

47 Army
70 Guards Tank Regiment – 19 IS
344 Guards SPR – 20 ISU-122
1204 SPR – 10 SU-76
1416 SPR – 17 SU-76
1892 SPR – 12 SU-76
1825 SPR – 19 SU-85
Total 97: 19 IS, 20 ISU-152, 19 SU-85, 39 SU-76

3 Shock Army
1729 SPR – 21 SU-76
1203 SPR – 21 SU-76
1728 SPR – 20 SU-76
85 Tank Regiment – 1 IS, 10 T-34
88 Guards Tank Regiment – 2
351 Guards SPR – 21 ISU-152
1818 SPR – 8 SU-85, 13 SU-76
Total 117: 3 IS, 10 T-34, 21 ISU-152, 8 SU-85, 62 SU-76

5 Shock Army
220 Tank Brigade – 27 T-34, 27 ISU-152
92 Tank Regiment – 15
396 Guards SPR – 21 ISU-152
67 Guards Tank Brigade – 65 IS
11 Guards Tank Brigade – 64 IS
1504 SPR – 21 SU-76
Nine self-propelled battalions in rifle divisions – 111 SU-76
Total 351: 129 IS, 42 T-34, 21 ISU-152, 27 ISU-122, 132 SU-76

8 Guards Army
11 Tank Corps – 21 IS, 152 T-34, 15 SU-100, 6 SU-85, 21 SU-76, total 215
7 Guards Tank Brigade – 65 IS
65 Tank Regiment – 21 T-34
34 Guards Tank Regiment – 21 IS
259 Tank Regiment – 10 T-34
394 Guards SPR – 21 ISU-152
1061 SPR – 21 SU-76
1087 SPR – 13 SU-76
1200 SPR – 21 SU-76
371 Guards SPR – 21 SU-76
694 SPR – 16 SU-76
Total 445: 107 IS, 183 T-34, 21 ISU-152, 15 SU-100, 6 SU-85, 113 SU-76

69 Army
68 Tank Brigade – 48 T-34, 15 ISU-152
33 Guards Tank Regiment – 24 IS
344 Guards SPR – 23 IS
1205 SPR – 20 SU-76
1206 SPR – 20 SU-76
1221 SPR – 19 Su-76
12 Self-Propelled Brigade – 4 T-34, 4 T-70, 52 SU-76
89 Guards Tank Regiment – 22 IS
Total 247: 69 IS, 48 T-34, 4 T-70, 15 ISU-152, 111 SU-76

33 Army
257 Tank Regiment – 9 M4A2, 3 Mk
360 Guards SPR – 24 ISU-152
361 Guards SPR – 24 ISU-122
Nine self-propelled battalion in divisions – 97 SU-76
Total 157: 9 M4A2, 3 MK, 23 ISU-152, 24 ISU-122, 97 SU-76

1 Guards Tank Army – 1 IS, 268 T-34, 21 ISU-122, 21 SU-100, 8 SU-85, 33 SU-76, 76 SU-57, total 468
2 Guards Tank Army – 32 IS, 282 T-34, 177 M4A2, 40 ISU-122, 46 SU-100, 12 SU-85, 56 SU-76, total 645
2 Guards Cavalry Corps – 21 T-34, 21 M4A2, 17 Mk, 41 SU-76, total 100
7 Guards Cavalry Corps – 10 T-34, 1 T-70, 18 M4A2, 21 SU-76, total 50

Front’s Reserve
9 Tank Corps – 13 IS, 36 T-34, 6 SU-100, 11 SU-85, 25 SU-76, total 91
244 Tank Corps – no tanks
1049 SPR – 18 SU-100
Total 109: 13 IS, 36 T-34, 27 SU-100, 11 SU-85, 25 SU-76

Total operational 2903: 437 IS, 900 T-34, 7 T-70, 229 M4A2, 17 Mk, 111 ISU-152, 132 ISU-122, 133 SU-100, 58 SU-85, 809 SU-76, 83 SU-57. Plus 129 tanks and SP guns in repair (without breakdown by types)
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/dou/?docID=152125907

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 01 Nov 2016 20:38

Personnel casualties of the 1 Ukrainian Front in April 1945
Killed in action - 20 050
Wounded - 74 339
Missing in action - 2 404
Other (non-battle) - 8 483
Total 105 276.
Source: appendix to the war diary of the 1 UF (TsAMO RF, f.236, op.2673, d.2583, l.314)

Personnel casualties 1 UF 10-20.04.45 (A. Isaev, 2007 with reference to TsAMO RF, f.236, op.2673, d.2508, l.41)
Killed - 6 024
Wounded - 25 204
Missing - 310
Sick and other - 2 925
Total 34 447 men

Personnel casualties 1 UF 20-30.04.45
(A.Isaev with reference to TsAMO RF, f.236, op.2673, d.2508, l.44)
Killed - 11 608
Wounded - 42 711
Missing - 1 967
Sick and other - 2 925
Total 59 211 men

One can calculate from the numbers above that casualties in ten days 1-10 April were about 12 000 including 9 000 battle casualties, which seems a reasonable number.

Casualties of the 1 Ukrainian Front 1-10 May 1945:
Killed - 5 086
Wounded - 15 774
Missing - 1 890
Other - 2 647
Total 25 397 men.
Source: appendix to the war diary of 1 Ukrainian Front (TsAMO RF, f.236, op. 2673, d. 2617, l.191)
That includes a considerable backlog from the previous period (see the number of missing, for example).

Sum of casualties in a month 10 April - 10 May 1945:
Killed - 22 718
Wounded - 83 689
Missing - 4 167
Others - 8 481
Total 119 055
That must include Berlin and Prague operations, and also fighting in Breslau and Silesia.

For comparison from Krivosheev ("Soviet casualties and combat losses") 1 UF losses in the Berlin strategic operation (16.4-8.5.45) were 27 580 irrevocable and 86 245 medical, total 113 825 men. 1 UF losses in the Prague offesnive operation (6-11.5.45) - 6 384 irrevocable and 16 999 medical, total 23 383. Sum of both operations - 33 964 irrevocable and 103 244 medical, total 137 208 men.
Conclusion: Kirvosheev's numbers are too high and must involve some double counting. Kirvosheev's stats for the Berlin operation look like casualties of the entire 1 Ukrainian Front From 15 April to 10 May 1945, which means a certain overestimation (inclusion of losses in Silesia, Czechia and Breslau).

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Re: Battle of Berlin: Soviet losses.

Post by Art » 01 Nov 2016 20:50

From the same source (1 UF war diary) armor losses from 16 April to 5 May 1945 were 593 tanks and 259 SP guns, total 852 (write-offs). Armor losses 10-20 April - 179 tanks and 85 SP guns, total 264 (Isaev).

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