Warsaw Uprising

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Piotr Kapuscinski
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Warsaw Uprising

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 04 Aug 2007 20:28

This year, we have 63rd anniversary of Warsaw Uprising. On 1st August, 63 years have just past from the beggining of the Rising - the Rising itself lasted for 63 days of fight - from 1st August to 2nd October 1944.

A lot of official and semi-official actions are taking place now in Warsaw, we'll try to post some interesting links and photos about what had happened and about the Raising itself.

Here is link to some songs that were composed during Warsaw Uprising and were sung during Warsaw Uprising:

http://www.warsawuprising.com/songs.htm

Now some info and statistic numbers from Warsaw Uprising:

I. Both sides forces:

1st August 1944 - beggining of Warsaw Rising:

Polish Home Army - 32,000 troops (18,000 in "front" units)
German forces - 15 - 16,000 troops

Maximum number of appriachable soldiers in one moment (different moments for both sides ofc):

Polish Home Army - 45 - 46,000 troops
German forces - More than 40,000 troops

Estimate total number of troops that took part in Warsaw Uprising:

Polish Home Army - 50 - 60,000 troops
German forces - At least 100,000 (many units fought in Warsaw only for few days or even few hours - they were in Warsaw only transitory, during they march from East Front towards western Poland)

II. Both sides losses:

German casualties in Warsaw Uprising:

- 10,000 KIA
- 7,000 MIA
- 9,000 WIA
- 2,000 to 5,000 POWs (most of them in few first days of the Rising) - after captured, some of them died, some of them were missed and had never been found, some of them were killed during bombardments

- 3 airplanes
- 310 tanks / self-propelled artillery / armored cars
- 4 rocket launchers
- 22 caliber 75mm artillery guns
- 340 trucks and cars

Polish casualties in Warsaw Uprising:

I. Home Army:

- More than 9,000 KIA (including some murdered troops)
- 6,200 to 9,000 MIA (including some murdered troops)
- 8,000 WIA

These figures includes:

- 6 killed Lieutenants
- 13 killed Lieutenant Colonels
- 42 killed Majors
- at least 92 killed Captains

Names - "imię", surnames - "nazwisko", or nicknames - "pseudonim" of 9,000 Home Army troops, of troops who lost their lives during Uprising, are known and You can find them here: http://www.1944.pl/index.php?a=site_wall&STEP=01

15,000 Polish Home Army troops capitulated to the Germans after the end of Rising (including 900 officers, 2,000 women). Another 6,000 Home Army troops went out of Warsaw with civilians. Rest of survivors escaped from Warsaw (most of them to Kampinos Forest) and continued their fight. Also some of civilians escaped from the city with Home Army troops.

II. Berling's Army (units from Polish Army in the East), while helping Warsaw's Home Army, lost:

- 5,556 killed and wounded:

- In Żoliborz and Czerniaków (left bank Warsaw) - 2,297 KIA, 1,467 WIA from 9. Infantry Regiment (3. Infantry Division) and 6. Infantry Regiment (2. Infantry Division)
- While fighting in Praga (right bank Warsaw), between 10. and 14 September 1944 - 1792 KIA and WIA from 1. Infantry Division

Berling's Army didn't manage to dislodge Germans from the city, Berling's troops got to the left bank of Vistula, but after heavy fighting they had to withdraw from their bridgeheads on Czerniaków and Żoliborz.

III. Civilian losses:

At the beggining of the Rising, Warsaw had 920,000 (200,000 in Praga, 720,000 in left bank Warsaw) to 1,150,000 inhabitants

- 120,000 to 180,000 civilians were killed / murdered / died of wounds - 63,000 of them were murdered by Germans

Most of those murderred people (63,000 murderred civilians and murderred troops) were murderred by:

- SS-Sturmbrigade RONA
- Sicherheitspolizei Einsatzkommandos and Sonderkommandos from SS-Gruppenführer Heinz Reinefarth's Combat Group and other units
- Dirlewanger's Units
- 2 x Verbrennungskommando (these units were burning murderred civilians corpses)
- Schutzpolizei
- Panzer-Parachute Division "Hermann Göring"
- 25. Panzer Division (in Marymont)
- 19. Panzer Division

500,000 to 700,000 civilians were expelled from the city after the end of Rising - 55,000 to 60,000 of them were sent to concentration and death camps (13,000 of them to Auschwitz).

IV. Other losses:

- 10,455 buildings, 923 historical buildings (94%), the highest scyscrapper in Warsaw - "Prudential" (66 m to the roof), 25 churches, 14 libraries including the National Library, 81 elementary schools, 64 high schools, Warsaw University and Polytechnic buildings, most of the monuments - were destroyed.

After the end of the Rising remaining buildings were systematically destroying (German troops were ordered to destroy all that remained)

During the Rising 25% city buildings were destroyed, after the Rising Germans destroyed 35% buildings. During September Campaign 10% buildings had been destroyed. During Getto Uprising 15%. At the end of the war 85% of Warsaw buildings were destroyed - on the left bank of river Vistula higher percent of the buildings perished, than in Praga.

PaŁacyk Michla: - http://www.warsawuprising.com/songs.htm - choose "Play MediaPlayer"

Original Version (below is translated version):

Pałacyk Michla, Żytnia, Wola
Bronią jej chłopcy od 'Parasola'.
Choć na 'tygrysy' mają visy –
To warszawiaki, fajne chłopaki są!

Czuwaj wiara i wytężaj słuch,
Pręż swój młody duch,
Pracując za dwóch!
Czuwaj wiara i wytężaj słuch,
Pręż swój młody duch jak stal!

A każdy chłopak chce być ranny,
Sanitariuszki – morowe panny.
A gdy cię kula trafi jaka,
Poprosisz pannę – da ci buziaka – hej!

Czuwaj wiara...

Z tyłu za linią dekowniki,
Intendentura, różne umrzyki,
Gotują zupę, czarną kawę,
I tym sposobem - walczą za sprawę - hej!

Czuwaj wiara...

Za to dowództwo jest morowe,
bo w pierwszej linii nadstawia głowę,
a najmorowszy z przełożonych,
to jest nasz "Miecio" w kółko golony - hej!

Czuwaj wiara...

Wiara się bije, wiara śpiewa,
Szkopy się złoszczą, krew ich zalewa,
Różnych sposobów się imają,
Co chwila "szafę" nam posyłają - hej!

Czuwaj wiara...

Lecz na nic "szafa" i granaty,
za każdym razem dostają baty
i co dzień się przybliża chwila,
że zwyciężymy! i do cywila - hej!

Czuwaj wiaro i wytężaj słuch ...


Translation:

(Pałacyk = tiny Palace, Żytnia = street in Warsaw, Wola = district in Warsaw, ViS = polish pistol, "szafa" / "wardrobe" = kind of German armored vehicle)

Pałacyk Michla, Żytnia, Wola
It's defended by guys from "Parasol",
Though they have only ViSes for Tigers -
They are Warsawians, best guys they are!

Be on the alert and strain your hearing,
Be always strong,
Working as two men!
Be on the alert and strain your hearing,
Be always strong as steel!

And every boy wants to be wounded,
Cause our nurses - gorgeous ladies
And if a bloody bullet hit you,
Ask gently lady - she will kiss you - hey!

Be on the alert...

Behind the lines only marauders,
Commisariat, different deceaseds,
They cook some soup & drink black coffee -
And this way they fight for cause - hey!

Be on the alert...

But our commanders are gorgeous,
Because they fight on the first line!
And the most gorgeous from commanders,
Is our "Miecio", who cut all his hair - hey!

Be on the alert...

People are fighting, People are singing,
Jerries are angry, their blood is up,
They're trying diiferent tricks,
Each minute they send a "wardrobe" to us - hey!

Be on the alert...

But their "wardrobe" and grenades are nothing,
Each time, they got a scolding!
And every day it's closer and closer,
Our victory - then we'll be back homes - hey!

Be on the alert...


Warsaw's Children:

No defeat will break freeman,
No difficulty will fear braveman,
We'll go together to the victory,
When people will stand arm to arm

Warsaw's children we're going to strike,
For every stone of you, capital we will fight
Warsaw's children we're going to strike,
When your order will come,
We'll send enemies our fury!

Powiśle, Wola and Mokotów,
Every street, every house,
When the first shot come, be ready,
Like a golden bolt in the hand of God.

...
Last edited by Piotr Kapuscinski on 05 Aug 2007 18:16, edited 9 times in total.

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 04 Aug 2007 20:50

Only for few years we really celebrate Warsaw Uprising anniversaries and we talk a lot about this event - many of Rising combatants from Polish Home Army have beeen awarded just this year. We are "free" nation since 1989, but we didnt talk so much about the Rising itself, and Polish Underground resistance 10 years ago. Memory and Knowledge about the Rising is blowing just now - not only in Poland but also in other countries.

After the end of War - in 1945 - when Poland was liberated by RKKA, Polish Home Army troops were persecuted by Stalin, Soviet's NKWD, Polish communist's UB. Many of them died in Gulags at Siberia, many of them died in Polish communistic prisons. After the death of Joseph Stalin, persecuting stopped, but Home Army troops were still supervised on their every step. It was dangerous to speak a lot about the Rising, it was dangerous to write a lot about the Rising, it was dangerous to celebrate Rising anniversaries. Celebrating people were supervised by SB (celebrating = visiting killed soldiers graves, nothing more). In our schools most of teachers teach about Home Army troops as about Terrorists - those teachers who teached the truth - were dismissed from their work. In early 80's Government attention went to "Solidarność", so at least more could be said about the Rising - but real freedom of the word begun in 1989, and then all people were told the thruth about the Rising - and all combatants became national heroes.

Except of things i have written above, Warsaw Uprising was a significant event because only memory about heroes from Warsaw, and memory about fact that Stalin didn't help us although Soviet radio communicates, that were calling people of Warsaw to begin Uprising - were buoing up people who fight against communism, were maintaining Polish resistance against communism and Soviet Union.

Warsaw Uprising - short period of time, when the Independent Poland with its Army, its Songs, its Government and its Poems existed on the ruins of Warsaw - was the greatest inspiration to many of "Solidarność" members.

If there hadn't been Warsaw Uprising, maybe Warsaw Pact and Soviet Union would still exist :wink: .

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Musashi
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Post by Musashi » 05 Aug 2007 16:30

Domen121 wrote:I. Both sides forces:

1st August 1944 - beggining of Warsaw Rising:

Polish Home Army - 32,000 troops (18,000 in "front" units)
German forces - 15 - 16,000 troops
You forgot to add the insurgents had just 5000 pistols and far less than 1000 rifles at the beginning.
Domen121 wrote:German casualties in Warsaw Uprising:

- 10,000 KIA
- 7,000 MIA
- 9,000 WIA
- 2,000 to 5,000 POWs (most of them in few first days of the Rising) - after captured, some of them died, some of them were missed and had never been found, some of them were killed during bombardments[...]
And some German PoWs were murdered (the insurgents used to murder SS troops, members of Gestapo, RONA and Schutzpolizei).

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 05 Aug 2007 19:15

German forces - 15 - 16,000 troops
On 1st August they had 15 - 16,000 in left bank Warsaw, but also 4,000 in Praga district - so they had 19 - 20,000 all together.

And Polish forces were 32 to 36,500
And some German PoWs were murdered (the insurgents used to murder SS troops, members of Gestapo, RONA and Schutzpolizei).
Yes, you are right - some of them were murderred - but i think killed, died, murdered POWs are included into MIA / KIA number
You forgot to add the insurgents had just 5000 pistols and far less than 1000 rifles at the beginning.
They had 2,629 rifles but on 1st August they used only 1,000 - because of some problems with supplying units, problems with mobilization because lack of time (they had only 12 hours for mobilization) and some mistakes that were made (they could wait one day with beggining of the Rising - untill morning of 2nd August - and they would have much more equipment ready to fight on the first day - then they would cause bigger losses to German forces in few first hours and push-out Germans from more parts of Warsaw)

They also had at the beggining of Uprising, on 1st August:

- 145 LMGs (60 were used on the first day of the Rising)
- 47 HMGs (7 were used on the first day)
- 657 Machine Pistols (300 were used on the first day)
- 29 AT rifles (all had been used since first hour of fighting)
- some PIATs (6 of them were used on first day)
- 2 AT guns
- 16 mortars and howitzers
- 44 387 grenades (25,000 were in soldiers hands, ready to use on 1st August - ofc not all of them were used on 1st August)
- 12,000 "Molotov Coctails"
- 1,300 kg of different explosive materials

But in fact they had even more armament, but in July 1944 Germans arrested many important Home Army persons, and contact to many of Home Army magazines had been lost (because only that persons had known about those magaiznes).

For example, in 1947 near street Leszno, 678 STENs and "Błyskawica's" Machine Pistols were found in old magazine, as well as 60,000 ammo to them. On July 1944 Germans also destroyed some Polish magazines - 78,000 grenades and 170 flame-throwers were lost (some historians say that this numbers are enlarged by communist propaganda, or even that there wasn't any magazine found in 1947).

But even facing so many problems, insurgents managed to push-out German forces from more than half of the city and liberate it. They also captured few thousands prisoners and caused havy casualties to Germans during first days of fighting - ofc later Germans were also suffering very heavy casualties, but every day Polish casualties were higher.
Last edited by Piotr Kapuscinski on 06 Aug 2007 12:01, edited 1 time in total.

mars
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Post by mars » 05 Aug 2007 22:20

Domen121, you mentioned German losses in the Warsaw uprising were:
10,000 KIA
- 7,000 MIA
- 9,000 WIA
- 2,000 to 5,000 POWs (most of them in few first days of the Rising) - after captured, some of them died, some of them were missed and had never been found, some of them were killed during bombardments

those number looks like too high, according to SS Obergruppenführer Emil von dem Bach-zelewski, German losses were 73 officers and 1453 NCOs and soldiers were killed, 242 officers, 8196NCOs and soldiers Wounded

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Musashi
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Post by Musashi » 05 Aug 2007 23:29

mars wrote: those number looks like too high, according to SS Obergruppenführer Emil von dem Bach-zelewski, German losses were 73 officers and 1453 NCOs and soldiers were killed, 242 officers, 8196NCOs and soldiers Wounded
Don't these losses appear to be too small for you, how for a 63-day battle described as "tougher than the battle of Stalingrad" by some German soldiers? I wonder if Emil [Erich?] von dem Bach-Zelewski included not only all the branches of the German army to the statistics, but also RONA and other Hiwis. Besides was such a unit as Dirlewanger's composed of criminals classified as "army" by German sources?
You have an article about the uprising in Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warsaw_Uprising
I don't pretend to call Wikipedia the most credible source on the Earth ;)
Last edited by Musashi on 06 Aug 2007 10:48, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Benoit Douville » 06 Aug 2007 02:59

Today August 5th was the blackest day during the 1944 Warsaw Uprising:

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... ght=august

Regards

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 10:29

Hi mars,

Same man - Emil von dem Bach-Żelewski, in 1947, after the end of war said that all German (and foreign in German Army) units which were fighting in Uprising lost 10,000 KIA, 7,000 MIA and 9,000 WIA

Remember that some of those losses Germans suffered during fights with regular Polish Army - Berling's Army.

Berling's Army lost on the left bank Warsaw (they crossed Vistula and were fighting on the left bank!) - in Żoliborz and Czerniaków bridgeheads - 2,297 dead and 1,467 WIA - soldiers from Berling's Army were fighting on the Western bank of Vistula for 8 long days and nights - after 8 days last of them withdrawed to the right bank or joined Home Army forces

Berling decised to help Warsaw on his own - because he didnt have order to help Warsaw - he had order NOT to help Warsaw! But he and his soldiers were Poles, so they couldnt just wait and do nothing, looking at burning Warsaw

On Praga, between 10. and 14. September, Berling's Army lost another 1792 dead and WIA

So total German all units losses of 9,000 WIA and KIA men are for shure not the right figure
those number looks like too high, according to SS Obergruppenführer Emil von dem Bach-zelewski, German losses were 73 officers and 1453 NCOs and soldiers were killed, 242 officers, 8196NCOs and soldiers Wounded
Figures that Erich von dem Bach gave to Himmler in his letter (73 KIA officers, 1453 KIA NCOs and soldiers, 44 KIA foreigners in German Army, 242 WIA officers, 7,054 WIA soldiers, 178 WIA foreigners - total 9044 casualties) were given on Himmler's desk on 5th October 1944 - in such short time after the end of Uprising, it was impossible to establish all units losses - first reason is that many of German POWs were liberated just on 5th or 6th October - when last Polish units left Warsaw - so von dem Bach couldnt know what happened with German POWs till the last hours! Why didnt he write anything about POWs and MIAs in his letter to Himmler?

Second thing is that what Musashi wrote:
Don't these losses appear to be too small for you, how for a 63-day battle described as "tougher than the battle of Stalingrad" by some German soldiers? I wonder if Erich von dem Bach-Zalewski included not only all the branches of the German army to the statistics, but also RONA and other Hiwis. Besides was such a unit as Dirlewanger's composed of criminals classified as "army" by German sources?
I think he even didnt include all branches of the Army - he probably included only some of units that participated in Uprising and still were in Warsaw on 5th October - or he just lied about casualties and decreased them - even if he didnt lie, he just couldnt know exact casualties of all units, including MIA, POWs, KIA, WIA, died of wounds, etc. - it was to early after the end of Uprising when he wrote his letter - in the morning on 5th October many thousands of Home Army soldiers were in the city, as well as German POWs and Home Army commanders (Home Army headquarters were still giving orders to their units on 5th October, although casefire were signed on 2nd October!!!)

Third thing is that MOST PART of units which participated in Uprising, when the Uprising finally ended, were far away from Warsaw - in western Poland. But their MIAs, POWs and corpses of their troops were still in Warsaw!

Next thing is that von dem Bach was a bandit and a lier who tried to hide many facts about the Rising before his commanders, and - especcialy - BRITISH AND AMERICAN public opinion - because American and British commanders declared that if German Army will still murder Polish Home Army soldiers and Polish civilians, they will do same thing with German POWs. They had declared this in half of September 1944, but German soldiers were still murdering and burning all on their way - but von dem Bach tried to hide this - tried to hide scale of German war crimes before his commanders and before Allies.

His letter to Himmler cant be valuable because he didnt mention about MIA and POWs in it - and its impossible that German army hadnt got MIAs during Uprising - we also know that few thousands of German troops were captured by Poles during Uprising - mainly during first few days.

Many of German soldiers who were captured by Berling's soldiers in Praga were probably taken to Siberia and returned home after the end of the war or never returned...

Regards
Last edited by Piotr Kapuscinski on 06 Aug 2007 15:25, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 11:43

Home Army had also some AFVs - some of them they captured and some of them they made.

Home Army made AFV "Kubuś" ("James") - it was made during only 13 days of Uprising, by two Polish engineers - Walerian Bieliecki "Jan" ("John") and Edmund Frydrych "Kaczka" ("Duck"). Home Army soldiers also captured many German Army AFVs and were using them succesfully against old owners.

"Kubuś" photographs:

http://wilk.wpk.p.lodz.pl/~whatfor/poja ... _kubus.htm

Some of Armored Fighting Vehicles which were captured and were used as AFVs by Home Army, were

Sd.Kfz.251/1 Ausf.D captured from SS "Viking" Panzer Division on 14. August 1944 on Bartoszewicza street, while it was transporting heavilly wounded German soldiers - it was called by Poles "Jaś" ("Johnny")
Pz.Kpfw. V "Panther" Ausf. G Sd.Kfz. 171
Pz.Kpfw. V "Panther" - "Pudel" ("Poodle")
Pz.Kpfw. V "Panther" - "Zośka"
Pz.Kpfw. VI "Tiger" (it was damaged very quickly after captured - by young Polish scout who was ordered to guard it... and started to play it...)
Pz.Kpfw. IV Ausf. H - Sd.Kfz. 161/2
Jagdpanzer 38(t) "Hetzer" - "Chwat" ("Budy")
Sd.Kfz. 251/1 Ausf. D - "Szary Wilk" ("Grey Wolf")
Sd.Kfz. 251/1 Ausf. D - "Starówka"
Panzerspäwagen BA 202(r)
Schwere Ladungsträger B IV (Borgward) Sd.Kfz. 301 Ausf. C
Russian BA-20 (captured from old Czechoslovakian embassy)
Many different armored cars from banks (before Uprising they were used by Germans to transport money or gold)

Many of captured AFVs were not used because they were damaged or destroyed - if captured AFV wasn't able to move - Home Army soldiers were taking every part of its equipment (including its gun)- and everything that could be taken and could be usefull - and were burning and destroying rest of it - simple.

Also many other heavy equipment were captured, for example some heavy artillery guns.

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 16:28

On 4th August 2007 in Warsaw a Historical Reconstruction of Home Army fights in Czerniaków district took place.

Here is link to Fotoreportage about this interesting event: http://www.prawy.pl/?dz=galeria&cat=276

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Post by mars » 06 Aug 2007 16:44

Domen121, Bach-Zelewski was charged with put down the Warsaw uprising in the Warsaw city, so the battle with Gen Berlin's Troops was not his reponsibility, and those German units fought Gen Berlin's troops were not under his command, the German losses in this part of fighout would not appear in his report.
I also doubt that in the mordern time, an military unit as large as an Army could be able to launch an attack without aprove of his superior, whe
re did he got ammunition and logistics support, did he need artelley and airforce support ? unless you have some hard evidence
I do not know, I believe the traditional story that Berlin's attack was under order
I kind of agree with you that the statistics Bach-Zelewski may well be incomplete, but that was all we know now, though I will
be very interesting under what situation he provided the later German losses figuers at all German (and foreign in German Army)
units which were fighting in Uprising lost 10,000 KIA, 7,000 MIA and 9,000 WIA ? what is the source of this information ?

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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 17:43

Domen121, Bach-Zelewski was charged with put down the Warsaw uprising in the Warsaw city, so the battle with Gen Berlin's Troops was not his reponsibility, and those German units fought Gen Berlin's troops were not under his command, the German losses in this part of fighout would not appear in his report.
But Berling's troops fought against same German units as Home Army fought against (it was in the Warsaw city) - so how could von dem Bach recognize which German soldier had been killed by grenade or bullet of Home Army soldier and which German soldier had been killed by grenade or bullet of Berling's Army soldier?? And what if he was hit by 2 bullets - one from Berling's rifle, one from Home Army's rifle - and later he died in hospital? Who killed him then?

I think that was rather impossible to recognize that.

Another thing is that Bach-Żelewski was in Warsaw from 5th August, so he arrived to Warsaw when the battle had already been fought for 5 days.
I will be very interesting under what situation he provided the later German losses figuers at all German (and foreign in German Army) units which were fighting in Uprising lost 10,000 KIA, 7,000 MIA and 9,000 WIA ? what is the source of this information ?
No, it was not in "Polish prison" as many people think - and he hadnt have any reason to think that his life is endangerred, because when he was in Poland, he was protected by - i will call it so - "immunitet".

He was an American POW and a withness on a court trial of Warsaw province nazi gubernator - Ludwig Fischer - his life was protected by American guardians (he was cooperating with Americans - he gave them many evidences against such war criminalists like Himmler) - he was only "borrowed" by Poles from Americans to the short time of this court trail - later he came back to Germany to American's occupation area.

Von dem Bach was captured by Americans on 1st July 1945 - Polish Government demanded to give von dem Bach to their hands, but von dem Bach proposed that he will testify against Nazi war criminals in Nurnberg, if Americans don't give him into Polish hands.

And they didnt give him into Polish hands - he wasn't in Polish prison, he was in Warsaw only to testify here, in Polish courthouse.

After the end of the trial, Americans took them back to detention awating trial in Germany, where he was since he was captured. In 1949 he left his detention awaiting trial, and in 1951 he was convicted for 10 years in prison, but after few months his penalty was changed into house detention and he left prison.

In 1961 he was arrested again, because he took part in "Nacht der langen Messer" - this time he was convicted for 4,5 year in prison.

In 1962, while he was in prison, he was accused again, this time for murdering 6 German communists in 1933. After court trial he was convicted again - this time for life imprisonment.

He died in prison hospital in München-Harlaching on 8. March 1972

He had never been in Polish prison and he had never been punished for terrible crimes in Warsaw and killing 63,000 Polish civilians, which he is responded for.

So he provided that figures (10,000 KIA, 7,000 MIA, 9,000 WIA) on the court trial of nazi war criminalist - Ludwig Fischer in 1947, in Warsaw. When he provided them, he had American guardians sitting near him and watching for him. And he wasnt in Polish prison, he was save, his life wasn't endangerred, because he was a treator to his nazi-friends - he bought his life and his freedom from Americans by treating his old nazi "friends" and by giving evidences of their crimes to Americans.

He hadn't got any reason to lie when he provided that figures - he was more save than in 1944, when he was in SS. Probably if Himmler would know in 1944, that in Warsaw Uprising so many German soldiers lost their prescious lives, he would dismissed or convicted for dead commander who lead his soldiers for such a slaughter and who suffered so big losses while fighting with "Ubermanchen - Poles" with "no rifles" at the beggining.

Regards
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Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 17:59

Bach-Zelewski was charged with put down the Warsaw uprising in the Warsaw city
By the way - von dem Bach Żelewski was not charged to Warsaw Uprising - he wanted to go there and take command above German troops in Warsaw. He asked many times his commanders and he promised them that he will be extremly fast and efficient, that he will crush Home Army in few days.

Finally they let him to go to Warsaw where he got on 5th August. But he didint crush Uprising in few days - Uprising lasted for 63 days and costed him much more blood than he could bear - we can read about this in his diary "Kriegstagbuch" - von dem Bach after the end of war was comparising Warsaw Uprising with Battle of Stalingrad - so bloody for both sides it was.

Von dem Bach, wanted to avoid full compromitation (it was compromitation to him that he need 63 days to win in Warsaw) and that's why he probably decreased or falsed his units losses (or maybe he just "forgot" to write some important things...) in his letter to Himmler which was given to him on 5th October.

Regards

Piotr Kapuscinski
Host - Allied sections
Posts: 3724
Joined: 12 Jul 2006 19:17
Location: Poland

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 18:17

Von dem Bach sons and grandsons are still living in Germany and probably they are proud of "noble-credits for great Reich" that their father have done - he was never punished for crimes in Poland and in USRR (in USRR he murdered even more civilians than in Poland) so almost anybody knows that he was a criminalist.

Piotr Kapuscinski
Host - Allied sections
Posts: 3724
Joined: 12 Jul 2006 19:17
Location: Poland

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Aug 2007 18:39

This is very good site about Warsaw Uprising:

http://wilk.wpk.p.lodz.pl/~whatfor/

According to this site, German troops (including auxillary units, different kinds of polizei, SS, etc.) killed by Polish partizans (from Home Army and other organizations) in Warsaw before Uprising, from November 1943 to January 1944:

- November 1943 - 78 killed and 72 heavilly wounded German troops
- October 1943 - 15 killed and 67 heavilly wounded German troops
- December 1943 - 50 killed German troops
- January 1944 - 5 killed German troops
- February 1944 - 20 killed German troops
- March 1944 - 40 killed German troops
- April and May 1944 - 186 killed German troops, 310 killed men working in German service, 244 heavilly wounded men

Figures from February to May according to Ludwig Fischer, gubernator of Warsaw, report about casualties from first half of 1944.

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