11. Armee operatoin in Crimea in late 1941

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TheMarcksPlan
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Re: 11. Armee operatoin in Crimea in late 1941

Post by TheMarcksPlan » 05 Nov 2021 13:16

Art wrote:
05 Nov 2021 13:01
Addition for the period 29.10-11.11 - 11 687
(From NARA T312 R353, R417)
Is the 11,687 a late registration of PoW from unspecified days during 29.10 - 11.11?
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Re: 11. Armee operatoin in Crimea in late 1941

Post by TheMarcksPlan » 05 Nov 2021 13:32

Art wrote:That gives about 82 000 for the period from 17 October to 16 November 1941.
Art wrote:
22 Oct 2021 21:41
That's the number given in the KTB OKW: 100,658 POWs taken in Crimea begining from 21.09.1941 (apparently ending 16 November 1941).
https://archive.org/details/kriegstageb ... 0/mode/2up
TheMarcksPlan wrote:
17 Apr 2021 21:25
Image
So the OKW tabulation for a longer period of time is lower than the combination of 11A's tabulation plus HGS's estimate of 11A's haul from the Melitopol pocket - over a shorter period of time. Yet it was OKW who had to reduce their totals in December 1941. Clusterfuck.

I'm not yet relieved of my suspicion that OKW "corrected" its figures in December 1941 to hide half a million PoW deaths.
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Re: 11. Armee operatoin in Crimea in late 1941

Post by Art » 06 Nov 2021 16:05

TheMarcksPlan wrote:
05 Nov 2021 13:32
So the OKW tabulation for a longer period of time is lower than the combination of 11A's tabulation plus HGS's estimate of 11A's haul from the Melitopol pocket - over a shorter period of time.
And why it should be larger? Both the war diary and the report of the 11 Army to the AGS said that 100,600 POWs werre taken in Crimea alone, so the Melitopol pocket was not included.
Overquartemaster's reports yield somewhat different tally, but not the difference is not critical.

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Re: 11. Armee operatoin in Crimea in late 1941

Post by TheMarcksPlan » 06 Nov 2021 16:32

Art wrote:
06 Nov 2021 16:05
TheMarcksPlan wrote:
05 Nov 2021 13:32
So the OKW tabulation for a longer period of time is lower than the combination of 11A's tabulation plus HGS's estimate of 11A's haul from the Melitopol pocket - over a shorter period of time.
And why it should be larger? Both the war diary and the report of the 11 Army to the AGS said that 100,600 POWs werre taken in Crimea alone, so the Melitopol pocket was not included.
Overquartemaster's reports yield somewhat different tally, but not the difference is not critical.
Ah you're right. I read the OKW tabulation as for 11th Army instead of for the Crimea specifically.
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