Panzer-Regiment 5; Panzers Damaged/Destroyed

[ClintHardware]

For the weeks March - May 13th 1941 I have been collating a table of figures for the above and have produced three columns. The columns have a row for each incident where some level of damage was mentioned/witnessed/claimed.

The columns (A - C) are completely independent of each other (i.e. figures must not be totalled across rows) and have the column headings are:
Panzer Behaviour Indicating Significant Damage (A)
Description indicates Panzers Probably Destroyed (B)
German records of panzers destroyed (C)

Is anyone interested in seeing the data?

[Alanmccoubrey]

I'd be interested to know what "Panzer Behaviour Indicating Significant Damage " means and how you discovered it.

[Urmel]

Sure.

[ClintHardware]

The three column headings were roughed out by me to describe how they were found in witness statements and war records. I am not trying to defend the column headings or what they have listed because the data is to promote discussion only and to record what was stated and might not necessarily be the actual case.

So for instance: if an eye witness states that he was party to engulfing a panzer with petrol bombs and it stopped and no crew got out, it tends to indicate a loss of 1 in column Panzer Behaviour Indicating Significant Damage (A) and 1 in column Description indicates Panzers Probably Destroyed (B). BUT where no German record seems to account for it the third column (C) is left blank. This is why the data can not be counted across the rows.

Going from the 24th March 1941 - 13th May the three columns totalled at: (A) 79 or 80, (B) 63 and (C) 34.

I put the table together because I wanted to work out the possible panzer state of Panzer Abteilung Hohmann when it met the troop of 25-Pdrs from the 4th RHA under the command of Major Goschen on the 13th May. On that ocassion the witness statement was: “No.2 gun definitely knocked a turret off a tank at very short range.”

[nmao]

Hello.
A few years ago i did something similiar in paper, using Jentz and and a few other sources...lets see if i can find it.

Meanwhile i'd love to see your data!

regards,

-nuno

[ClintHardware]

Hi nmao

I began with Jentz and went on to everything I could find. I will post a few days at a time.

Any ideas how to post a word table on here and keep the columns aligned?

Regards
J

[Urmel]

I take screenshots and post those.

[ClintHardware]

First Chunk attached as PDF. Covers 24th - 31st March

[Urmel]

Okay, I now see what you're trying to do. Very interesting, and good luck.

[ClintHardware]

OK Here are all the losses 24th March - 13th May 1941

I am very keen to know of any problems you can find with the incidents and totals.

What interests me is that these are in addition to the Werkstatt Report that Jentz quotes and indicate that for Panzer Abteilung Hohmann to have had a worth while number of panzers to move to the border in early May, the werkstatt kompanie must had made a very good job of repair and cannabalising non-runners.

The most contentious column is column A.

10th April is Von Prittwitz's attack. Corrected14th April total seen stopped or knocked out to 33

[ClintHardware]

Just to let you know, I have updated and added to the list and it will be an appendix in my soon to be printed book:

Infantry Artillery and Tank Combat in Libya and Egypt: Volume I:
A detailed fighting account of 2nd Armoured Division, 9th Australian Division, 7th Support Group and 22nd Guards Brigade in combat with the Afrikakorps, Ariete, Brescia and Trento Divisions: February – May 1941

My wife is confident no one will read it. And so am I.

[Urmel]

The ladies normally have more sense than us.

[ClintHardware]

Sadly yes.

[ClintHardware]

Here is another panzer casualty on the 14th April 1941 that may have been overlooked. Having got so near RHQ 107th RHA I don't think it could be recovered - but I have no evidence it did not:

Major Robert Daniell, R.H.Q.
107th (South Nottinghamshire Hussars) Regiment, Royal Horse Artillery
“One of their new Mark IV tanks had meandered across the waste land inside the perimeter early in the afternoon. As it approached our regimental headquarters, one of the driving tracks just broke. The young crew jumped out, dismayed beyond words, for they were all alone: there was no fight left in them. I walked over to them directing them towards the rear, where no doubt someone would pick them up.”
(IWM Sound Archive 14761)

Do we have official German figures for the 14th April ?

Leutnant Schorm said:

"Casualties in the II. Abteilung of Panzer Regiment 5 10 panzers, apart from five 7.5 cm guns from 8. Kompanie. A few dead; several wounded, more missing." (WO 169/1436) (WO 201/353) (WO 169/1173)

[David W]

I would be interested in your book.
And you can tell your wife I said so! (Just don't give her my address )

My wife is just the same, a "war" widow.