Traffic between Italy and Spain

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Hyus
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Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by Hyus » 01 Sep 2020 22:30

Was there any freight or passenger traffic able to move between Spain and Italy at any point during the war? Can anyone share details of what routes were normally taken (land, sea, or air) and what cargoes were being moved between them?

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DrG
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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by DrG » 02 Sep 2020 01:09

I have looked for information about this topic for years, but AFAIK it is a black hole of Italian WW2 history. Maybe in Spain there are more data. I only know that trade went on both by land and, mostly, by the sea, and I have the breakdown of annual import-export measured in monetary units, but not in tonnes, nor any logistical detail.

Hyus
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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by Hyus » 02 Sep 2020 09:26

DrG wrote:
02 Sep 2020 01:09
I have the breakdown of annual import-export measured in monetary units
Would you mind sharing this? It's more than I know on this subject.

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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by LColombo » 02 Sep 2020 11:00

There seems to have been some limited traffic by sea. The small passenger steamer Franca Fassio, owned by Soc. An. di Navigazione Villain & Fassio of Genoa, operated in peacetime a bi-weekly subsidizes service between Genoa and Barcelona and after a temporary stop after Italy entered the war, resumed this service in early September 1940, without any escort but with a gun installed on the stern and manned by Navy personnel. In mid-September 1940 she delivered the last cargo of Air Force material provided by Italy to Spain, in compliance with pre-war agreements between Mussolini and Franco. She was torpedoed and sunk on 4 October 1940 by submarine HMS Triton, twenty miles southwest of Savona, during a voyage from Genoa to Barcelona with eighteen passengers (including some American citizens) and 54 crew, ten lives lost.

In January 1941 the small freighters Lello and Mauro Croce made a voyage from Genoa to Barcelona.

On 10 March 1943 the submarine HMS Taurus torpedoed and sank the freighter Derna 15 miles east of Sete (France) while she was en route from Toulon to Barcelona.

On 23 April 1943 the submarine HMS Sickle attacked with torpedoes and gunfire Mauro Croce shortly after she had left Valencia. The torpedoes ran under the keel, a gun duel ensued in which Mauro Croce was hit several times with some damage, three killed and four wounded. The Italian government complained that the ship had been attacked in Spanish territorial waters.

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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by Hyus » 02 Sep 2020 11:19

Thanks LColombo, that's just the sort of information I was looking for.

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Urmel
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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by Urmel » 02 Sep 2020 18:15

There is some info in the German admiral in Rome files on this. Never looked at it closely but it certainly did happen to an extent.
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42

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DrG
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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by DrG » 03 Sep 2020 00:13

Hyus wrote:
02 Sep 2020 09:26
DrG wrote:
02 Sep 2020 01:09
I have the breakdown of annual import-export measured in monetary units
Would you mind sharing this? It's more than I know on this subject.
To be honest, given that the figures are in thousands of golden Pesetas (notice that the dot separates thousands, not decimals, in Italy), I am unable to compare them to any other data about Italian foreign trade.
Import and export are from the Spanish point of view.
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Carl Schwamberger
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Re: Traffic between Italy and Spain

Post by Carl Schwamberger » 03 Sep 2020 01:30

So, what do those Pesetas translate to in terms of a US bribe to Spain, to compensate shutting off this trade to Italy?

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