Was the goal Persia?

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Timo
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Was the goal Persia?

Post by Timo » 06 Nov 2004 17:53

On a Dutch forum there's the question if Rommel and his Afrika Korps had orders or plans to reach Persia or the Caucasus. However, I've got quite a collection of books about this Theatre of Operations but can't find any factual evidence for such plans. Does somebody have any proof that the Afrika Korps had such orders, that is to reach beyond Suez?

Thanks in advance,
Timo

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Reader3000
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Post by Reader3000 » 06 Nov 2004 22:56

Well here are my two cents:

There are rumours that Rommel's Afrika Korps should meet the troops of the Heeresgruppe Süd or (if that would have been possible) some Heeresgruppe which should march through Turkey at the middle east to reach India.
It is said that Hitler had such plans to conquer India from the British.
Of course, on their way from Suez to the Irak/Iran area there lies Palestina, where a great number of jews lived.....so that could also have been a plan.
But just what I heared from some tv documentaries and so on. If that is true, who knows?? :?

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redcoat
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Re: Was the goal Persia?

Post by redcoat » 07 Nov 2004 02:41

While at the height of Rommel's success they may have played with the idea, in truth Rommel's mission in N. Africa was merely to stop the collapse of the Italian forces in the region, and in doing so protect the Southern flank of mainland Europe.

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R-Bob The Great!
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Post by R-Bob The Great! » 07 Nov 2004 10:32

What about Experimental Unit 288 (I think) in the DAK that oil well experts with the direct objective of getting the oil wells of Iraq up and running for hte Fuhrer.

Timo
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Post by Timo » 07 Nov 2004 10:37

R-Bob The Great! wrote:What about Experimental Unit 288 (I think) in the DAK that oil well experts with the direct objective of getting the oil wells of Iraq up and running for hte Fuhrer.
Do you have a source for that? Because the info I could find supports what redcoat says.

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Post by Mark V. » 07 Nov 2004 11:44

Timo wrote:
R-Bob The Great! wrote:What about Experimental Unit 288 (I think) in the DAK that oil well experts with the direct objective of getting the oil wells of Iraq up and running for hte Fuhrer.
Do you have a source for that? Because the info I could find supports what redcoat says.
There were two such units - Sonderverband 287 and 288, the former operating with AG A in the Caucasus and the latter with the Afrika Korps. You'll find some info in these threads:
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... highlight=
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... ight=felmy
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... ight=felmy

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BoroXXX
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my 5 cents

Post by BoroXXX » 21 Dec 2004 00:09

All the facts I've ever found about DAK involvement in Afrika cannot enforce the theory of German penetration into Mid-East, and Caucasus. On the contrary, from all that I've ever learned about DAK it can be clear that the Germans never payed any attention to that idea.

Romel himself wanted to capture Suez in order to robb the Britain of a quick route of supply, while his superiors never even had that idea at least up to Rommel's penetration of Egypt.

Let's see some arguments:
1.) In 1940 general Nehring did some research about throwin the British out of Africa and he came to conclusion that it would be needed 4 armoured divisions! Rommel initially got only 2 (15th PZ and 5th light). They could've easilly sent 2 more dis (at leas one of them armoured) since the Barbarossa hasn't commenced yet. I know that it can be argued with need of every man possible for Barbarossa, but would 2 divs really meant that much compared with gains that could've been achieved in Afrika..

2.) If the Germans really wanted to storm MidEast why wasn't Malta taken out in Mayof 1942, when there was a chance for that, and we all know how was Malta base good in disrupting supply of Afrika? In the time of Alamein PGAfrika recieved only 1/7 of needed materials.

3.) Why Rommel never got the reinforcements that suddenly became available after American invasion of Afrika? Those reinforcements, if sent in June, would eventually win the battle for Romel.

4.) The only reason why DAK was formed is Hitler's fright that complete defeat of the Italians in Afrika could change the borders of his newly formed empire.

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Alter Mann
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Rommel's Plans

Post by Alter Mann » 25 Dec 2004 15:22

I agree that Rommel was sent to North Afrika with the intent of bolstering Italian forces there, however, did he have his own agenda, or make use of clever deception? I'm not sure. So let's look at what we do know.

Germany needed oil. Iraq and Saudi Arabia both had oil.

Turkey really wanted to be neutral, but had fallen in on the Allies side. In WWI, Turkey was opposed to the allies, and Germany still had strong ties there.

Cutting the British supply route through the Suez Canal certainly would not have hurt Germany's chances of success, but Rommel was very ambitious. Maybe that would not have been enough for him.

But just think of the effect that Rommel in Cairo would have had on Allied strategy. Suddenly, North Afrika is not a secondary front. The possibility of either a German incursion into India, or a link up between the Afrika Korps and the German forces in southern Russia could no longer be discounted, and either would be a major disaster for the Allies.

Now consider George Patton's imaginary Army in Britain. Is it possible that the German's had something similar in mind? I honestly don't know.

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red devil
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Re: Was the goal Persia?

Post by red devil » 01 Jan 2005 10:47

redcoat wrote:While at the height of Rommel's success they may have played with the idea, in truth Rommel's mission in N. Africa was merely to stop the collapse of the Italian forces in the region, and in doing so protect the Southern flank of mainland Europe.
This is my info too. However, I did read many years ago that, following Rommels enormous successes, Hitler played with the idea of getting Rommel's Afrika Korps to cross Suez, with Italian troops consolidating a conquered Egypt, and swinging around the coastline towards Palestine etc. Then came El Alamein and everything become conjecture anyway!

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