Towed arty

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 01 Sep 2022 16:29

Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 14:54
Great material.

https://youtu.be/cPEYihJq4FA
It was a long time ago and not true.
Today the harsh reality looks like this.

DW in Russian
What's wrong with the PzH 2000 howitzers? DW News ShowDW in Russian

"The howitzers supplied by Germany could not withstand the rate of fire. Howitzers could not withstand the operating conditions in Ukraine..... Howitzers did well in Afghanistan. ... Here in Ukraine, the conditions are different...
neither Germany nor Ukraine were ready for such conditions of exploitation... It will take months, not days, to eliminate the problems..."


"In the middle of the week, Kiev informed the German Defense Ministry that some of the seven PzH 2000 guns delivered at the end of June, after intensive shelling of Russian positions, issued error messages," the publication claims.

It is with the intensity of use that the problems that have appeared are connected, according to the Bundeswehr. Another possible reason is the use of so–called "smart ammunition" at too great a distance".

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 01 Sep 2022 17:30

Yuri wrote:
01 Sep 2022 16:29
Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 14:54
Great material.

https://youtu.be/cPEYihJq4FA
It was a long time ago and not true.
Today the harsh reality looks like this.

DW in Russian
What's wrong with the PzH 2000 howitzers? DW News ShowDW in Russian

"The howitzers supplied by Germany could not withstand the rate of fire. Howitzers could not withstand the operating conditions in Ukraine..... Howitzers did well in Afghanistan. ... Here in Ukraine, the conditions are different...
neither Germany nor Ukraine were ready for such conditions of exploitation... It will take months, not days, to eliminate the problems..."


"In the middle of the week, Kiev informed the German Defense Ministry that some of the seven PzH 2000 guns delivered at the end of June, after intensive shelling of Russian positions, issued error messages," the publication claims.

It is with the intensity of use that the problems that have appeared are connected, according to the Bundeswehr. Another possible reason is the use of so–called "smart ammunition" at too great a distance".
You are seriously overstating. The problems can be solved.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 02 Sep 2022 06:11

Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 17:30
You are seriously overstating.
Why do you want to execute me?
I'm just a messenger who brought you bad news.
Deutsche Welle is a German state-owned television and radio company. All claims, please, to the Germans.
Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 17:30
The problems can be solved.
According to the Russian proverb:
Chickens are counted in autumn (Цыплят по осени считают).
If and When the problem is fixed, that's when we'll see what happened and whether it turned out.
No one here has said (or written) that problems cannot be solved.
According to the Russian proverb:
An effort is not torture (Попытка не пытка).
If the German designers manage to make a candy out of this super-expensive shit, it will be a professional feat, then I will be the first to congratulate them.

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 02 Sep 2022 11:19

Yuri wrote:
02 Sep 2022 06:11
Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 17:30
You are seriously overstating.
Why do you want to execute me?
I'm just a messenger who brought you bad news.
Deutsche Welle is a German state-owned television and radio company. All claims, please, to the Germans.
Aida1 wrote:
01 Sep 2022 17:30
The problems can be solved.
According to the Russian proverb:
Chickens are counted in autumn (Цыплят по осени считают).
If and When the problem is fixed, that's when we'll see what happened and whether it turned out.
No one here has said (or written) that problems cannot be solved.
According to the Russian proverb:
An effort is not torture (Попытка не пытка).
If the German designers manage to make a candy out of this super-expensive shit, it will be a professional feat, then I will be the first to congratulate them.
The Ukrainians can stop overusing it. No need to fire barrages with it.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 02 Sep 2022 13:18

Aida1 wrote:
02 Sep 2022 11:19
The Ukrainians can stop overusing it. No need to fire barrages with it.
They can, no doubt. But will they be able to? that's the question.
it depends not only on who owns the weapon. In war (as in boxing), very often you have to act contrary to your desires and capabilities.
To lighten the purse of the layman is the only meaning of the production of 155 mm PzH2000, weapons capable only once every 15 minutes to release a projectile weighing 50 kg towards the enemy with its own weight of 60 tons and a cost of 15 million euros.

A very effective weapon against the Afghan Taliban detachments that do not have heavy weapons and absolutely counterproductive against the miners of Donbass, who are able to respond in the same 15 minutes with 100 shots from 152 mm Soviet self-propelled howitzer Msta-S, which, with the same mobility, has a weight of one and a half times less, and the cost is ten times lower.

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 02 Sep 2022 14:54

Yuri wrote:
02 Sep 2022 13:18
Aida1 wrote:
02 Sep 2022 11:19
The Ukrainians can stop overusing it. No need to fire barrages with it.
They can, no doubt. But will they be able to? that's the question.
it depends not only on who owns the weapon. In war (as in boxing), very often you have to act contrary to your desires and capabilities.
To lighten the purse of the layman is the only meaning of the production of 155 mm PzH2000, weapons capable only once every 15 minutes to release a projectile weighing 50 kg towards the enemy with its own weight of 60 tons and a cost of 15 million euros.

A very effective weapon against the Afghan Taliban detachments that do not have heavy weapons and absolutely counterproductive against the miners of Donbass, who are able to respond in the same 15 minutes with 100 shots from 152 mm Soviet self-propelled howitzer Msta-S, which, with the same mobility, has a weight of one and a half times less, and the cost is ten times lower.
The Panzerhaubitze 2000 is extremely accurate and can do the job it is required to do. Any Russian tank,artillery piece, etc... that is located will be destroyed very quickly and efficiently.
Very accurate weapon systems need much less ammo to do the job.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 02 Sep 2022 16:29

Well, let's wish them good luck.
God grant it may be as you say.
The main thing that:
a) our super expensive tarantass shoot;
b) so that after firing the projectile flew in the direction in which the shooter wanted to direct it.
Because today our super expensive tarantass either does not allow you to shoot, or if a shot occurred, the shells flies in the wrong direction in which it was intended to be directed.

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 02 Sep 2022 17:38

Nice to see bridges being hit near Kherson..
https://youtu.be/FGjLVM-m7Co
https://youtu.be/SZ5vFG7AktM

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 02 Sep 2022 18:04

The ukranians appreciate the panzerhaubitze 2000.
https://youtu.be/cM_Z98N2J8I

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 02 Sep 2022 18:35

Interesting vid. Gives an intelligent explanation about socalled problems with Panzerhaubitze 2000.Not abnormal that complex systems need a lot of maintenance,particularly if you overuse them. Panzerhaubitze 2000 is very good and the Ukranians do not have many of them which would inevitably lead to overuse. Comparison is made with Tiger tank in ww2 which was also overused. The only solution is more maintenance capacity and get more Panzerhaubitze 2000.100 have been ordered by the Ukraine whichs shows how they are appreciated.
https://youtu.be/K2cnIOrALwU

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MarkF617
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Re: Towed arty

Post by MarkF617 » 02 Sep 2022 21:18

Hello all.

I don't know why the cost of western equipment is of any relevance. Ukraine is getting it all free of charge😀
You know you're British when you drive your German car to an Irish pub for a pint of Belgian beer before having an Indian meal. When you get home you sit on your Sweedish sofa and watch American programs on your Japanese TV.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 03 Sep 2022 08:16

Aida1 wrote:
02 Sep 2022 17:38
Nice to see bridges being hit near Kherson..
https://youtu.be/FGjLVM-m7Co
https://youtu.be/SZ5vFG7AktM
It's hard to see here.
Here are excellent shot that clearly show the results of hitting four high-precision guided projectiles fired from the HIMARS-type MLRS (USA).
02 09 22 STRIKE ON PEACEFUL KHERSON
The shells accurately hit the Russian armored vehicles and destroyed the building of the control point of the Russian Orcs.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 03 Sep 2022 08:18

Aida1 wrote:
02 Sep 2022 18:04
The ukranians appreciate the panzerhaubitze 2000.
https://youtu.be/cM_Z98N2J8I
And on these video frames, the result of a 155 mm guided projectile strike on the center of the city of Energodar is very clearly visible.
As you can see, high-precision 155 mm shells hit all the armored vehicles of the Russian Orcs.
Energodar August 28, 2022. Fire after shelling
Presumably, such accurate shots were fired from our ultra-expensive tarantass type PzH 2000 (Federal Republic of Germany). It is impossible to make such an accurate shot from the Soviet Msta-S. In addition, the Soviet Msta-S has a 152 mm gun caliber.

P.S. This is the city where those who serve the largest nuclear power plant in Europe (Zaporizhia NPP) live.

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Yuri
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Yuri » 03 Sep 2022 09:59

Here, eight years ago, there was a good discussion about the role and place of towed artillery in modern conditions. The discussion is based on examples of the use of M777 and Msta-B howitzers.
The presenter says: "To be honest, I thought that towed artillery was already yesterday."
As we can see, skepticism about towed artillery was not born today or yesterday or even the day before yesterday.
03/27/2014 M777A2 and MSTA-B howitzers. Towed artillery

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Aida1
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Re: Towed arty

Post by Aida1 » 03 Sep 2022 11:14

Yuri wrote:
03 Sep 2022 08:16
Aida1 wrote:
02 Sep 2022 17:38
Nice to see bridges being hit near Kherson..
https://youtu.be/FGjLVM-m7Co
https://youtu.be/SZ5vFG7AktM
It's hard to see here.
Here are excellent shot that clearly show the results of hitting four high-precision guided projectiles fired from the HIMARS-type MLRS (USA).
02 09 22 STRIKE ON PEACEFUL KHERSON
The shells accurately hit the Russian armored vehicles and destroyed the building of the control point of the Russian Orcs.
Russian propaganda should never be taken too seriously. HIMARS is used against high value targets like ammo depots, fuel depots and bridges. It is very precise.

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