news from Russo-Ukraine Front

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ljadw
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by ljadw » 14 Sep 2022 09:49

peeved wrote:
14 Sep 2022 08:26
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 05:25
Oryx is a Dutch military analytical blog banned in Russia.
Oryx claims to be independent, but it is obviously anti-Russian
Sounds good; Would make them anti-absolute evil.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
it called the Russian invasion an attack against Europe .
Quite fair since the Ukraine is part of Europe and Russia is a semi-Asiatic imperialist aggressive bandit state.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Thus, I have my doubts about its reliability .
That should enhance Oryx' reliability in the minds of good people who hate evil.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Besides the financing of Oryx remains hidden .
From https://www.patreon.com/oryxspioenkop
About Oryx Blog
We are Stijn Mitzer and Joost Oliemans, two military analysts devoted to investigating and sharing the ins and outs of conflict research, open-source intelligence and the occasional obscure piece of military history. Our independent research allows us to do objective analyses and uncover stories that might be unpalpable to other outlets, without sacrificing detail or accuracy in pandering to a broader audience. Unfortunately, it is also precisely this format that makes for a very unprofitable model - in turn leading to an inconsistent output of articles. By supporting us on Patreon, you help ensure we can devote more of our time to our blog, and release our articles on a more frequent basis. In the long run, we aspire to write articles about Azerbaijan, Eastern Ukraine, Venezuela, Vietnam, Turkey, Central and South-East Asia, and expand our coverage on Syria, Iran, Cuba, Africa, the Caucasus and the Gulf region. We appreciate any help that we can get that’ll allow us to stride closer to this goal!
Do you mean that their individual Patreon contributors should be named? Wouldn't that make the good people susceptible to pro-absolute evil babbler psychos?

Markus
There is no proof at all that Oryx is financed by individual contributors .

Martin_from_Valhalla
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Martin_from_Valhalla » 14 Sep 2022 09:54

Everything was fine with oryx in Russia until March. But now I can't open the site because it is blocked by the government.

ljadw
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by ljadw » 14 Sep 2022 10:02

peeved wrote:
14 Sep 2022 08:26
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 05:25
Oryx is a Dutch military analytical blog banned in Russia.
Oryx claims to be independent, but it is obviously anti-Russian
Sounds good; Would make them anti-absolute evil.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
it called the Russian invasion an attack against Europe .
Quite fair since the Ukraine is part of Europe and Russia is a semi-Asiatic imperialist aggressive bandit state.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Thus, I have my doubts about its reliability .
That should enhance Oryx' reliability in the minds of good people who hate evil.
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 07:19
Besides the financing of Oryx remains hidden .
From https://www.patreon.com/oryxspioenkop
About Oryx Blog
We are Stijn Mitzer and Joost Oliemans, two military analysts devoted to investigating and sharing the ins and outs of conflict research, open-source intelligence and the occasional obscure piece of military history. Our independent research allows us to do objective analyses and uncover stories that might be unpalpable to other outlets, without sacrificing detail or accuracy in pandering to a broader audience. Unfortunately, it is also precisely this format that makes for a very unprofitable model - in turn leading to an inconsistent output of articles. By supporting us on Patreon, you help ensure we can devote more of our time to our blog, and release our articles on a more frequent basis. In the long run, we aspire to write articles about Azerbaijan, Eastern Ukraine, Venezuela, Vietnam, Turkey, Central and South-East Asia, and expand our coverage on Syria, Iran, Cuba, Africa, the Caucasus and the Gulf region. We appreciate any help that we can get that’ll allow us to stride closer to this goal!
Do you mean that their individual Patreon contributors should be named? Wouldn't that make the good people susceptible to pro-absolute evil babbler psychos?

Markus
I find it very childish to talk about evil concerning war . War is not evil . It is natural and human . All countries (including Finland ) have started wars .
Clausewitz said that war is the continuation of politics by other means . He was wrong .
Politics,and even life,is the continuation of war by other means .
Homo homini lupus .
And,since or because the Liberals and moralists have declared that war is evil many more people have died in wars than before and wars have become more cruel .
Caesar also has killed countless people . Was he evil ?
If Putin is evil, so was Caesar and maybe Mannerheim or Pilsudski or Louis 14

Martin_from_Valhalla
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Martin_from_Valhalla » 14 Sep 2022 10:11

Caesar also has killed countless people . Was he evil ?
If Putin is evil, so was Caesar and maybe Mannerheim or Pilsudski or Louis 14
What about Stalin, Mao, Hitler? Generally, they are considered more evil. Or Pol Pot. The people you mentioned didn't follow any ideologies. The reasons they started their wars are different. Better mention crusaders or Thirty Years War as religion is also ideology.

mezsat2
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by mezsat2 » 14 Sep 2022 10:20

What's frightening for Putin is this offensive was executed by, at most, 10,000 troops- a division. Certainly, a more heavily armed division than in earlier wars.

ljadw
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by ljadw » 14 Sep 2022 10:22

Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:11
Caesar also has killed countless people . Was he evil ?
If Putin is evil, so was Caesar and maybe Mannerheim or Pilsudski or Louis 14
What about Stalin, Mao, Hitler? Generally, they are considered more evil. Or Pol Pot. The people you mentioned didn't follow any ideologies. The reasons they started their wars are different. Better mention crusaders or Thirty Years War as religion is also ideology.
Did Mannerheim ,Pilsudski, Caesar, Louis 14,... not have an ideology ?
And, was Stalin evil because he attacked Finland,or was he evil for other reasons ? Mao was involved in ONE war : Korea . Thus this make him evil ?
Was Hitler evil because he invaded Poland or was he evil because of the Holocaust ?
When US intervened in a lot of countries because it believed in Manifest Destiny ,were the interventions evil or was Manifest Destiny evil ? Or both ? Or none ?

mezsat2
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by mezsat2 » 14 Sep 2022 10:30

Hitler was obviously evil as was Stalin. The allies were forced to make a deal with the Devil by aiding Stalin. The west knew that full and well. They figured they'd bury Hitler and deal with Stalin later.

It worked for almost 100 years, but time may be out. Putin originated from Stalinist policies and is proving it today.

I would hesitate to call the Ukrainian surge a "counter-offensive". Russia has controlled these areas for many months. Operationally, this was a straight offensive and that's it.

Martin_from_Valhalla
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Martin_from_Valhalla » 14 Sep 2022 13:02

ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:22
Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:11
Caesar also has killed countless people . Was he evil ?
If Putin is evil, so was Caesar and maybe Mannerheim or Pilsudski or Louis 14
What about Stalin, Mao, Hitler? Generally, they are considered more evil. Or Pol Pot. The people you mentioned didn't follow any ideologies. The reasons they started their wars are different. Better mention crusaders or Thirty Years War as religion is also ideology.
Did Mannerheim ,Pilsudski, Caesar, Louis 14,... not have an ideology ?
And, was Stalin evil because he attacked Finland,or was he evil for other reasons ? Mao was involved in ONE war : Korea . Thus this make him evil ?
Was Hitler evil because he invaded Poland or was he evil because of the Holocaust ?
When US intervened in a lot of countries because it believed in Manifest Destiny ,were the interventions evil or was Manifest Destiny evil ? Or both ? Or none ?
The measure of evilness changes. Earlier Europe was affected by knighthood, that way of living made it's own way of thinking that warring wasn't that bad. Frederick The Great Prussian had a number of military campaigns and he was admired by his contemporaries. Napoleon admired Alexander The Great Macedonian in his turn. And Napoleon is not that loathed today as Hitler, though their military campaigns can be compared in some way.

Apparently, what makes a leader of the country evil is his his way of ruling added with invasion of a neighborhood country. The notion dictator comes from Ancient Greece and Rome and dictators were the state rulers who were hard on their surrounding, oppressed any opposition. Today the concept of dictatorship slightly changed as states changed, so we can say that leaders like Putin or Lukashenko are evil, just as Saddam or Gaddfi, etc.

So, yes, today an invasion makes state leaders evil but they were evil before because only dictators start wars and before going to war thay make their own states corrupted and policed, thus failed.

I don't know about inner policy of Mannerheim or Pilsudsky much but it looks like they didn't bring much grief to the countries surrounding, so let Finns or Poles decide were they evil or not.

ljadw
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by ljadw » 14 Sep 2022 14:06

Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 13:02
ljadw wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:22
Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:11
Caesar also has killed countless people . Was he evil ?
If Putin is evil, so was Caesar and maybe Mannerheim or Pilsudski or Louis 14
What about Stalin, Mao, Hitler? Generally, they are considered more evil. Or Pol Pot. The people you mentioned didn't follow any ideologies. The reasons they started their wars are different. Better mention crusaders or Thirty Years War as religion is also ideology.
Did Mannerheim ,Pilsudski, Caesar, Louis 14,... not have an ideology ?
And, was Stalin evil because he attacked Finland,or was he evil for other reasons ? Mao was involved in ONE war : Korea . Thus this make him evil ?
Was Hitler evil because he invaded Poland or was he evil because of the Holocaust ?
When US intervened in a lot of countries because it believed in Manifest Destiny ,were the interventions evil or was Manifest Destiny evil ? Or both ? Or none ?
The measure of evilness changes. Earlier Europe was affected by knighthood, that way of living made it's own way of thinking that warring wasn't that bad. Frederick The Great Prussian had a number of military campaigns and he was admired by his contemporaries. Napoleon admired Alexander The Great Macedonian in his turn. And Napoleon is not that loathed today as Hitler, though their military campaigns can be compared in some way.

Apparently, what makes a leader of the country evil is his his way of ruling added with invasion of a neighborhood country. The notion dictator comes from Ancient Greece and Rome and dictators were the state rulers who were hard on their surrounding, oppressed any opposition. Today the concept of dictatorship slightly changed as states changed, so we can say that leaders like Putin or Lukashenko are evil, just as Saddam or Gaddfi, etc.

So, yes, today an invasion makes state leaders evil but they were evil before because only dictators start wars and before going to war thay make their own states corrupted and policed, thus failed.

I don't know about inner policy of Mannerheim or Pilsudsky much but it looks like they didn't bring much grief to the countries surrounding, so let Finns or Poles decide were they evil or not.
Only dictators start wars ?
William 2 of Germany was not a dictator, neither was US president McKinley,neither was the Boer president Krüger, neither was the Japanese emperor Meiji,or Pilsudski who invaded a territory that was not his,or the Italian king who attacked the Ottoman Empire and Austria-Hungary .
Obama was not a dictator but he attacked Syria and Libya,etc,etc ..
And, calling a dictator evil,is irrelevant, as most democracies collaborate with dictators.Besides,there will always be dictators as long as mankind exists.To survive both democracies and dictators need peaceful coexistence . If you do not attack a dictator, he will not attack you . But for the present liberals, this is anathema .

ljadw
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by ljadw » 14 Sep 2022 14:13

mezsat2 wrote:
14 Sep 2022 10:30
Hitler was obviously evil as was Stalin. The allies were forced to make a deal with the Devil by aiding Stalin. The west knew that full and well. They figured they'd bury Hitler and deal with Stalin later.

It worked for almost 100 years, but time may be out. Putin originated from Stalinist policies and is proving it today.

I would hesitate to call the Ukrainian surge a "counter-offensive". Russia has controlled these areas for many months. Operationally, this was a straight offensive and that's it.
That Hitler and Stalin were evil is meaningless,as we were and are forced to do business with evil people .It is not the mission of democracies to fight against (what they call ) evil foreign rulers .
The cultural Marxists who dominated (dominate ? ) the US did not care when Germany was at war with capitalist France and Britain,or when Stalin attacked Finland :no Lend Lease for Finland,but they showed their true sympathies when Hitler attacked the USSR : weapons for the USSR .

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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Cult Icon » 14 Sep 2022 14:36

The Oryx blog was posted very early on in this forum. It is just weird that a blog would suddenly have 100 plus photos of wrecked Russian/Ukrainian tanks days into the war. It is also unclear where and when the pictures were taken, or even if they were of this war.

It is obvious that the blog has some sort of arrangement with Ukrainian psych-ops, feeding it a huge number of photos. It is naive to believe that all the photos in that blog are 100% accurate. Whatever the Russian/Ukrainian losses are, it doesn't really matter very much to understanding this war.
Sean Oliver wrote:
14 Sep 2022 05:09
Today I read the Russians can't recruit enough young men to fight, and the Kremlin's Russo-centric warmongers are having fit about the "low levels of patriotism" of the younger generation who grew up enjoying western culture and all that goes with it. Traitors!
Also, oryx says 5900 Russian vehicles and 1000 Rus tanks lost
ISW reports on Russian recruitment activities everyday, it has been going on for months. One of the things they are doing is recruiting from rural/economically depressed areas and having a lot of financial incentives.

There are also a lot of separate volunteer battalions being raised. I do not know if they are to be integrated into the rebuilding formations in the interior or will they be used a detachment to support the BTG.

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Aida1
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Aida1 » 14 Sep 2022 15:14

Cult Icon wrote:
14 Sep 2022 14:36
The Oryx blog was posted very early on in this forum. It is just weird that a blog would suddenly have 100 plus photos of wrecked Russian/Ukrainian tanks days into the war. It is also unclear where and when the pictures were taken, or even if they were of this war.

It is obvious that the blog has some sort of arrangement with Ukrainian psych-ops, feeding it a huge number of photos. It is naive to believe that all the photos in that blog are 100% accurate. Whatever the Russian/Ukrainian losses are, it doesn't really matter very much to understanding this war.
Sean Oliver wrote:
14 Sep 2022 05:09
Today I read the Russians can't recruit enough young men to fight, and the Kremlin's Russo-centric warmongers are having fit about the "low levels of patriotism" of the younger generation who grew up enjoying western culture and all that goes with it. Traitors!
Also, oryx says 5900 Russian vehicles and 1000 Rus tanks lost
ISW reports on Russian recruitment activities everyday, it has been going on for months. One of the things they are doing is recruiting from rural/economically depressed areas and having a lot of financial incentives.

There are also a lot of separate volunteer battalions being raised. I do not know if they are to be integrated into the rebuilding formations in the interior or will they be used a detachment to support the BTG.
It is not unexpected that you are dtill in denial of what happened.

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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Martin_from_Valhalla » 14 Sep 2022 16:29

Cult Icon, what do you think of the following conspiracy? Putin wouldn't have started that war, if Biden hadn't been elected with his age, laziness out of age, starting dementia and weakness in general due to all circumstances. So, Putin needs Biden in the White House. And in November there will be elections in The USA Senate. Biden and his son are having some troubles with this 'Ukrainagate'. Could there be some secret negotiations between two presidents about recent Russian rtreat to regroup which would give some credit to Biden? Not everyone among American taxpayers like spending money on helping Ukraine but now they see the result, though, unfortunately, British Queen died in inappropriate moment.

What gets Putin? Biden's undecisiveness. Biden keeps on loitering to help Ukraine fully and unconditionally. Ukraine gets money but they don't get tanks, howitzers that shoot longer than 100 km, armored vehicles. They simply don't get an offensive weaponry only a defensive one. Ukraine got some tanks from Europe but that was rather a long time ago and the aid is limited to some howitzers, shells and other though needed but unoffensive stuff.

Anyway, The White House started warning about Putin's invasion almost a year ago, noone was taking it seriously. How did they learn about invasion? Could be that Putin himself was inquiring position of The USA on that matter. Piling of Russian troops and tanks near Ukrainian border wouldn't have meant anything, as there were always there since 2014 more or less.
Last edited by Martin_from_Valhalla on 14 Sep 2022 16:49, edited 1 time in total.

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Hikari
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Hikari » 14 Sep 2022 16:48

Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 16:29
Cult Icon, what do you think of the following conspiracy? Putin wouldn't have started that war, if Biden hadn't been elected with his age, laziness out of age, starting dementia and weakness in general due to all circumstances. So, Putin needs Biden in the White House. And in November there will be elections in The USA Senate. Biden and his son are having some troubles with this 'Ukrainagate'. Could there be some secret negotiations between two presidents about recent Russian rtreat to regroup which would give some credit to Biden? Not everyone among American taxpayers like spending money on helping Ukraine but now they see the result, though, unfortunately, British Queen died in inappropriate moment.

What gets Putin? Biden's undecisiveness. Biden keeps on loitering to help Ukraine fully and unconditionally. Ukraine gets money but they don't get tanks, howitzers that shoot longer than 100 km, armored vehicles. They simply don't get an offensive weaponry only a defensive one. Ukraine got some tanks from Europe but that was rather a long time ago and the aid is limited to some howitzers, shells and other though needed but unoffensive stuff.

Anyway, The White House started warning about Putin's invasion almost a year ago, noone was taking it seriously. How did they learnt about invasion? Could be that Putin himself was inquiring position of The USA on that matter. Piling of Russian troops and tanks near Ukrainian border wouldn't have meant anything, as there were always there since 2014 more or less.
The Chinese official media until February 22 mocked the failure of the U.S. "paranoia about Putin's invasion of Ukraine".

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Hikari
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Re: news from Russo-Ukraine Front

Post by Hikari » 14 Sep 2022 16:53

Martin_from_Valhalla wrote:
14 Sep 2022 16:29
Cult Icon, what do you think of the following conspiracy? Putin wouldn't have started that war, if Biden hadn't been elected with his age, laziness out of age, starting dementia and weakness in general due to all circumstances. So, Putin needs Biden in the White House. And in November there will be elections in The USA Senate. Biden and his son are having some troubles with this 'Ukrainagate'. Could there be some secret negotiations between two presidents about recent Russian rtreat to regroup which would give some credit to Biden? Not everyone among American taxpayers like spending money on helping Ukraine but now they see the result, though, unfortunately, British Queen died in inappropriate moment.

What gets Putin? Biden's undecisiveness. Biden keeps on loitering to help Ukraine fully and unconditionally. Ukraine gets money but they don't get tanks, howitzers that shoot longer than 100 km, armored vehicles. They simply don't get an offensive weaponry only a defensive one. Ukraine got some tanks from Europe but that was rather a long time ago and the aid is limited to some howitzers, shells and other though needed but unoffensive stuff.

Anyway, The White House started warning about Putin's invasion almost a year ago, noone was taking it seriously. How did they learn about invasion? Could be that Putin himself was inquiring position of The USA on that matter. Piling of Russian troops and tanks near Ukrainian border wouldn't have meant anything, as there were always there since 2014 more or less.
Ah, and after that, they pretend to be neutral, but actually spread the "official news" created by the Russian media, and repeatedly quote disinformation media like Russia Today, etc. Ah, in fact Russia Today is probably the only foreign official media in China that publishes news without restrictions.

But, tbh, I don't think they have any balls to support Russia invasion in actual action-. I could go on for hours about why Chinese officials like to lick putin's ass so much, but given everyone's appetites, let's not coming up that image.😓

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