One of the darkest dates in history.

[deepthinker]

Yesterday was June 28. I was thinking that on that date 2 horrible events occurred. On that date in 1914 Archduke Franz Ferdinand was assisanted. This helped lead to World War 1. Then 5 years later on the same date an even more horrible event occured. Germany was forced to sign the diktat of Versailles. The mercilessness and cruelty the allies showed towards Germany in the treaty was absoloutly awful. This so called "treaty" would eventually lead to the second world war. This date is indeed horrible.

[Lord Gort]

On march 3rd 1918 the Russian delegates signed the dictated treaty of Brest Litovsk. Russia lost all the conquests made by the Tsars in the past 300 years. It was a harsh punitive peace. The Germans soon learnt the truth of Radeks bitter cry "one day the allies will impose a brest litovsk on you!".


People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

[Oswald Mosley]

Indeed. Some historians have argued, with good reason, that Germany got off lightly at Versailles, given that the Allies were utterly routing German armed forces at the time and an invasion of the country was imminent. In comparison to Postdam, 26 years later, Versailles was a generous treaty. At Potsdam Germany was crushed, divided and utterly humiliated, whereas Versailles merely 'reduced' Germany's status as a great power. Anyway, Hitler's peacetime successes are ample proof that the allies were not serious about enforcing the terms of the Versailles treaty; by August 1939 the treaty had de facto ceased to exist and the only remaining step for its total destruction would have been the restoration of German overseas colonies. Unfortunately for Germany, Hitler then elected to use military force when further diplomacy would surely have brought more success.

[Robert Zeller]

I agree about that date being horrible, anyway,
I think the allies showed what losers they were with Versailles, and Potsdam really showed what kind of people they were.

[Lord Gort]

Remember that Danzig almost became Polish and that Silisia was almost ceded. So it was harsh but not that harsh, it was the reparations infact that were the harsh thing. But the Germans did invade France without the slightest attepmt at an excuse.


And they did a Versaille on Russia, so they were slightly hippocritical.

[pdhinkle36ID]

The people of todays Germany deserve credit for what they have done in the past 57 years. Who would want to undo WW I and WW II and start over?
The bad days of the 20th century will never come back,

[Csaba Becze]

The wrong and most injustice peace dictate was after the first world war was the Hungarian (Trianon, 4 June 1920)


See for details, for example:
http://www.extra.hu/molnaristvan/trianon.html


Nowadays the French historians acknowledge it(France was the most accountable for this "peace"), but this is not a comfort for the humiliated and sometimes murdered mass.

Csaba

[Benjamin Fanjoy]

Indeed. Some historians have argued, with good reason, that Germany got off lightly at Versailles...

I fail to see how Germany got off lightly, the "treaty" ruined and crippled Germany, and caused WW2.

[Graf von Dracula]

September,11th.

In 1712, the city of Barcelona, the Capital of Catalonia, fell in hands of the King Felipe V of Spain, that started a centralist policy (in the way of the French Regime), that supressed the Catalan culture and the Catalan institutions. Catalonia celebrates that day as her National Day because Catalonia and her culture was able to revive from the ashes, and as a sign of pride and recovery.

I don't remember the year, but a september 11th in Chile there was a coup d'etat that gave the power to the military (Augusto Pinochet) and started one of the worst dictatorships in South America. Democracy in Chile died that day....

Also, don't have to remind the event last year. A painful day that share three different countries....

[The Desert Fox]

The Versailles treaty in my opnion was an definite disgrace. It directly fueled the fire which led to Hitlers rise to power. No one with any vague nationalistic or patriotic feeling at all could, not have felt bitter at the conditions forced upon germany.

Germany born an ridicolous amount of blame for ww1 simply because they fought on when all their allies had crumbled, months bfore
ie:Turkey, Austria- Hungary. Blame for starting the war was totally unfair as they only joined the conflict after Russian declared war on its ally Austria-Hungary.

I admit also that the treaty of Brest Litovsk was indeed harsh but Lenin was willing to pay any cost to gurentee the ascesion of his party to power in Russia.

[Gwynn Compton]

Had Germany actually been forced to continue the reparation payments, wouldn't have they have been still paying them up till the 1980s?

We must also remember that the Russian's needed the peace in 1917, just as Germany needed peace in 1918/19, the Russians had a civil war to fight, and the Germans just about had their own. Both losing sides had to lose something to gain in the long run.

[Javier Acuña]

September,11th.

In 1712, the city of Barcelona, the Capital of Catalonia, fell in hands of the King Felipe V of Spain, that started a centralist policy (in the way of the French Regime), that supressed the Catalan culture and the Catalan institutions. Catalonia celebrates that day as her National Day because Catalonia and her culture was able to revive from the ashes, and as a sign of pride and recovery.

I don't remember the year, but a september 11th in Chile there was a coup d'etat that gave the power to the military (Augusto Pinochet) and started one of the worst dictatorships in South America. Democracy in Chile died that day....

Also, don't have to remind the event last year. A painful day that share three different countries....

The coup d'etat in Chile was in 1973

[White_Trader]

the Londons ambasadors conference of 1912-1913 gave just the half of the albanian populated land to the albanian state. This was the worst thing that happend to us . All the other things are as a result of that. And if there wouldnt be Austro-hungaria and italy todays albania would be even smaller.

Heil To the Austrians that that did evrything to help us. They even threatend Serbia with a war if they wouldnt retreat from Albania.

[Sokol]

The onset of WWI was beyond horrific for us Serbians. We agreed to every point in the Austrian ultimatum, bar one. We even delivered our reply within the paltry time-limit imposed on us. And we were made war upon. Hah! The Austrian "Balkan Jaunt" turned into quite a neat little bloody nose, didn't it? *sigh* The creation of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia followed soon thereafter, and the tragedies of the 40's and 90's became nigh unavoidable.

[Mark V]

The Versailles treaty in my opnion was an definite disgrace. It directly fueled the fire which led to Hitlers rise to power. No one with any vague nationalistic or patriotic feeling at all could, not have felt bitter at the conditions forced upon germany.

Germany born an ridicolous amount of blame for ww1 simply because they fought on when all their allies had crumbled, months bfore
ie:Turkey, Austria- Hungary. Blame for starting the war was totally unfair as they only joined the conflict after Russian declared war on its ally Austria-Hungary.

Agree 100%