Bundeswehr and NVA!

[Ingsoc75]

Gowen Militaria!

Great place for DDR stuff and Bob, who runs the thing, is very helpful and polite.

http://www.gowenmilitaria.com/default.htm

[Thälmann]

Regarding which army was the most like the older armies of Germany, I'm going to let these pictures speak for themselves.

[panzerIV]

I love that first pic!


/Magnus

[PJF]

I believe that the first pic was taken at the Soviet Memorial in Treptow Park. I know that the DDR used if for a lot of ceremonial occaisons etc.

[soldat_m56]

In some respects the Bundeswehr does resmeble the Wehrmacht. Personally I think East German helmets look a tad bit umm... Soviet. German kevlar helmets look a lot more like the wehrmacht than the old steel pots. Of course they don't look exactly like them, but IMO more than East German steel helmets. Also the Bundeswehr utilises litzen. I think more tradition are Prussian rather than Wehrmacht. The Wehrmacht took Prussian traditions and "Nazified" them. So I really don't see anything wrong with things like goose-stepping, but anyways...

Notice the striking similarity of the field caps to those of the Wehrmacht. Also note the MG-42/03 that one soldier is carrying (modern variant of the most famous of German machione guns in WWII).

[Thälmann]

In some respects the Bundeswehr does resmeble the Wehrmacht. Personally I think East German helmets look a tad bit umm... Soviet.

The m/56 helmet being developed in the former nazi Germany, I must disagree with you. The m/56 follows the old german helmet design. When looking at this drawing I think the relationship is more than obvious.

Also the Bundeswehr utilises litzen.

So did the NVA, the older NVA.

I think more tradition are Prussian rather than Wehrmacht. The Wehrmacht took Prussian traditions and "Nazified" them. So I really don't see anything wrong with things like goose-stepping, but anyways...

Yes, it's all about Prussia.

[soldat_m56]

*removed by my choice due to problems with another user*

[Winston Smith]

Regarding which army was the most like the older armies of Germany, I'm going to let these pictures speak for themselves.

Thälmann, could you tell me the name of the book that the second scan came from?

[Angus Young]

Hi, everybody! I'm happy that I found this discussion, as I was talking to my teacher about the subject while I was in Berlin last year. The teacher told me that the NVA used the Wehrmacht-style uniforms to show the german people(both east and west I suppose) that the DDR was the safekeeper of the ''real, old german traditions'' and the prussian military traditions, and that the DDR was not as ''americanized'' as the ''evil capitalist'' West Germany. I suppose you people born and brought up in the DDR are some of the best to ask about this, as you might know anything about it?
Is there any truth about it?
By the way, the m/56 helmet was based on a Third Reich-era prototype helmet, as you have all said, was this prototype the mystic m/45?
Regards/ Andreas

[MacX]

I know the West German steel helmets DO NOT look like wehrmacht ones. I said the new kevlar helmets do more so than the West German steel pots. I also didn't say that the Bundeswehr took all Prussian traditions, just some. As an earlier post on this thread said:
"Bundeswehr = German and American
"Nationale Volksarmee = German and Soviet"

Military Collection of Peter Suciu website:

The current issue Kevlar helmet of the Bundeswehr. This helmet retains the basic shape of the German Model 1935 steel helmet.

Oh come on, you could take ANY modern kevlar helmet in the world and claim to be inspired by WH helmets. This is simply too far fetched.
Even the modern American helmets have more similarities to old German ones than Bundeswehr Helmets.


Bundeswehr kevlar helmet
source: http://juwa.org

does this look like the old steelhelmet?

I strongly doubt it.

And as some people said. The NVA steel helmet was a German ww2 prototype simply not being widely spreaded because it wasn't possible to equip every German soldier with it in the last months of war. Thus they kept it back.
So there is nothing soviet about it.

And yes, the NVA uniforms in general resemble the WH ones most.

[|AXiN|]

IIRC the NVA helmet was designed during the war after testing to see which design was most efficient at deflecting bullets, but wasn't put into production because Hitler felt it broke with the traditions of German helmet design or something equally ridiculous.

As for the modern Bundeswehr helmets, they're probably based off the same research as the current American "Fritz" helmets which have been noted for their resemblance to the ww2 German helmet.

[Angus Young]

Well, why change a good concept?
The old german helmet-design have proven itself worthy for 90 years.
So why not as well use it?
/ Andreas

[MacX]

no, it's mere chance that the design is similar today. for a steel helmet the nva like shape has proven worthier. But modern Helmet have some headphones in the ear region, if I'm not wrong and the material has changed. I think shrapnels are not supposed to bounce but to get stuck within the helmet.

[soldat_m56]

I didn't say the kevlar helmet was the direct descendent of the stahlhelm. I said it resembled it.

It is kind of pointless to say which army was the descendent of the Wehrmacht because, regardless of whether the NVA was before or not, the Bundeswehr as the only German army today is the successor now.

[MacX]

funnily, modern Bundeswehr looks more German than it did all the time before the 1990s.
it sort of found back to its own style rather than just copying from the US