Captured Soviet naval vessels in Finnish use?

[BIGpanzer]

Juha wrote:
Actually I was looking for the word "small" at the Soviet official classification at this occasion.

Especially for your knowledge, Soviet official classification of relatively small ships with powerful artillery armament [examples]:
1) Monitors - sea-going [ex-Finnish "Vyborg"], large river-going ["Khasan"-type, 1800 tons], medium river-going ["Shkval"-type, 965 tons] and small river-going ["Udarny"-type, 370 tons].
2) Gunboats - sea-going ["Krasnoe znamya", 1660 tons], river-going ["Usyskin"-type]
3) Armored motor-boats - sea-going or "skerry monitors" [project 161, 158 tons], large river-going [project 1124, 45 tons] and small river-going [project 1125, 26 tons].
Any questions?

Juha wrote:
In Finnish terminology gunboat size can vary quite much from small gun armed motorboats to Krasnoje Znamja size large gunboat types.

That was clear for me from the very beginning. The question is that Soviet terminology didn't vary quite much in such a case, and the expression "captured Soviet gunboat" is wrong [for example, all Soviet Baltic Sea gunboats were of 500-1660 tons displacement, not of 26 tons as project 1125]. The only correct is "captured Soviet armored motor-boat", and after capture Finns can reclassified it as they want, even into battleship

Juha wrote:
BP wrote earlier:
As for "Väinämöinen" - quite many books mention it as battleship of coastal defense
Many incorrect sources you then have read.

Disagree, these sources just try to use some kind of "international classification" to the warships of all navies. And as we know - different navies [small and large] have differ classifications For example, sea-going large armor-plated ships of the end of XIX c.: there were squadron and for coastal defense. Squadron armor-plated ships developed into battleships of XX century, and armor-plated ships for coastal defense didn't develop so much and sometimes they were called as battleships of coastal defense [more or less correct]. But it will be better to use special classification for them, something like armored ship for coastal defense [the same as in XIX c.]

Juha wrote:
If you don't like to be corrected, why did you then start that here?

I like to be corrected in essence. And I just corrected the epithet "captured Soviet gunboat" [as I thought what it could be until I saw youtube video], but you continued to find more insignificant incorrectnesses a lot till great boring [for example, patrol boat or patrol gunboat several times]. Thanks for corrections anyway

Thanks for the interesting links about Finnish gunboats! I still don't understand the difference between patrol boat [were they are?] and patrol gunboat in Finnish Navy? Were patrol boats armed with only MGs? Were patrol gunboats armored always?

Regards, BP

[Juha Tompuri]

Actually I was looking for the word "small" at the Soviet official classification at this occasion.

Especially for your knowledge, Soviet official classification of relatively small ships with powerful artillery armament [examples]:...Armored motor-boats... small river-going [project 1125, 26 tons].
Any questions?

As I don't read russian, this is a bit difficult, but AFAIK this is the source of some of your links: http://www.vmk.tsure.ru/misc/ship_model ... -boat.html I think there is a mention of armored motorboat/cutter (Бронекатера ???) , but where is there the mention of "small" ?

after capture Finns can reclassified it as they want

captured Soviet gunboat.

= after capture.

BP wrote earlier:
As for "Väinämöinen" - quite many books mention it as battleship of coastal defense
Many incorrect sources you then have read.

Disagree, these sources just try to use some kind of "international classification" to the warships of all navies.

international = Russian?

But it will be better to use special classification for them, something like armored ship for coastal defense

Yes.

Thanks for corrections anyway
Thanks for the interesting links about Finnish gunboats?

You're welcome

I still don't understand the difference between patrol boat [were they are?] and patrol gunboat in Finnish Navy? Were patrol boats armed with only MGs?

AFAIK:
Patrol boats (vartiovene) could have mg's and/or guns
Patrol gunboats have gun

Were patrol gunboats armored always?

AFAIK, yes. (as I know only one of that type)

Regards, Juha

[BIGpanzer]

Juha wrote:
AFAIK, yes. (as I know only one of that type)
Patrol boats (vartiovene) could have mg's and/or guns
Patrol gunboats have gun

OK, this make question more clear. Emphasis is mine.

Juha wrote:
international = Russian?

Did USSR use such kind of vessels - armored ships of coastal defense?
International for naval questions means British much more often I use several old reference books of Royal Navy from 1940s. Russian sources [also German, Polish, British] I use for Russian vessels only.

About captured Soviet gunboat - I am tired........Soviet gunboat............

Juha wrote:
http://www.vmk.tsure.ru/misc/ship_model ... -boat.html I think there is a mention of armored motorboat/cutter (Áðîíåêàòåðà ???) , but where is there the mention of "small" ?

Áðîíåêàòåð means armored motor-boat (BKA) indeed [brone/áðîíå - armored; kater/êàòåð - motor-boat; a - plural end for some nouns]. The link just doesn't mention the differences between "bronekaters" because this is not a reference source about naval warships and their detailed classifications, just very short link about armored motor-boats [with good model photos].
See more useful for classifications links I just found [sorry, on Russian only, not international ] -
http://mkmagazin.almanacwhf.ru/mor_col/ ... _bo_45.htm
http://mkmagazin.almanacwhf.ru/mor_col/ ... _bo_47.htm

http://www.riverships.ru/russian/project_indexes.shtml
At home I can't open Russian sites for some unknown for me reason [bad connection?], so I just googled them and they seems to be about bronekaters' classifications...........
But the last one I can open - great site: all projects numbers for Soviet/Russian ships!
Lets see, 1124 - large river armored motor-boat and 1125 - small river armored motor-boat.

The classification I mentioned above is the official naval classification from 1944-1950 [cited according to Platonov]. Try to find the info about designer of Soviet BKA Benua for the classification of Soviet armored motor-boats, you will find sea-going (skerry monitors), large river-going and small river-going. In 1941 there were no skerry monitors so large river-going armored motor-boats (project 1124) were classified as large ones [without additional "river-going", and often were called as large till the end of WWII when skerry monitors were developed already, so this make some complexity].

Regards, BP

P.S. Congratulations with V-Day

[Juha Tompuri]

OK, this make question more clear.

Good.

international = Russian?

Did USSR use such kind of vessels - armored ships of coastal defense?
International for naval questions means British much more often I use several old reference books of Royal Navy from 1940s. Russian sources [also German, Polish, British] I use for Russian vessels only.

Does other than Russian sources of yours categorize Väinämöinen to some sort of battleship class?

http://www.vmk.tsure.ru/misc/ship_model ... -boat.html I think there is a mention of armored motorboat/cutter (Áðîíåêàòåðà ???) , but where is there the mention of "small" ?

Áðîíåêàòåð means armored motor-boat (BKA) indeed [brone/áðîíå - armored; kater/êàòåð - motor-boat; a - plural end for some nouns].

Lets see, 1124 - large river armored motor-boat and 1125 - small river armored motor-boat.

The classification I mentioned above is the official naval classification from 1944-1950 [cited according to Platonov]. Try to find the info about designer of Soviet BKA Benua for the classification of Soviet armored motor-boats, you will find sea-going (skerry monitors), large river-going and small river-going. In 1941 there were no skerry monitors so large river-going armored motor-boats (project 1124) were classified as large ones [without additional "river-going", and often were called as large till the end of WWII when skerry monitors were developed already, so this make some complexity].

I agree specially with the line I emphased.

P.S. Congratulations with V-Day

Thank you.
Congratulations to you too.
Did you celebrate it yesterday or is it at your program today?

Regards, Juha

[jdoe]

Few points here;

USSR never used coastal defence ships, but Russia did, for example in the battle of Tsushima strait in 1905. The problem is, that this classification is old, most of the ships in this class were scrapped and sold as metal junk before Finns had even considered of building one! Many sources I've looked, say that these ships were, de facto, battleships for small countries, which otherwise couldn't have a "real battleship". I know I'm mis-using this term, and all of you will be angry, but I think these ships are the real pocket-battleships Problem is, we can't place these ships anywhere. They're not light cruisers, let alone battlecruisers or heavy cruisers. They're certainly not real battleships. But then again, frigates, destroyers or gunboats would insult everyone. Corvettes? I've seen that term used also

I've seen the same term, coastal defence battleship, used. Can't refer to any specific article or book though, sorry. Naval history is not my area of expertise, at least not yet. Working on it!

And a small sidenote, we probably got our own classfication "panssarilaiva" from Sweden? They had their pansarskjep (or whatever) which had the same purpose and roughly the same size.

[BIGpanzer]

jdoe wrote:
USSR never used coastal defence ships, but Russia did, for example in the battle of Tsushima strait in 1905.....
Many sources I've looked, say that these ships were, de facto, battleships for small countries, which otherwise couldn't have a "real battleship". I know I'm mis-using this term, and all of you will be angry, but I think these ships are the real pocket-battleships

Yes, the same I've read. Many of those battleships of small countries represented pre-dreadnought battleships of small class for coastal defense - for example, Danish "Peder Skram" ["Herluf Trolle"-type] or Norwegian "Harald Haarfagre". Finns built modern ships for coastal defense differ from those old-types, the good term for them can be large sea-going monitors [the British classification for "Erebus", for example; the same did Soviets for "Vyborg"].

jdoe wrote:
And a small sidenote, we probably got our own classfication "panssarilaiva" from Sweden? They had their pansarskjep (or whatever) which had the same purpose and roughly the same size.

Most probably, yes.
Pansarskjep or pansarskepp [according to my German reference book from 1939]? IIRC Sweden used "Sverige"-type, "Oscar II"-type and "Aran"-type warships of this class during WWII.

Juha wrote:
Does other than Russian sources of yours categorize Väinämöinen to some sort of battleship class?

Who says about such classification in Russian sources?
Yes, quite many other sources [repeat this for you hmm...for the third time I guess, see above]. And [just in case, to avoid annoying repeating posts] I repeat ones more that armored ship for coastal defense is a good and correct term for them.
See the most common online source - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantserschip (note the first line). There are a huge amount of such examples in many other more detailed literature sources.
Russian sources about world's navies if you want to know categorize such ships as "áðîíåíîñöû áåðåãîâîé îáîðîíû", translate this by yourself but I don't see any battleship here [battleship = ëèíåéíûé êîðàáëü on Russian].
And as I am not sure that you want/can translate the Russian term above, I make your life easier - this means armored ships of coastal defense.

P.S. IIRC Mannerheim proudly named "Väinämöinen" as Finnish battleship in the talk with Hitler. This is not official Finnish classification, of course, but just for the info. I've read this in some of German sources long ago, so I can't remember where exactly.

Juha wrote:
I agree specially with the line I emphased.

About some complexity of classification...No problems with armored motor-boats - there were large [1124] and small [1125] in 1941 only.

Juha wrote:
Did you celebrate it yesterday or is it at your program today?

8th May. I had no good idea how to celebrate it - just read a little bit more posts at our favourite AHF

Regards, BP

P.S. Let's stay in topic. OK? I will post all info I know about found or confiscated by Finns Soviet ships - one armored motor-boat, four torpedo motor-boats, several tugs built in Finland for USSR in 1940-1941 and several old steamers of Ladoga Lake. Strange, that Finnish members didn't post this info before me. Any additional info?

P.S.2. In my opinion there is no any need to quote any sentences above as everything is completelly clear. But I guess that Juha will try to quote every line again and again So I think that the best answer in such cases should be "thanks, Juha for your reply"

[Juha Tompuri]

Does other than Russian sources of yours categorize Väinämöinen to some sort of battleship class?

Who says about such classification in Russian sources?

(Your) Russian based sources.

See the most common online source - http://en.wikipedia.org

Yes,the ultimate source of information

P.S. IIRC Mannerheim proudly named "Väinämöinen" as Finnish battleship in the talk with Hitler. This is not official Finnish classification, of course, but just for the info. I've read this in some of German sources long ago, so I can't remember where exactly.

Neither can I remember such.

No problems with armored motor-boats - there were large [1124] and small [1125] in 1941 only.

Might be at some Soviet terminology, as Coast(al) Defence Ships are at Finnish terminolgy.

Regards, Juha

[BIGpanzer]

Thanks, Juha, for your reply!

Juha wrote:
Does other than Russian sources of yours categorize Väinämöinen to some sort of battleship class?
BP wrote:
Who says about such classification in Russian sources?
Juha wrote:
(Your) Russian based sources.

This is 100% completelly your claim, and this is wrong assumption . I've already corrected you [see above].
Read also the post from jdoe - but, unfortunately, he didn't mention at which sources [British or Finnish or some else] he read about battleships of coastal defense.
I repeat the forth time for you - I used British old reference books [and one German] in that case [battleships of coastal defense]. I repeat the 2nd time for you - all Russian sources classify those foreign ships very correct as armored ships of coastal defense [and in USSR "Vyborg" was classified as sea monitor because there were no ascd in Soviet navy]. Should I repeat this for the 3rd, 4th, etc. time : making toleration that Juha doesn't understand even very clear info at the first time quite often? Please, save me from this, I prefer to save my time.
Nonsense talk - Väinämöinen was armored ship of coastal defense, everybody agrees here.

Juha wrote:
as Coast(al) Defence Ships are at Finnish terminolgy.

What problems did have Finns with their terminology about Coastal Defense Ships?
This kind of problem -

Juha wrote: AFAIK Väinämöinen was either Panssarilaiva (sometimes also mentioned as Rannikkopanssarilaiva)

Soviet naval terminology seems to be more ranked and clear than Finnish [especially with gunboats of all possible size] despite the presence of much more classes of different warships in Soviet Navy.

Best regards, BP

P.S. So no any additional info about ex-Soviet ships in Finnish service?

[Juha Tompuri]

Does other than Russian sources of yours categorize Väinämöinen to some sort of battleship class?
BP wrote:
Who says about such classification in Russian sources?
Juha wrote:
(Your) Russian based sources.

This is 100% completelly your claim, and this is wrong assumption . I've already corrected you [see above].
I repeat the forth time for you - I used British old reference books [and one German] in that case. I repeat the 2nd time for you - Russian sources classify those ships as armored ships of coastal defense. Should I repeat this for the 3rd, 4th, etc. time

You don't have to do that, just only check the web sources you have (most probably) used to post here:
http://www.battleships.spb.ru/KO/0196/Vainamoinen.html

As for "Väinämöinen" - quite many books mention it as battleship of coastal defense [and those databases never mention small armored motor-boats as gunboats ]. Yes, I know that in reality it was "coastal defense ship" [rannikkopuolustuksen panssarilavia]. Exact translation, please!

Väinämöinen was armored ship of coastal defense

As translations seldom are 1:1 to the original, that's a reasonably correct translation.
Much better than the battleship related.

as Coast(al) Defence Ships are at Finnish terminolgy.

What problems did have Finns with their terminology about Coastal Defense Ships?
This kind of problem -

AFAIK Väinämöinen was either Panssarilaiva (sometimes also mentioned as Rannikkopanssarilaiva)

AFAIK Panssarilaiva is official, Rannikkopanssarilaiva is understandable and sometimes used (IIRC the ships were ordered/designed at that designation at the late 1920's)

Regards, Juha

[BIGpanzer]

Juha wrote:
You don't have to do that, just only check the web sources you have (most probably) used to post here:
http://www.battleships.spb.ru/KO/0196/Vainamoinen.html

The probability is small as besides Russian I can read on many other languages
The mentioned link is good and quite correct source about warships of Finnish [and other world's] navies, I know it [a little bit "anti-Russian" concerning the description of WWII events, nevertheless].
But as for online sources - I used only this one in this case [in addition to old reference-books from 1930s-1940s at my home]:
http://warships.web4u.cz/typy.php?language=&stat=FIN

Regards, BP

P.S.
If you prefer Russian-language sources - here is the best from Byelorussia about Väinämöinen [with several photos below]: http://ship.bsu.by/main.asp?id=102809&TPL=1
This is on Polish [photos] - note the classification as coastal cruisers
http://www.warship.get.net.pl/Finlandia ... hotos.html
Note the classification [to your question what other sources "besides Russian" ] - http://navalhistory.flixco.info/H/288489/8330/a0.htm [battleship 2nd class Väinämöinen]

P.S.2
Russian sources give the most correct classification for these - armored ships of coastal defense [the same classification was used for Russian ships of that class in XIX-begXX c.c.]
http://militera.lib.ru/memo/russian/che ... _ap/31.jpg
[famous Baltic armored ship of coastal defense "Admiral Ushakov" which was heavily damaged in combat with three Japanese cruisers at Tsushima but didn't capitulate and was sank by its crew].

[Juha Tompuri]

Juha wrote:
You don't have to do that, just only check the web sources you have (most probably) used to post here:
http://www.battleships.spb.ru/KO/0196/Vainamoinen.html

The probability is small as besides Russian I can read on many other languages
The mentioned link is good and quite correct source about warships of Finnish [and other world's] navies, I know it [a little bit "anti-Russian" concerning the description of WWII events, nevertheless].
But as for online sources - I used only this one in this case [in addition to old reference-books from 1930s-1940s at my home]:
http://warships.web4u.cz/typy.php?language=&stat=FIN

That sound possible too, as also that page is one of the very few net sources that contain the same (meaningless) typo as at your post.

If you prefer Russian-language sources - here is the best from Byelorussia about Väinämöinen [with several photos below]: http://ship.bsu.by/main.asp?id=102809&TPL=1

Thanks, new to me, but............AFAIK...........the same incorrect battleship designations as at the Russian pages again.......

This is on Polish [photos] - note the classification as coastal cruisers
http://www.warship.get.net.pl/Finlandia ... hotos.html

I knew this before.
Better source of photos than designation.

Note the classification [to your question what other sources "besides Russian" ] - http://navalhistory.flixco.info/H/288489/8330/a0.htm [battleship 2nd class Väinämöinen]

link doesn't work, but nevertheless, a good find of incorrect info.

P.S.2
Russian sources give the most correct classification for these - armored ships of coastal defense [the same classification was used for Russian ships of that class in XIX-begXX c.c.]
http://militera.lib.ru/memo/russian/che ... _ap/31.jpg

Quite correct, but "overtranslated" rare example from Russia.
Usually the Russian sources give the incorrect battleship designation.

Regards, Juha

[BIGpanzer]

I am returning back to the topic!

I found a mention that Finnish MTB V-2 participated in the defense of Goglang against German landing operation 14.09.1944, fired torpedo [Finns reported the enemy ship hit but later it was realized that launching was unsuccessful - torpedo hit rocks] and V-2 was relatively lightly damaged by 4 artillery hits [1 crewmember was wounded].
At 6:00 all 5 Finnish MTBs returned back to the base and at 6:45 36 Soviet aircraft of Baltic Sea Navy started to attack German ships [after report of Finnish MTB commanders about their location] near Gogland according to Finnish request to help with air support when Finnish reserve [577 men] surrounded three German troops.

Any additional details/confirmations? Was that V-2 ex-TKA-141?

Regards, BP

P.S.

Juha wrote:
Usually the Russian sources give the incorrect battleship designation.

Up till now - the most correct battleship designation for Finnish coastal defense ships [and for other warships AFAIK]. But for British and US ships with their detailed classifications of small and patrol ships it will be better to use original sources.
You just don't know Russian reference sources [literature]. Sometimes I am ordering them via Internet, and they are among the best.

Juha wrote:
Thanks, new to me, but............AFAIK...........the same incorrect battleship designations as at the Russian pages again.......

You are really crazy or you need to use another online translator. The link mentioned Väinämöinen as armored ship of coastal defense again [áðîíåíîñåö áåðåãîâîé îáîðîíû], which is the most correct designation. Or do you mean the designations of battleships of another navies there?

Juha wrote:
link doesn't work, but nevertheless, a good find of incorrect info.

The link works. The designation is strange [battleship of 2nd class], that is why I am posting it to show the great divergence in classifications. But technical info about Väinämöinen is quite detailed.

Regards, BP

[Juha Tompuri]

I found a mention that Finnish MTB V-2 participated in the defense of Goglang against German landing operation 14.09.1944, fired torpedo [Finns reported the enemy ship hit but later it was realized that launching was unsuccessful - torpedo hit rocks] and V-2 was relatively lightly damaged by 4 artillery hits [1 crewmember was wounded].
At 6:00 all 5 Finnish MTBs returned back to the base and at 6:45 36 Soviet aircraft of Baltic Sea Navy started to attack German ships [after report of Finnish MTB commanders about their location] near Gogland according to Finnish request to help with air support when Finnish reserve [577 men] surrounded three German troops.

Any additional details/confirmations? Was that V-2 ex-TKA-141?

P.S.2
Soviet TK-51 [future Finnish V-3 and Soviet TK-90] together with TK-101 sank German mine-sweeper M37 04.06.1944.

Interesting.
About three months later the same boat attacked German (also M-class) ships, this time at Finnish hands.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... t=#1055568
Both V-2 and V-3 took part to the attack
AFAIK three M-class minesweepers were hit and damaged at the Finnish MTB attacks.

Up till now - the most correct battleship designation for Finnish coastal defense ships

One of the most correct Russian ones.
That's something.

Thanks, new to me, but............AFAIK...........the same incorrect battleship designations as at the Russian pages again.......

You are really crazy or you need to use another online translator. The link mentioned Väinämöinen as armored ship of coastal defense again [áðîíåíîñåö áåðåãîâîé îáîðîíû]. You are wrong again and again.....

As you speak Russian, and I don't, could you please translate here this part from the link you posted:

Окончательно программа была оформлена 22 декабря 1927 г. в виде «Закона об основах флота береговой обороны», согласно которому к постройке намечались два броненосца береговой обороны (БрБО) водоизмещением по 3800 т и стоимостью по 100 млн марок

Regards, Juha

[BIGpanzer]

Hi, Juha!
Sorry, very short answer as I am extremelly tired at work today and still need to work at my computer during this night.

Juha wrote:
Interesting.
About three months later the same boat attacked German (also M-class) ships, this time at Finnish hands.
Both V-2 and V-3 took part to the attack

Yes, I remembered your post above when I tried to find more detailed info about the battle of Finns with Germans off Gogland [participation of those ex-Soviet Finnish MTBs].
What about V-1 which served in the same Finnish squadron of G-5-type MTBs?

Juha wrote:
AFAIK three M-class minesweepers were hit and damaged at the Finnish MTB attacks.

I have read the following: Finns sent 1st flotilla of MTBs from Kotka and 2nd flotilla of MTBs from Klamina - MTBs attacked Germans and damaged 1 tug and 1 mine-sweeper [see above]. Several torpedos hit rocks but Finnish captains thought that was hits at enemy warships. All 5 Finnish MTBs returned back to the base, only V-2 was damaged [4 hits, 1 wounded men].
Soviet aviation sank 6 artillery barges [F-173A, F-175A, F-177A, F-822D, F-868D, LT-499], 4 patrol motor-boats, 2 sea tugs ["Polip" and "Pernau" - the last one was damaged by Finnish MTB T-5 before], 3 small landing ships [No. 1, 35, 31], 3 minesweepers [2 confirmed - R-29 was damaged by Finnish coastal battery and sank by Soviet bomber, R-76 was damaged by torpedo from T-5 [one source mentions that from "Nuoli", but AFAIK old "Nuoli" was removed from service 08.1942] and sank by Soviet bomber].

Juha wrote:
One of the most correct Russian ones.

And one of the most correct al all as it was expected. Which designation is more correct than "armored ship of coastal defense"? Battleship of 2nd class, coastal cruiser or even coast defense ship [could be unarmored - BP]?

Juha wrote:
As you speak Russian, and I don't, could you please translate here this part from the link you posted:

Îêîí÷àòåëüíî ïðîãðàììà áûëà îôîðìëåíà 22 äåêàáðÿ 1927 ã. â âèäå «Çàêîíà îá îñíîâàõ ôëîòà áåðåãîâîé îáîðîíû», ñîãëàñíî êîòîðîìó ê ïîñòðîéêå íàìå÷àëèñü äâà áðîíåíîñöà áåðåãîâîé îáîðîíû (ÁðÁÎ) âîäîèçìåùåíèåì ïî 3800 ò è ñòîèìîñòüþ ïî 100 ìëí ìàðîê

About any good speaking Russian I am not sure because of strong "occupational accent" as my Russian colleagues always say me and very complicated Russian grammar [but I began to understand Russian texts quite well indeed].
I am trying to translate [as you've mentioned it is always hard to translate 1:1].

The program was finally completed 22 December 1927 as "Act about principles of navy of coastal defense". According to it it was planned to built two armored ships of coastal defense [BrBO] with the displacement 3800 tons each and cost 100 milliones markkaa each.

My note: BrBO = Bronenosets Beregovoi Oborony = Armored ship of Coastal Defense.
I never saw that Russian sources [and Russia always had/has many excellent naval historians] mention Väinämöinen/Ilmarinen as battleships. They are mentioned as BrBO of Finnish Navy always, and Väinämöinen is mentioned also as sea-going monitor when it became "Vyborg" of Soviet Navy.
IIRC even Soviet documents of 1939-1940 also always mentioned those warships as BrBO.

Best regards, BP

P.S. I asked the question but nobody answered. AFAIK all ex-Soviet MTBs were returned back to USSR in the end of WWII and were overhauled after that. Was the reason their quite bad condition/damages after wartime service in Finnish Navy or just reequipment back according to Soviet naval standards?

[BIGpanzer]

Interesting, what I could find about the organization of Finnish torpedo motor-boat units according to the reference-books of WWII period:

Two flotilla of MTBs existed in 1943 - 1st [8 "Taisto"-type + 4 "Jumy"-type of group Bianchini] and 2nd [5 "Hurja"-type and 3 ex-Soviet D-3 & G-5]. In 1944 "Jumy"s were given to 2nd flotilla and ex-Soviet MTBs to 1st flotilla [so that MTBs of each flotilla had approximatelly similar specifications].


Best regards, BP