Petrovski Jam

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Mangrove
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Mangrove » 31 Dec 2012 12:36

Juha Tompuri wrote:Could you then post here the part of it where the target area no3 of the supply base is mentioned at the report?
I have quoted everything relevant there is from Petrovski Jam on my post on 18 October. For clarity's sake, I will write this once again; there is nothing on the interrogation reports about the exact size of the Petrovski Jam base, number of buildings or their intended use.

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Juha Tompuri
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Juha Tompuri » 31 Dec 2012 16:23

Martti Kujansuu wrote: For clarity's sake, I will write this once again; there is nothing on the interrogation reports about the exact size of the Petrovski Jam base, number of buildings or their intended use.
Actually I read that info here for the first time, but thanks for that piece of information.
Here another detail from the same post of yours:
Martti wrote:The plan made before the raid does not mention any details about the storages on the base.
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 5#p1741889

Then...based on information received from you... this claim:
Bair wrote:The first prisoner, starshina Boris Hohlogorski, was from the supply base Petrovski Jam. He told Finns everything about the supply base.
.. does not correrspond with reality.

Regards, Juha

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jdoe
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by jdoe » 31 Dec 2012 19:25

My source does not put any details on what Hohlogorski exactly told the interrogators, but it says "sijainti ja tukikohdan tehtäväkenttä" (location and the duties of the base) the latter which was to support and supply Maaselkä sector.

As far as I can tell from different sources, the last two POW captured just days before the operation began (maybe caught by Os. Lagus patrols or 14.D patrols?), told more details about the base. Added to this, there were recent aerial recon photos to work with. This is another interesting detail, which units and at what point and with what equipment were these aerial recon flights made? Does anyone have any good sources about LeLv 44? I would guess that would be the unit that did the aerial recon. Or maybe some Army Corp -level aerial recon unit?

What each and every building on the area was, was most probably not clear when the operation began. Patrols ran into trouble destroying everything at targets 1 and 2 because there was more stuff to destroy than one patrol could deal with. Mainly trucks and large storage facilities. They used a lot of incendiary bombs and boxes to deal with this problem.

However, from the preliminary briefing documents, it seems to be that certain main components of the base were clear or at least they had a very good "hunch" what each of the target areas were. For example, they knew about the logistics base (target 1) and the veterinary hospital for horses, and of the bakery. They also knew about the transit camp before operation started.

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jdoe
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by jdoe » 31 Dec 2012 19:44

Ok, the digital archives from www.narc.fi provides the following;

LeLv 44 did aerial recon missions from 27.1.1942 - 7.2.1942 on the area of Petrovski Jam, supplying Er.P 4 with aerial recon photos. At least 3 Blenheim-bombers took part in this, BL-106, -107 and -111.

You can browse the war diaries from 27.1.-> behind this link; http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=3609985

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Vaeltaja » 31 Dec 2012 20:08

Reading through the Air Force HQ situation reports of that period it appears that both circumstances as well as bad (cloudy) weather kept Blenheims from photographing duties until 5.2.1942 ( http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4446647 ) as just day before Air Force CO essentially states that tasks given on 27.1. were still to be fulfilled ( http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4446644 ). Piecing together the information the aircraft was BL-107 and altitude from which the photographs were taken was 7 500 m.

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Mangrove » 31 Dec 2012 20:42

jdoe wrote: As far as I can tell from different sources, the last two POW captured just days before the operation began (maybe caught by Os. Lagus patrols or 14.D patrols?), told more details about the base.
This diary lists every POW interrogated by units under Karjalan Armeija during February 1942. I do not see any references to a supply base from the summaries written on to the diary. However two soldiers were captured on 4 February. They belonged to some sort of fortification unit operating at the general direction of Petrovski Jam.

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jdoe
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by jdoe » 02 Jan 2013 16:03

Vaeltaja wrote:Reading through the Air Force HQ situation reports of that period it appears that both circumstances as well as bad (cloudy) weather kept Blenheims from photographing duties until 5.2.1942 ( http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4446647 ) as just day before Air Force CO essentially states that tasks given on 27.1. were still to be fulfilled ( http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4446644 ). Piecing together the information the aircraft was BL-107 and altitude from which the photographs were taken was 7 500 m.
Ah, you are correct. Other planes did take off on other days, but they either were sent to try out enemy air defence / fighter response on the area, or had to turn back due to the weather problem. Maybe target area was covered with low cast clouds or mist etc.? Weather was a problem at the starting point too.

Have to say, the handwriting of the person who wrote that diary, is pretty difficult to read :P

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Mangrove » 14 May 2013 07:53

According to the National Bibliography of Finland, a new book about the raid is going to be published soon under a name "Kaukopartio-operaatio Petrovski Jam: legendaarinen sissi-isku vai sotarikos". The author is Bair Irincheev.

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Jagala » 14 May 2013 11:52

Image

Out in October 2013.

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Juha Tompuri
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Juha Tompuri » 07 Sep 2013 23:11

Jagala wrote:Out in October 2013.

Preliminary date or release 30th October 2013:
http://cdon.fi/kirjat/irincheev,_bair/k ... m-23503307

Regards, Juha

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Juha Tompuri
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Juha Tompuri » 15 Oct 2013 18:24

This old site http://web.archive.org/web/200709302115 ... uusari.htm mentions that Vihtori Huusari served at Petrovski Jam as a comissar.
True?
Interesting as Huusari was from Myllykoski and a distant relative of mine.

Regards, Juha

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by kuuskajaskari » 02 Nov 2013 16:06

Jagala wrote:Image

Out in October 2013.

I read the book, a lot of things still remain unclear.
The book is written very objectively, Finnish are not accused of war crimes.
Lost and corrected memos and reports do not make things any easier.
I recommend reading the book, a lot of repetition of the old, but a lot of new information.

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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by kuuskajaskari » 02 Nov 2013 16:17

kuuskajaskari wrote:Hello all and have a nice Mid-Summer.

Who is able to locate this monument in the Google Earth map?
Well, now I know the place and the man who made it...

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igor_verh
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by igor_verh » 02 Nov 2013 18:41

Expedition to Petrovskiy Jam 15-19 August 2013:
http://petrredsea.livejournal.com/41221.html

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Juha Tompuri
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Re: Petrovski Jam

Post by Juha Tompuri » 16 Nov 2013 18:04

kuuskajaskari wrote:I read the book, a lot of things still remain unclear.
The book is written very objectively, Finnish are not accused of war crimes.
Lost and corrected memos and reports do not make things any easier.
I recommend reading the book, a lot of repetition of the old, but a lot of new information.
Yep, after reading the book about the same feelings here.
There is for instance quite little info about how the hospital area at the supply base was marked by the Soviet side.
Also quite little info about how much the hospital was used at a guesthouse role, to other military personel than the wounded and the hospital staff.

Regards, Juha

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