Naval warfare

[igorr]

Which ship - IL or VA?
http://i47.fastpic.ru/big/2013/0418/6a/ ... 8cd96a.jpg

[Juha Tompuri]

Ilmarinen, according to a photo # 30218 at http://sa-kuva.fi/ taken 28th July 1941 at Turku archipelago.

Regards, Juha

[igorr]

Thanks Juha!

[Vaeltaja]

Tugs the Finnish VMV boats captured (I-18 and Paldiski) can be seen in photo #39859 of sa-kuva.fi archives (image caption: Kaapatut hinaajat I-18 ja Paldiski.)

[Juha Tompuri]

Shch-308, submarine “Iku-Turso” (torpedo), 26.10.42

This attack was headed to Shch-307 and she escaped unhurt.
308's sunk most likely on mine 21-23.10.42

This has been discussed in quite a detail, and it is (actually IIRC it was pretty much from the start) agreed that Iku-Turso first encountered Shch-307 in poor visibility and then lost it after shooting at it with guns (not torpedoes). While hunting for the Soviet sub Iku-Turso came across another Shch class boat (which it believed to be the same) which it sunk with torpedoes. Finns never knew which sub it was that they had sunk, only that torpedo detonated, sub disappeared and at the site of the torpedo impact there was large pillar of oil flowing to the surface.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... t#p1033150 on.

Finns never knew which sub it was that they had sunk

Target is AFAIK either Shch-308 or Shch-320.

Seems so.

Shch-406 and Shch-320 found near Tytärsaari at minefield Seeigel
http://tsushima.su/forums/viewtopic.php?id=9919
http://tass.ru/obschestvo/4231522

[Vaeltaja]

That is great news. It is always better to know what happened than to live in uncertainty. I just hope they can find Shch-308 so that we could finally confirm what happened to it. After all there still are two contradicting versions for it.

[igorr]

It is said that SHCH-308 may be already found too: http://www.tsushima.su/forums/viewtopic.php?id=9929&p=1
#22-23

[Juha Tompuri]

Thanks Igorr

[ljaager]

I am looking for further information about the Hildana, Estonia.

[Ruotsinsalmi]

Hi Ijaager
I don't know if something is mentioned before about Hildana, at least I don't find any.
The war diary of 2.Rannikkoprikaati II linnakkeisto 1941-1942 (21501) page 25 (Roughly "Second Coastal Brigade, second Fortress 1941-1942) mentions, that 7. December 1941 the outlook point of southern part of island Ulko-Tammio noticed a drifting 3 masted scooner near solid ice, distance 1,5 kilometres to direction 75 degrees. The ship was manned and 6 men was arrested (estonians?). The ship Hildana had left Suursaari (Hogland) day before at 1415 hours towed by the ship Udarnik, assisted by an unmentioned ship but the towing line/rope had broken several times and the ship was left drifting. Then set sails to sail to the finnish coast. The ship was loaded with empty gasoline barrels, lubricant oil, depth charges, one motor generator and a safe. December 10. minelayer Pukkio towed Hildana to the northern bay of island Ulko-Tammio whwre it was left during the winter. If I remember right, Hildana was later given some finnish girls name like Anni. The ship was later used by finns as transport vessel. I will later add more information if I find it.

[ljaager]

Thank you so much for this information. My Vana Isa (grandfather) was one of those 6 Estonians and this information is priceless. Tänan teid väga.

[Ruotsinsalmi]

Ole lahke!

[Mangrove]

The war diary of 2.Rannikkoprikaati II linnakkeisto 1941-1942 (21501) page 25 (Roughly "Second Coastal Brigade, second Fortress 1941-1942) mentions, that 7. December 1941 the outlook point of southern part of island Ulko-Tammio noticed a drifting 3 masted scooner near solid ice, distance 1,5 kilometres to direction 75 degrees.

There is some additional information on the diary of the Finnish Navy HQ. The ship was first spotted at 4.50 a.m. on 6 December 1941. The diary identifies "Hildana" as a 100 ton galleass (kaljaasi) with 80 hp engine, not as schooner (kuunari). She was suppose to take a load of food supplies from Seiskari to Leningrad.

There's probably a more detailed interrogation report in the National Archives of Finland.

[Ruotsinsalmi]

Hi Mangrove!
I wrote the word kuunari/scooner instead of kaljaasi/galeass because it is often more common word to describe a fore and aft-rigged sailing vessel. Outside Baltics area galeass is an ancient slow wooden ship with very simple sail or sails as a Baltic galeass is more sophisticated, often quite fast and manouverable gargo vessel, later usually equipped with an auxiliary engine. In many translations kaljaasi is mentioned as baltic scooner.
In some maritime forums there is never-endind discussion going on about some vessels, is it galeass/kaljaasi, scooner/kuunari, scoonership/kuunarilaiva or barkentine/parkentiini or even scooner-barque/kuunariparkki...in many cases they all look the same. That is one discussion I will never participate!
According to Estonian ship calender Hildana was a "mootorkuunar", that is m/aux, scooner with auxiliary engine.
Pekka

[Seppo Koivisto]

Wreck of Shch-302 is found sank by mine.
https://www.ts.fi/uutiset/kotimaa/45760 ... uonna+1942