Russian POWs and VT-line construction

[farmer]

Hi guys!

I propose to discuss a theme of using russian POWs in construction works on VT-line.

There are very many questions concerning that. For example:
1. How many russian workers were involved in a process as a whole?
2. Which kind of works did they do?
3. Where did they live?
4. Were they evacuated with a beginning of russian offensive on 6/9/1944?

To be more exact I am first interested in getting any info concerning camp of russian POWs near Sahakylä pys.
May be somebody knows something about its exact location and history, meaning all the questions mentioned above?

Many thanks,
Farmer

[Mangrove]

Have you read The Finnish POW and Internee Camp Handbook, 1939–1944 edited by Lars Westerlund?

To be more exact I am first interested in getting any info concerning camp of russian POWs near Sahakylä pys.
May be somebody knows something about its exact location and history, meaning all the questions mentioned above?

According to the book, only L-25. Sotavankikomppania ("L-25 POW Company"), later known as 14. sotavankikomppania ("14th POW Company"), was based at Sahakylä between November 1941 and March 1942, but also some time in 1944.

It seems that only the war diary covering dates between 1 December 1941 and 3 March 1942 has survived. According to the diary, 200 POWs were sent to the camp in late 1941, out of which one was shot on 17 November 1941. According to "Prisoner-of-war deaths and people handed over in Finland" database, only one POW was shot on that day (Shukanai Iskakov).

[farmer]

Hello Mangrove!
Thank you very much for your quick and informative reply.
Yes, I have read that interesting set of articles earlier but unfortunately did not find exact info concerning my questions there.

1. Could you please explain how did you know that L-25. Sotavankikomppania was located in Sahakylä? I looked the book through but could not find such info.
2. I see in L-25 war diary that the rest of prisoners (93 of 200) were transferred to 6209 formation on 3/3/1944. I checked this number and found the name of formation - 15.Sotavankikomppania (not 14th as you write). Am I right?
3. Also I looked through the database and found 8 POWs dead in L-25 during winter 1941-1942. One of them was shot (Sinkevich Vladimir Moiseevich). Is that correct?
http://kronos.narc.fi/search.php?sukuni ... lang=fi_FI
4. What was the structure, organization and targets of POW companies? To whom they were ordered? For example - I open war diary of 16.SVK and see that there served 2+9+47 finnish, so 58 men look after 194 POWs.
5. Is it possible to find more info about that? For example - locations of camps and locations of burials?

Thanks again,
Farmer

[Mangrove]

1. Could you please explain how did you know that L-25. Sotavankikomppania was located in Sahakylä? I looked the book through but could not find such info.

The history of the company is on page 160.

2. I see in L-25 war diary that the rest of prisoners (93 of 200) were transferred to 6209 formation on 3/3/1944. I checked this number and found the name of formation - 15.Sotavankikomppania (not 14th as you write). Am I right?

This seems to be true, however, the book and the page mentioned previously states that L25. sotavankikomppania was later renamed 14. sotavankikomppania. Again according to the book (page 161), "6209" was originally L26. Sotavankikomppania that was renamed 15, sotavankikomppania. However, it was located at nearby Perkjärvi.

4. What was the structure, organization and targets of POW companies? To whom they were ordered? For example - I open war diary of 16.SVK and see that there served 2+9+47 finnish, so 58 men look after 194 POWs.

I believe the POW companies were subjected directly under the Army Corps or equivalent along with various Linnoituspataljoona (literally "fortification battalion") units. There were also a few labour camps reserved for Finnish military prisoners under Kannaksen varavankila (literally "Karelian Isthmus Reserve Prison").

5. Is it possible to find more info about that? For example - locations of camps and locations of burials?

The exact burial locations can perhaps be found from the National Archives of Finland, but these files have not been digitised. The general locations are listed below each camp information on the book. L25/14. sotavankikomppania's dead POWs were buried in Rokkala at the municipality of Johannes and Vammelsuu.at the municipalities of Uusikirkko.

[farmer]

Thank you, Mangrove!

And exсuse me - I've made a mistake and read another Westerlund book.
So now I will study everything more attentively.

I appreciate your help.
Farmer

[farmer]

Hello, Mangrove!

According L-25 war diary there were 6 POWs shot during winter 1941-1942. Also I see that some of them were buried somewhere near "Kasakka kivi". Have anybody heard anything about this location?

Thanks,
Farmer

[Mangrove]

Also I see that some of them were buried somewhere near "Kasakka kivi". Have anybody heard anything about this location?

Kasakkakivi literally means "Cossack's rock". There are probably dozens of large rocks (glacial erratics) known by the name all around Finland and Karelia, one of the most famous is located at Hietala at Tienhaara. Since the name is not an official one, it can't be found from any of the official maps.

[farmer]

Thanks, Mangrove!

I see that I need to visit National Archives of Finland to clarify details.....

[farmer]

Hello Mangrove!

Could you please explain how it would be better to work with finnish military archives? As I know, some materials contained there were digitized and published on diginarc.fi.
How may I know which materials were not digitized yet?
And if I see some link for an archive unit in a scientific publication, how can I find the same one in diginarc.fi or narc.fi?
For example, I found a link in Tiihonen dissertation "T-17654/17, Koulus os., Ted.os./PM", so where can I find the document?

Many thanks,
Farmer

[Mangrove]

How may I know which materials were not digitized yet?

When it comes to the Winter, Continuation and Lapland War era documents, only the war diaries have been (mostly) digitised. Their signum is SPK followed by a series of numbers.

For example, I found a link in Tiihonen dissertation "T-17654/17, Koulus os., Ted.os./PM", so where can I find the document?

Most of the Continuation War era documents have been arranged under the signum "T" followed by a series of numbers. In this case, "17" is the number of the individual folder under signum T 17654. The only way to access these is to go in person to the National Archives of Finland in Helsinki. However, the signum content database is available online at http://kronos.narc.fi/aarre/aarre.php.

[farmer]

Most of the Continuation War era documents have been arranged under the signum "T" followed by a series of numbers. In this case, "17" is the number of the individual folder under signum T 17654. The only way to access these is to go in person to the National Archives of Finland in Helsinki. However, the signum content database is available online at http://kronos.narc.fi/aarre/aarre.php.

Thank you, Mangrove!
Your suggestions are always very valuable!

[farmer]

Hello everybody!

Getting back to L-25 history.......

I put together several sources and now see that L.25.SVK (later 15. or 14.SVK) could be subordinated to 4th dept. of Kan.R/IV AK and used togeter with differnt Lin.RP's. For example:
- Lin.RP 251. In 1941 batallion took part in works on Karelian Isthmus from Viipuri to Tyrisrvä. In Nov-Dec 1941 5 SVK (about 1000 men) were subordinated to that unit. SVK's locations - Kämärä, Johannes, Leipäsuo, Vuottaa, Vammelsuu. According to the war diary of L.25 in winter 1941-1942 POW's were burried somewhere near "Kasakkakivi". It's interesting to know that such geo. object exists and can be found on a 200m map to the east from Kämärä. There was work sector of 3./Lin.RP 251. In Feb 1942 bat. was transfered to Vammelsuu-Vanhasaha-Sahakylä and worked on VT-line till 11.6.1944. So I may suppose that there may be several camps for russian prisoners or a big one in Sahakylä;
- Lin.RP 255 (Jan - Aug 1942, location - Vanhasaha);
- Lin.RP 232 (dates?, Vammelsuu - Kotselkä);
- Lin.RP 425 (Aug 1943 - Jun 1944, Kotselkä - Onkamojärvi - Kuuterselkä (?));
- Lin.RP Sak 5 (Jun 1943 - Jun 1944, Kuuterselkä).

There are also some questions:
Does anybody know about a movi wich was made 3/15/1944 on VT-line construction by some war cameraman sent from Headquarters?
According some indirect info at the end of Dec 1943 russian transport plane fell down somewhere 3km to the east of Kuuterselkä and several crew members were captured alive. Does anybody know anything about that plane and men?

BR
Farmer

[Juha Tompuri]

Hi,

According some indirect info at the end of Dec 1943 russian transport plane fell down somewhere 3km to the east of Kuuterselkä and several crew members were captured alive. Does anybody know anything about that plane and men?

AAD (102 AP) LI-2 was shot down 12th December 1943 and Finns got 14 POW's from the force landed plane.
C.F. Geust has studied the case, and something about the issue and the crew list can be viewed here:
http://www.arkisto.fi/uploads/Palvelut/ ... UT_WEB.pdf
Pages 223-225 about the case
Pages 258-259 the crew list

Regards, Juha

[farmer]

Hi,

According some indirect info at the end of Dec 1943 russian transport plane fell down somewhere 3km to the east of Kuuterselkä and several crew members were captured alive. Does anybody know anything about that plane and men?

AAD (102 AP) LI-2 was shot down 12th December 1943 and Finns got 14 POW's from the force landed plane.
C.F. Geust has studied the case, and something about the issue and the crew list can be viewed here:
http://www.arkisto.fi/uploads/Palvelut/ ... UT_WEB.pdf
Pages 223-225 about the case
Pages 258-259 the crew list

Regards, Juha

Thank you, Juha!
I will study that attentively.
Farmer

[Lotvonen]

AAD (102 AP) LI-2 was shot down 12th December 1943 and Finns got 14 POW's from the force landed plane.
C.F. Geust has studied the case, and something about the issue and the crew list can be viewed here:
http://www.arkisto.fi/uploads/Palvelut/ ... UT_WEB.pdf
Pages 223-225 about the case

Quick translation of the referenced opus citatus:

ADD HQ aircraft forced landing 12. Dec. 1943

The Interrogation Center recently set up in Viipuri was involved in a real case as soon as 12.Dec. 1943 as a Li-2 transport aircraft of ADD made a forced landing on the Carelian Isthmus.

The aircraft was about to land in the Finnish airbase of Suulajärvi as the pilot found his error and pulled up, trying to escape. Two AA batteries fired at the plane as well as Lt. Irho Sarjamo of HLeLv24 with his Brewster.

The Li-2 belly landed on a swamp 25km E of Mustamäki railway station. Two pilots had been killed in the crash but as many as 14 prisoners were taken. The imprisoned airmen were taken to Viipuri the next day to be interrogated..

Soon it was revealed that the plane had been a Li-2 carrying the preparatory detachment of the ADD 102. Flying Regiment that had got lost in fog over Lake Ladoga on their way to Levashovo air base situated in Southern Carelian Isthmus.

The pilots and passengers, most of all the CO of the 102. Flying regiment Operative Detachment Capt. Andrej tod to G.E. Strömberg exceptionally interesting details about the ADD, its organization and operation. Strömberg had been sent from the GHQ to lead the interrogation on 14.Sec. Together with military official S. Beliajeff.

Three wounded pilots had to be left in the POW hospital in Perkjärvi where Capt. Volanen ( the CO of the interrogation center) , Strömberg and Beliajeff interrogated thm on 15. Dec.
In the meanwhile the experts of LeR3 and Air force Radio Coy. interrogated the main group of the passengers in Viipuri. Strömberg returned to the GHQ on 16. 12. to write the interrogation protocol.

It can be mentioned here that also the memoir of the 102. Flying Regiment Military Technician N. Go rnostajev, published in 1990, includes a rather detailed description of the phases of the final flight of this aircraft. The Russians found it out as the nine POW pilots were returned to SU end o Oct 1944.

Strömberg completed the 11 page protocol on 17.12.1943. According to the document Capt. Korobov told that the future task of the ADD was mainly to raid the positions of the German siege artillery in preparation of the attack to break the siege of Leningrad.

Unfortunately the protocol does not tell if there was any indication, or questions, about any raids against Finland. The (Li-2) pilot, Jr.Lt. Georgij Kozovjakin was the only POW of the plane to be handed over to Germany on 8. Jan. 1944. The reason has not been mentioned.

Gornostajev's account implies that the POW airmen was subjected to a rather rough handling when they had returned to their homeland in 1944. NKVD may have had strong suspicions that the airmen had revealed the future strategic operation – the raids on Helsinki in February 1944.

This is also implied by the exceptional interest of the Allied Control Commission on the fate of this flight. As late as summer 1947 all the documents pertaining to the case were demanded to be surrendered. Exceptionally also was the demand to “interview” the Finnish officers who had interrogated the airmen and the passengers (specially Strömberg, the main interrogator). This is a clear proof of the significance of the incident. After a long searh the before mentioned interrogation protocol dated 17.12.1943 was discovered and translated in Russian from beginning to end.

Capt Korobov, the best informed officer of the crew due to his position, had died of his wounds on 20.Jan. 1944; Consequently the report of Strömberg to the Control Commission may have had an positive effect on the remaining repatriated POWs.