Hidden origins of the Winter War

Discussions on the Winter War and Continuation War, the wars between Finland and the USSR.
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Aleksei22
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Hidden origins of the Winter War

Post by Aleksei22 » 27 Jul 2004 19:17

Hello, all

Pls. look at this maps.

The issue - is ABSOLUTELY transparent.

[title changed]
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Topspeed
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Post by Topspeed » 27 Jul 2004 19:42

So Aleksei,

What are you trying to say ? Finland should have given its cities and defensive posts for a vast land areas in north ?

Is that it ?

Why ?


regards,

Juke T :?

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Robert Rojas
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RE: Hidden Origins of War - (The Winter War).

Post by Robert Rojas » 27 Jul 2004 20:10

Greetings to both citizen Aleksei-22 and the community as a whole. Well Aleksei (or Alex if you prefer), in reference to your broad sweeping assertion as articulated in your introductory posting of Tuesday - July 27, 2004 - 7:17pm, old Uncle Bob would contend that your commentary is anything but transparent. However, I will refrain from interjecting my own historical perspective OR perspectives on the "diplomatic" events which ultimately lead to the Winter War of 1940 between the Finnish Republic and the Soviet Union. After all, I have complete faith that your creation will escalate into a classic intramural mud slinging match between the neighborhood's Finnish and Soviet constituencies and I see little reason for "outsiders" to get involved in this endless cycle of recrimination. HAVE FUN! Well, that's my two kopecks on the subject. In anycase, I would like to bid you a copacetic day over in the Motherland.

Best Regards,
Uncle Bob :roll: :|

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Musashi
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Post by Musashi » 28 Jul 2004 00:06

Aleksei22,
do you expect al-Kuwait would exchange her territory with for example MUCH bigger Danish Greenland?
BTW
If this exchange had succeeded Finland would have possed much longer line of Ladoga Lake's bank and besides German way to Murmansk would have been much shorter. If the Finns had entered the war then, of course.
So?

Aleksei22
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1% of introductary step to FULL TRANSPARENCY

Post by Aleksei22 » 28 Jul 2004 17:02

Hello, Uncle Bob- Neutral !

You say

____________________________________

old Uncle Bob would contend that your commentary is
anything but transparent.
_____________________________________


Yes, dear Neutral-Bob ! You are quite right.

This maps - are only 1% of introductary step to FULL TRANSPARENCY mode
for understanding real history of events preceded to
so called "Winter War" outbreak.


I am 100% sure you know that so called "Winter War" ( 1939-1940 ) would never
outbreaked without a "little help" of the broad "outsiders-group ", represented by
well known ( and unknown too ) figurants - politics and bankers from Sweeden, Germany,
France, UK and USA.


by the way, dear Neutral-Bob, - USA's participants comprised only minor part of this
international "big-gang-party" ( industrial+finance business-INTERNATIONAL ). They
had "green-age" but powerful status ( especially in finance) in this brigade of
"shadow-outbreakers" of so called "Winter War" ....



Hope you agree with me that KEY factor for "Winter-War" - were MONEY
and WEST-POLICY-MAKERS, whom figurants had the ability to
convert EVERYTHING ( even human blood ) into MONEY.



Follow the money, dear Neutral-Bob, and - you will definetely find REAL
REASONS for any WAR. Follow the money, dear Neutral-Bob, and - you will
definetely find real TRANSPARENCY of all events ( Great American Spectacle -
911-2001 included !!!! )



_________________________________________________

After all, I have complete faith that your creation will escalate into a
classic intramural mud slinging match between the neighborhood's
Finnish and Soviet constituencies and I see little reason for "outsiders"
to get involved in this endless cycle of recrimination. HAVE FUN!
____________________________________________________



see above. pls. Keeping in "not-involved-mode" all possible
"outsiders" - is a key factor for
bloodless resolving of all problems. You are absolutely right again.





________________________________________________
Well, that's my two kopecks on the subject. In anycase,
I would like to bid you a copacetic day over in the Motherland.
____________________________________________________


Thank you.

"The Show must goooooooooonnnnn " (c) .... ( in time... )




+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Aleksei22
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Comments needed

Post by Aleksei22 » 28 Jul 2004 17:05

Hello, Musashi

___________________________________________
If the Finns had entered the war then, of course.
______________________________________________

This is a key-factor of your message. They ( Finns ) rejected to
accept USSR's plan for peace, preffered to made full-stake on War
( with the little help of "outsiders". see my message to Uncle Bob- Neutral
above) .

And - they got it..... as the rest.


[images not dealing with the war between the USSR and Finland was removed, please stay on that topic in this thread /webmaster]

Mek
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Re: Comments needed

Post by Mek » 28 Jul 2004 17:25

Aleksei22 wrote:Hello, Musashi

___________________________________________
If the Finns had entered the war then, of course.
______________________________________________

This is a key-factor of your message. They ( Finns ) rejected to
accept USSR's plan for peace, preffered to made full-stake on War
( with the little help of "outsiders". see my message to Uncle Bob- Neutral
above) .

And - they got it..... as the rest.
Key factor is that USSR was demanding land from Finland. An independent country, which can decide for themselves, whatever they want to give up lands, or trade land. But since Finland didn't give in enough, USSR decided to use force and attacked Finland. But their goal in war was not to occupy the area in your maps, but the occupation of WHOLE Finland and installing a puppet goverment. And that failed. They had to satisfy for border changes.

Besides they also made demands about Hanko, or as another option islands quite close to Finnish coast. Which your maps are not showing at all. Now, that's probably the major reason why Finland declined. That could've been imminent threat to Helsinki. In Winter War peace they
got Hanko for rent, and Islands from the Gulf of Finland.

And Im curious about something, if Murmansk railroad was a life line.. why would USSR leaders allow Finlands (who they were so suspicious of that they had to demand territory in order to protect Leningrad) borders come even closer to the very important railroad.

Regards,
-Pete

Aleksei22
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look carefully, pls

Post by Aleksei22 » 28 Jul 2004 17:49

Hello, Mek

pls, look at maps carefully
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Mek
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Re: look carefully, pls

Post by Mek » 28 Jul 2004 18:03

Aleksei22 wrote:Hello, Mek

pls, look at maps carefully
Ok :) I noticed now. They are marked.

But I still don't see Hanko peninsula on the maps ;)

If it was just about the small piece of land on Karelian Isthmus,
how would you explain USSR going to war against Finland in order
to occupy the whole country?

Regards,
-Pete

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was RENTING for

Post by Aleksei22 » 28 Jul 2004 18:12

Hello, Mek

You say

_____________________________


But I still don't see Hanko peninsula on the maps Wink
_____________________________________________


USSR's pre "Winter-War" proposal assosiated to Hanko - was RENTING for 99 year ( if I not mistaken )


__________________________

If it was just about the small piece of land on Karelian Isthmus,
how would you explain USSR going to war against Finland in order
to occupy the whole country?

________________________________


see my "hints" in " Uncle-Bob ( Neutral )" answer ..... above ...

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Marcus
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Post by Marcus » 28 Jul 2004 18:23

Aleksei22,

Please use the quote feature when quoting.

/Marcus

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Topspeed
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Re: 1% of introductary step to FULL TRANSPARENCY

Post by Topspeed » 28 Jul 2004 18:53

Aleksei22 wrote: Thank you.

"The Show must goooooooooonnnnn " (c) .... ( in time... )
Does this mean that Winter War ( not so called ) was a show and Continuation War also...and you with your friends are planning a third show in near future ?

I hope not.

Why do you call Old Uncle Bob Neutral-Bob ?

Was the yellow area also for sale...and for how much ( is the blue area for sale in near future too or is Russia going to give it back for free) ?


regards,

JT

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Re: Comments needed

Post by Topspeed » 28 Jul 2004 19:11

Aleksei22 wrote:
This is a key-factor of your message. They ( Finns ) rejected to
accept USSR's plan for peace, preffered to made full-stake on War.

And - they got it..... as the rest.

[images not dealing with the war between the USSR and Finland was removed, please stay on that topic in this thread /webmaster]
Why should Finland have accepted such a proposition in the first place ( why a peace proposition..there was no war..blackmaling is close to the word you seek I presume ) ?

Could I see the deleted images privately please ?


JT
Last edited by Topspeed on 28 Jul 2004 19:27, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1% of introductary step to FULL TRANSPARENCY

Post by Topspeed » 28 Jul 2004 19:25

Aleksei22 wrote:
I am 100% sure you know that so called "Winter War" ( 1939-1940 ) would never
outbreaked without a "little help" of the broad "outsiders-group ", represented by
well known ( and unknown too ) figurants - politics and bankers from Sweeden, Germany,
France, UK and USA.
Please explain thoroughly..in this site there has to be solid evidence and no hearsay..this is hearsay to me.
How can you explain a massive attack on Finland by bankers in USA, UK, Sweden or Germany ? Did they pay Stalin to attack ?
Had Finland received a large sum of money I think there was then no need for people to get rid of wedding rings and personal jewellery to buy AA guns and stuff.

JT

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Post by Aleksei22 » 28 Jul 2004 19:28

Hello,

______________________
Why should Finland have accepted such a proposition in the first place ?
__________________________________

due to the PRICE - PEACE or WAR.

Your leaders preffered WAR.
( see detain in Uncle-Bob-Neutral )

They - got it. Your ( relatives ) - covered the expences.


_________________________

Could I see the deleted images privately please ?
______________________________________________

no problems

go to

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?t=55712


why - NEUTRAL ????

in accordance of his selfpresentation ( edited after some time by him... see above ).

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