Russian monument in Kuuterselkä

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Bair
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Russian monument in Kuuterselkä

Post by Bair » 17 Sep 2004 19:14

Coming back to an old discussion with the Finns that most of the Russian monuments are standard/boring/pathetic/overpatriotic:

Image

this is a grave of Russian Lieutenant Nikolai Fadeev (1920-1944) in Kuuterselkä, with the sign made by his father.

The sign reads in Russian:

Buried here is Lieutenant Nikolai Fadeev (1920-1944)

Sleep in peace, my dear son, you honestly gave your life for the Motherland. No one, never, nowhere on this earth loved you more than I did love you. You will never die in my heart. Farewell, my priceless treasure, my beloved son. Wait for me.

your dad.

the picture is taken from http://www.nortfort.ru/vtline/index.html

My point: there are different types of monuments in each country.

with best regards,

Bair

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Harri
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Post by Harri » 17 Sep 2004 22:52

OK. It was me who wondered pathetic Soviet monuments (although I didn't say "boring" :wink: ). Well, now we know better. Thanks again, Bair.

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This is a Finnish monument for the Battle of Kämärä in 1918 (the first victory in Finnish Karelia for the Whites during the Finnish Civil War). It was orderer in 1939 from the famous Finnish artist Wäinö Aaltonen, but was not finished before the war ended. After the war there was a problem: Kämärä was in the ceded Karelian Isthmus and monument was too "anti-Soviet". Monument was although erected to a park next to National Museum in Helsinki. It was removed in 1974 and located to Lappeenranta, South-Eastern Finland "closer to Karelia". This is the current "cleaned" version (anyway the style is clearly seen):
http://www.rakennustaiteenseura.fi/tait ... no_003.jpg
This is the original "Greater Finland" version:
http://www.rakennustaiteenseura.fi/tait ... no_001.jpg

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I visited about two weeks ago the Finnish monument of the battle of Napue (1714) at Isokyrö (between Vaasa and Seinäjoki), Western Finland. In that battle Russian troops bet Finns in a massacre where several thousands Finns (partly local peasants) lost their lives.

To get some idea what kind of that battle actually was I can tell that compared to strengths of WW II Finnish battle losses would have been 35.000 men; more than our losses were during the whole Winter War!! In a single battle!? Anyway the monument built in the 1920's was awesome. When I'll get the photos some day maybe I'll send one here.

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Topspeed
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Post by Topspeed » 18 Sep 2004 03:51

Harri,

Are you saying 35 000 finns died in Napue back in 1714 ?

rgds,

Juke

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ritterkreuz1945
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Re: Russian monument in Kuuterselkä

Post by ritterkreuz1945 » 18 Sep 2004 05:33

Bair wrote:Coming back to an old discussion with the Finns that most of the Russian monuments are standard/boring/pathetic/overpatriotic:

Image

this is a grave of Russian Lieutenant Nikolai Fadeev (1920-1944) in Kuuterselkä, with the sign made by his father.

The sign reads in Russian:

Buried here is Lieutenant Nikolai Fadeev (1920-1944)

Sleep in peace, my dear son, you honestly gave your life for the Motherland. No one, never, nowhere on this earth loved you more than I did love you. You will never die in my heart. Farewell, my priceless treasure, my beloved son. Wait for me.

your dad.

the picture is taken from http://www.nortfort.ru/vtline/index.html

My point: there are different types of monuments in each country.

with best regards,

Bair

I am in awe of the raw emotion that is displayed in this simple , yet HIGHLY emotional grave stone!
I hope if I out live my father, ( I am a Infantry sgt. U.s. Army ) that my papa would leave me such a WONDERFULL tribute.
I Love you Dad War is such hell

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Harri
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Post by Harri » 18 Sep 2004 17:13

Topspeed wrote:Harri, Are you saying 35 000 finns died in Napue back in 1714 ?
NO! Please, read first, then read again, then ask if you don't understand... :roll:

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Topspeed
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Re: Russian monument in Kuuterselkä

Post by Topspeed » 19 Sep 2004 08:09

Bair wrote:
Buried here is Lieutenant Nikolai Fadeev (1920-1944)

Sleep in peace, my dear son, you honestly gave your life for the Motherland. No one, never, nowhere on this earth loved you more than I did love you. You will never die in my heart. Farewell, my priceless treasure, my beloved son. Wait for me.

your dad.


My point: there are different types of monuments in each country.
Sting the rock singer once sang ( in the 80ies )." What if the russians love their children too ?"

I think Bair has just given proof on this song.

Very touching indeed.


rgds,

Juke

Mek
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Post by Mek » 20 Sep 2004 03:07

Thats a very touching and beautiful text. I also thought that the big monument/memorial at Portinhoikka was very nice.

And I like that Sting song that Topspeed mentioned :)

Regards,
-Pete

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Kunikov
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Post by Kunikov » 20 Sep 2004 03:55

You guys don't have much experience with Soviet, today Russian, rememberance of the war?

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Hanski
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Post by Hanski » 20 Sep 2004 09:14

I think most Finns without personal Russian acquaintances have seen only the "official" Soviet rememberance of the war, in the form of monuments, like sculptures in the style of socialist realism: heroic figures, rising their weapons for the defence of the Motherland, or for the victory over fascism.

This very touching private monument at Kuuterselkä is on an entirely different level, on the human level of sorrow for a lost and loved son. No pompous display of might, no accusations -- just the grief. This genuine expression of longing for a missed son is universal, shared by anyone regardless of ideologies or nationalities.

As for the Russian national character, I believe Finns like anyone else know the masterful writing skills of authors of the Russian classic literature in their depicting of human characters with their full spectrum of emotions. Russian folk music is quite appealing to Finns, who have adopted many of its melodies to lyrics in Finnish. Of Russian painters, my favourite is Ilya Repin with his unique portraying of the human being with dignity, whatever his or her fate or social status. It goes without saying masterpieces like these are only created by people with rich emotional lives and extraordinary talent. Why should anyone doubt feelings arising in the dramatic circumstances of war being experienced likewise by Russians?

The individual level of experience has unfortunately been to a great extent masked by the official and the political, especially in the post-WWII Soviet era. If writers of rock lyrics have to wonder whether or not Russians love their children, in my opinion it is only sad proof on how the Cold War managed to demonize people who were perceived as potential adversaries in a future war.

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Rauli
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Post by Rauli » 20 Sep 2004 09:29

Kunikov wrote:You guys don't have much experience with Soviet, today Russian, rememberance of the war?
Thank God! :D If the defence in the Karelian Isthmus 1944 had collapsed, we would have more Soviet style art than I care to see. You can see this marxist "realism" allover eastern Europe. Well, someone might even like it.

But seriously, in the good old days back in the Kekkonen time, our Soviet "friends" gave us fair share of statues as a gift. One you can see even now in the Hakaniemi tori at Helsinki.

But it would be a funny idea picture T-34 in the front of the Stockmann -warehouse instead Three Smiths -statue :P

Best regards,

Rauli

Mikko H.
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Post by Mikko H. » 20 Sep 2004 09:41

Sting the rock singer once sang ( in the 80ies )." What if the russians love their children too ?"
If writers of rock lyrics have to wonder whether or not Russians love their children, in my opinion it is only sad proof on how the Cold War managed to demonize people who were perceived as potential adversaries in a future war.
To make justice to Sting, the lyrics were meant to critisize the Cold War stereotype of Evil Commies Out To Dominate The World: "Russians love their children, too."

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Topspeed
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Post by Topspeed » 20 Sep 2004 10:00

I am curious; where is Kuuterselkä ? What happened there in 1944 ?

rgds,

Juke

Mikko H.
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Post by Mikko H. » 20 Sep 2004 11:08

I am curious; where is Kuuterselkä ? What happened there in 1944 ?
First Red Army breached the VT-line, second Finnish line of defense and then Armored Division made its unsuccesful attempt to recapture the lost positions on 14-15 June 1944.

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Hanski
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Post by Hanski » 20 Sep 2004 13:29

Thank you, Mikko H., for your clarification on the Sting. And to avoid giving the impression above that I would regard war experience as a positive great source of artistic inspiration, let me stress this: war is above all a most miserable condition, causing suffering and giving rise to problems of mental and physical health to those who have to survive it.

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Juha Hujanen
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Post by Juha Hujanen » 20 Sep 2004 13:50

The counter attack of battle group Puroma in Kuuterselkä has been often described as one of most furious attacks in Finnish WW2 history.

Jaeger Brigade(-5.Jaeger Battallion) and Assault Gun Battalion attacked against Soviet 72.Rifle Division,185.Tank Regiment,351.Assault Gun Regiment,46.AT-Brigade and 119.Independ AT-Battalion.

The attack went first well but was stopped by murderrous Soviet fire.SU lost 20-40 tanks,27 guns and many men.Finnish casualties were also severe.5 assault gun's and over 600 men.It has been said that Finnish Jaeger Brigade lost its best men in that battle and it never really recovered of these casualties.

Cheers/Juha

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