Finnish armor losses?

[Alex Yeliseenko]

Hello friends!

Finnish armor losses vs RKKA losses? 1939-1940 1941-1944 - lapland war 44-45?

Finnish T-34 in action?

Suomi KV in action?


Best reguards from Siberia

[Mikko H.]

Finns lost a total of 8 StuG IIIg's in action in June-July 1944:

Counter-attck in Kuuterselkä
- Ps-531-29 was hit by a T-34-85 in the early morning of 15 June 1944 in Kuuterselkä and destroyed
- Ps-531-17 was damaged by several AT rounds in the early morning of 15 June 1944 in Kuuterselkä and destroyed by its crew
- Ps-531-24 was stuck in an anti-tank obstacle in the morning of 15 June 1944 near Kuuterselkä and left behind -- attempt to destroy the tank by its crew was unsuccesful
- Ps-531-23 was abandoned intact after an artillery round exploded near it in the morning of 15 June 1944 in Kuuterselkä and the crew thought it had hit a mine
- Ps-531-1 was immobilized by a hit in the morning of 15 June 1944 in Kuuterselkä and abandoned

Battle of Tali-Ihantala
- Ps-531-2 was abandoned when it backed into an own AT mine and immobilized in the early morning of 28 June 1944 south-east of Nurmilampi
- Ps-531-3 was immobilized after hit by four tank rounds in the early morning of 28 June 1944 in Nurmilampi and abandoned

Counter-attack in Vuosalmi
- Ps-531-5 was destroyed by T-34's in the village of Vuosalmi in the night of 11 July 1944

Source Erkki Käkelä: Laguksen rynnäkkötykit p. 363

[Mikko H.]

Finns lost also 8 BT-42's in June 1944:

- R-702 was stuck in stony ground in Tammisuo on 20 June 1944 and destroyed by its crew two days later
- R-705 was destroyed by its crew in Muolaa on 17 June 1944 because the crew couldn't get the tank to run
- R-712 was stuck in Viipuri on 20 June 1944 while on wheel drive and abandoned
- R-713 was stuck in a ditch in Viipuri on 20 June 1944 and set in fire by its crew
- R-717 was hit in turret by a T-34-85 in Viipuri on 20 June 1944 and abandoned
- Ps-511-7 was stuck in a ditch in the suburb of Karjala in Viipuri on 21 June 1944 and abandoned
- Ps-511-15 was immobilized in Väärämäki on 17 June 1944 by a technical malfunction and abandoned
- Ps-511-19 was damaged (apparently by techincal malfunction) on 15 June 1944 and destroyed by its own crew two days later in Kivennapa

Source same as above, pp. 353-354

[Alex Yeliseenko]

Whether there were losses in captured T34 and KV (finnish)?


best regards from Siberia

[Mikko H.]

Sorry, I don't have certain knowledge about the captured T-34 and KV-1 tanks. But certainly someone else on this forum does.

The only Finnish tank battle of the Winter War took place on 26 February 1940 in Honkaniemi, and consequently also the only Finnish armored losses of that war, 5 Vickers 6 ton tanks (very similar to T-26). More info here: http://www.winterwar.com/Battles/Naykkijaervi.htm#ind

[Alex Yeliseenko]

My information. Finish losses - Honkaniemi - 6 Vickers 6t

All losses (Talvisodan) Winter war - 8 Vickers (6 Hankaniemi + 2 - Pero station)
- Renault FT - 8 (captured Red Army 16/2/1940 - Kjamerja station)

Sours - Sovetsko-Finskaya voyna (Winter war) 1939-1940 vol 1 Sankt Peterburg 2003 years

Best Reguard from ice Siberia

[Tero]

The two operational Finnish KV-1's survived the war. AFAIK no T-34's were lost. In fact the number of T-34's actually increased during the summer of 1944 when T-34/85's were captured during the fighting.

IIRC the total number of tanks lost during the summer of 1944 was ~40. That makes the number of T-26's lost during the summer of 1944 around 22 (40 - 8 Stugs - 8 BT-42).

A point of note: as far as I have been able to determine none of the tanks fell victim to Red Army aviation (the Black Death).

[Alex Yeliseenko]

IL-2

Thank YOU!

[Martti]

One ISU-152 was lost on 28.6.1944

[Tero]

One ISU-152 was lost on 28.6.1944

I don't know if that really counts since it was lost practically immediately after it was captured.

[Uninen]

It think it does. Gladly we still had the first one for the panssarimuseo. Anyways thanks for the statics on the BT-42, from what ive read till now had left me an impression that Soviets destroyed most of those lost, but now it seems just one out of eight was lost to enemy action, but it doesnt change the fact that the machine and its employment was a disaster.

[Mikko H.]

The two operational Finnish KV-1's survived the war. AFAIK no T-34's were lost. In fact the number of T-34's actually increased during the summer of 1944 when T-34/85's were captured during the fighting.

Also a number (8?) of T-34's were bought from Germany in 1944.

My information. Finish losses - Honkaniemi - 6 Vickers 6t

All losses (Talvisodan) Winter war - 8 Vickers (6 Hankaniemi + 2 - Pero station)
- Renault FT - 8 (captured Red Army 16/2/1940 - Kjamerja station)

Sours - Sovetsko-Finskaya voyna (Winter war) 1939-1940 vol 1 Sankt Peterburg 2003 years

Does anyone have more info on this? Until now I've been under the impression that the only Finnish armored losses of the Winter War were suffered during the battle of Honkaniemi. BTW, I don't think the Renault tanks can be counted as armored losses because they were used solely as dug-in bunkers.

[Alex Yeliseenko]

Sorry .... my bad English......

Does anyone have more info on this? Until now I've been under the impression that the only Finnish armored losses of the Winter War were suffered during the battle of Honkaniemi. BTW, I don't think the Renault tanks can be counted as armored losses because they were used solely as dug-in bunkers.

My information - Honkaniemi - 3 Vickers 6tE - damaged
- 3 Vickers 6tE captured (112 armor batalion 35 light armor brigade Red Army)

Soviet losses Honkaniemi - 2 damaged T-26 (Are restored in some days)


sours - Kolomiets M. Tanks in Winter War 2001 #3 p.62-64

29 feb 1940 - finnish attack Pero station area

2 Vickers 6tE - 4 armor company version russian 20 brigade heavy tanks (tank T-28). Result of fight - Vickers 6tE - destroyed.

sours - Kolomiets M. Tanks in Winter War 2001 #3 p.64


16 feb mobile Group of the colonel V.I.Baranov captured 8 Renault FT (Kjamerja station). Tanks were on railway platforms. Group Baranov destroyed 12 antitank gun Bofors and 16 mashine guns. Russian losses - 2 BT 5\7 destroyed and 6 damaged(Are restored in some days).

sours - Pavlov M. Zheltov I. Pavlov I. BT tanks. Moscow 2001 years.


Best regards from Ice Siberia!

[Esa K]

About the captured ISU-152

I don't know if that really counts since it was lost practically immediately after it was captured.

It think it does

I too think it counts as a loss...

Two ISU-152´s was captured in the area of the Portinhoikka roadcross 25/6 1944. One was partly repainted and got the finnish svasticas painted on it, but it never, IIRC, got a Ps. registration number.

Around 03.30 29/6 1944 a counterattack was started in direction Syökkäänlahti with two T-34´s two T-26´s, one armoured car, and one of the captured ISU-152 and two StuG´s from 2./Ryn.Tyk.P + some infantry from JPr. and JR 50. Some bit to the west on the Portinhoikka roadcross in the Viborg direction the ISU-152 was sent as the first of the armoured vechiles in the row to knock out two T-34´s, the gunner missed and in the Soviet counterfire from the T-34´s the Finn ISU-152 was hit, and then burnt. The crew managed to escape.

Also a number (8?) of T-34's were bought from Germany in 1944.

8 may have been bought, but, again, IIRC, only three or four actually arrived to Finland.


regards

Esa K

[Harri]

Also a number (8?) of T-34's were bought from Germany in 1944.

8 may have been bought, but, again, IIRC, only three or four actually arrived to Finland.

I think three T-34/76s were delivered by the Germans. They were later 76 mm model (T-34C). In total Finns had one early model (T-34A with 76.2 mm F-34 gun) and eight late models (T-34B and C with 76.2 mm L-11 gun). Additionally there were nine T-34/85 tanks which were captured in the summer 1944. They all were not used at the same time before the Lapland War. Finns had planned to equip another tank battalion with German PzKw IV Ausf. Js (because Panthers were not available for the Finns) and another with T-34s.

The actual number of certain tanks is sometimes difficult to tell because some tanks were "exchanged" (especially T-28s) and also the same vehicle numbers could be used. The parallel use of older (R register) and newer (Ps. register) numbering system don't make things any easier.