Irma Grese Photos

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Marius
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Irma Grese Photos

Post by Marius » 18 Aug 2006 00:44

This is my collection of pictures of Irma Grese.

http://br.geocities.com/mariuslucius/gresephotos.html

I research everything about Irma Grese.
I will be very grateful with new pictures.
My website is in portuguese.

Best regards

Excuse me, I don't write in english.

Potsdamerplatz
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Post by Potsdamerplatz » 18 Aug 2006 01:22

There is a photograph of Irma Grese (although not a very good one - her head is turned away from the camera) at my thread here:

viewtopic.php?t=93737

Miss Grese is someone who has always fascinated me also. Here is some information about her death which I wrote as an article on the Militaria Collecting website:

Irma Grese was executed by the British hangman Albert Pierrepoint at Hameln prison on 13th December 1945. She was a female guard at Auschwitz and Belsen concentration camps.

Pierrepoint writes in his autobiography: "She was the bravest prisoner, man or woman, whom I ever hanged"

In Pierrepoint's biography, he describes the events leading up to Irma's execution and the hanging itself as follows :

"At last we finished noting the details of the men, and RSM O'Neil ordered 'bring out Irma Grese'. She walked out of her cell and came towards us laughing. She seemed as bonny a girl as one could ever wish to meet. She answered O'Neil's questions, but when he asked her age she paused and smiled. I found that we were both smiling with her, as if we realised the conventional embarrassment of a woman revealing her age. Eventually she said 'twenty-one,' which we knew to be correct. O'Neil asked her to step on to the scales. 'Schnell!' she said - the German for quick."

"The following morning we climbed the stairs to the cells where the condemned were waiting. A German officer at the door leading to the corridor flung open the door and we filed past the row of faces and into the execution chamber. The officers stood at attention. Brigadier Paton-Walsh stood with his wristwatch raised. He gave me the signal, and a sigh of released breath was audible in the chamber, I walked into the corridor. 'Irma Grese,' I called.

The German guards quickly closed all grills on twelve of the inspection holes and opened one door. Irma Grese stepped out. The cell was far too small for me to go inside, and I had to pinion her in the corridor. 'Follow me,' I said in English, and O'Neil repeated the order in German. At 9.34 a.m. she walked into the execution chamber, gazed for a moment at the officials standing round it, then walked on to the centre of the trap, where I had made a chalk mark. She stood on this mark very firmly, and as I placed the white cap over her hand she said in her languid voice 'Schnell'. The drop crashed down, and the doctor followed me into the pit and pronounced her dead. After twenty minutes the body was taken down and placed in a coffin ready for burial."

Irma Grese was just 22 years old.


Here are some other threads on this forum which include photographs and informationm which will help your research:

viewtopic.php?t=21656

viewtopic.php?t=568

viewtopic.php?t=42637


Your English is very good actually. :D

Best regards,

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Marius
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Post by Marius » 18 Aug 2006 03:00

Thank you very much for the information.
Irma Grese was a fascinating woman.
She already arrived in the judgement condemned.
It is how a colonel said during Bergen Belsen's liberation:
"They'll have a legal trial and a legal hanging..."

Without a doubt her it was a courageous woman even in the death.
See your last letters (in German):

http://www.bis.uni-oldenburg.de/bisverl ... /kap12.pdf

Best regards,

Marius

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Post by Potsdamerplatz » 18 Aug 2006 03:37

It seems the public also had a fascination with Irma Grese during the Belsen trial. An article appeared about her in one of the leading Dutch fashion magazines commenting on her immaculate coiffure, elegance and fashionable shoes.

There seems to be quite a bit of controversy whether Irma deserved a death sentence. There were a number of major inconsistencies in evidence given at the Belsen trial regarding the extent of Irma's role at Auschwitz and Belsen. Much of the evidence put forward was unreliable and the testimony of Holocaust survivors who gave evidence against her was taken as gospel (when much of it was inaccurate or exaggerated).

Some members of this forum - including myself - have said that when you read all the affadavits and testimony against her you question whether she really was the monster she is portrayed as.

Best regards,

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Marius
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Post by Marius » 18 Aug 2006 17:48

Hello Potsdamerplatz!

Yes, I have been seeing all the postages of the members of this forum about Irma Grese.
Unhappily I don't have fundamental sources of information as the book
"Trial of Josef Kramer and Forty-Four Others (The Belsen Trial)" by Raymond Phillips.
I have her complete deposition in the trial but I don't have the other depositions before the trial. I would be vastly happy if I had these depositions. I would also like more details of Albert Pierrepoint's book: " Executioner: Pierrepoint "
Here in Brazil there is not anything on her and me I don't know english and I translate with difficulty.
Everything that I have are the sources of the internet.
Certainly a lot of lies were said on her as it demonstrates J. Belling in the website of C.W.Porter. This is an excellent work.

Thank you very much.

Best regards,

Marius

Potsdamerplatz
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Post by Potsdamerplatz » 18 Aug 2006 19:52

Full details of the Belsen trial can be found here:

http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/WCC/belsen5.htm

This website also has some information of Irma Grese:

http://mx.geocities.com/ereionline/irma_grese.htm

If I remember correctly two of our members - Michael Mills and Georg - are both very knowledgable about Irma Grese as they contributed heavily to the previous threads. Perhaps they might be able to help you with links to further information.

Best regards,

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Marius
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Post by Marius » 18 Aug 2006 21:29

Hello Potsdamerplatz!

Thank you very much for the information!

Best regards,

Marius

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Der Alte
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Post by Der Alte » 19 Aug 2006 03:14

Hi there

Dont know if there is a translation of Irma Greses exchange of letters with her sisters (family), its worth reading.

http://www.bis.uni-oldenburg.de/bisverlag/taaang98/kap12.pdf

Its in the last part of the pdf, a link posted priviously.

It portrays Irma as a very proud person, unwilling to show remorse or guilty conscience. This leads me to conclude, either;

a. She was a fanatic nazi and a sadistic one at that,

b. the charges where blown out of proportion.

Ofcourse one should not take this single source, make conclusions like that and expect getting away with it.

Are there any personal letters written prior to her capture (preferable to her sisters)?

My perception of the letters and their phrasing is that they would make Goebbels very proud indeed. Her bearing and manner would probably convince an impartial judge of her being guilty, havent even read the about her trial yet.

Sorry for this post being confused, got loads of questions, mainly centering about Greses personality. Trying to cut through the journalistic bullshit to find what was really there.

Holger

Potsdamerplatz
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Post by Potsdamerplatz » 19 Aug 2006 16:00

It portrays Irma as a very proud person, unwilling to show remorse or guilty conscience. This leads me to conclude, either;

a. She was a fanatic nazi and a sadistic one at that,

b. the charges where blown out of proportion.

Ofcourse one should not take this single source, make conclusions like that and expect getting away with it.


According to the BBC documentary "Auschwitz: The Nazis and the Final Solution" Irma Grese was also very immature.

This is only natural though as she was only 19 or 20 when she arrived at Auschwitz and was assigned control over so many prisoners. Of course she is going to behave petulantly at times and make errors of judgement.

Best regards,

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Post by David Thompson » 19 Aug 2006 22:08

An opinion post from Marius, containing a link to an unsourced article on a revisionist website, was deleted by this moderAtor -- DT.

Undocumented claims undercut the research purposes of this section of the forum. Consequently, it is required that proof be posted along with a claim. The main reason is that proof, evidence, facts, etc. improve the quality of discussions and information. A second reason is that inflammatory, groundless threads attack, and do not promote, the scholarly purpose of this section of the forum.

This requirement applies to each specific claim. In the past, some posters have attempted to evade the proof requirement by resort to the following tactics, none of which are acceptable here:

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For readers interested in learning more about Irma Grese, see "The Belsen trial of Josef Kramer and 44 others," beginning at http://www.ess.uwe.ac.uk/WCC/belsenfwd.htm

See also the threads which can be found with the forum search engine, using "Grese" as the search term.

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Post by germangirl » 30 Sep 2006 20:49

There is also a ghost story that surrounds Fraulein Grese's hanging. Something about she haunts Krema IV where she worked, like the Russian watchman who was put there after the war saw her ghost in the Krema and he didn't go back to the camp. A team of researchers also tried to spend the night in the Krema, but left before the night was out. There is also a supposed photo of the ghost in between two crematorium ovens, but looks rather fake to me.

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Post by alf » 01 Oct 2006 02:13

germangirl wrote:There is also a ghost story that surrounds Fraulein Grese's hanging. Something about she haunts Krema IV where she worked, like the Russian watchman who was put there after the war saw her ghost in the Krema and he didn't go back to the camp. A team of researchers also tried to spend the night in the Krema, but left before the night was out. There is also a supposed photo of the ghost in between two crematorium ovens, but looks rather fake to me.


I am not sure Irma ever worked at any Krema in Auschwitz and as she was hung by the British why would hewr ghost travel all the way back to Auschwitz? She did enough atrocities at Belsen to more than linger there.

http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/camps/bergen ... al-05.html

From her trial.
What were the prisoners supposed to do when the whistle went?

(Irma's answers)

-- Fall in fives, and it was my duty to see that they did so. Dr. Mengele then came and made the selection. As I was responsible for the camp my duties were to know how many people were leaving and I had to count them, and I kept the figures in a strength book. After the selection took place they were sent into "B" Camp, and Dreshel telephoned and told me that they had gone to another camp in Germany for working purposes or for special treatment, which I thought was the gas chamber. I then put in my strength book either so many for transfer to Germany to another camp, or so many for S.B. (Sonder Behandlung). It was well known to the whole camp that S. B. meant the gas chamber.

Were you told anything about the gas chamber by your senior officers?

-- No, the prisoners told me about it.

You have been accused of choosing prisoners on these parades and sending them to the gas chamber. Have you done that?

-- No; I knew that prisoners were gassed.

Was it not quite simple to know whether or not the selection was for the gas chamber, because only Jews had to attend such selections?

-- I myself had only Jews in Camp "C."

Then they would all have to attend the selection for the gas chamber, would they not?

-- Yes.

As you were told to wait for the doctors you would know perfectly well what it was for?

-- No.

When these people were parading they were very often paraded naked and inspected like cattle to see whether they were fit to work or fit to die, were they not?

-- Not like cattle.

You were there keeping order, were you not, and if one ran away you brought her back and gave her a beating?

-- Yes.
Examination by her defense council (p. 251):

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Marius
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Post by Marius » 02 Oct 2006 03:00

Hello Germangirl!
germangirl wrote:There is also a ghost story that surrounds Fraulein Grese's hanging. Something about she haunts Krema IV where she worked, like the Russian watchman who was put there after the war saw her ghost in the Krema and he didn't go back to the camp. A team of researchers also tried to spend the night in the Krema, but left before the night was out. There is also a supposed photo of the ghost in between two crematorium ovens, but looks rather fake to me.


See the topics in
viewtopic.php?t=106648&highlight=grese

Best regards,

Marius

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Post by michael mills » 02 Oct 2006 03:14

Interestingly, the first of the documents written by Irma Grese, number 7 in the material linked by Der Alte, is a simple poem dated 13 September 1945, the date of Grese's arrival at the trial venue in Lüneburg, written in rhyming couplets.

In the poem, Grese shows herself to quite spirited, even to have a wry sense of humour. For example, she refers to the fact that she and the other defendants will be sitting in the dock for an estimated five weeks, and comments that her little bottom will be left rather sore!

The poem and letters show Grese to be a fairly normal, bright young woman, quite different from the perverted monster as which she has been portrayed.

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Penn44
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Post by Penn44 » 02 Oct 2006 05:06

michael mills wrote:Interestingly, the first of the documents written by Irma Grese, number 7 in the material linked by Der Alte, is a simple poem dated 13 September 1945, the date of Grese's arrival at the trial venue in Lüneburg, written in rhyming couplets.

In the poem, Grese shows herself to quite spirited, even to have a wry sense of humour. For example, she refers to the fact that she and the other defendants will be sitting in the dock for an estimated five weeks, and comments that her little bottom will be left rather sore!

The poem and letters show Grese to be a fairly normal, bright young woman, quite different from the perverted monster as which she has been portrayed.


Grese was a "fairly normal" young woman? Your sense of "normal" is askewed.

Penn44


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