The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

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michael mills
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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by michael mills » 30 Jun 2022 08:09

From the Wikipedia article on the town of Jadu in Libya:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jadu,_Lib ... ation_camp
Giado, as it was then known by its Italian name, was the site of an Italian concentration camp during the Second World War.[4] In 1942, about 2,600 Jews [5] and other people, who were considered undesirables, were rounded up throughout Libya and sent to the Giado camp.[6] 564 died from typhus and other privations.[7] The camp was liberated by the British Army in January 1943.
Thus it would appear that a little over 2000 of the internees survived and were liberated by the British Army when it conquered Libya for the final time, after defeating the Axis forces at the battle of Alamein in late 1942.

Another article about the Giado camp:

https://www.encyclopedia.com/humanities ... ation-camp
During World War II, Giado was built by the Italian fascist authorities on the Tripolitanian plateau, about 150 miles (240 km) south of Tripoli. It was established after the second British occupation of Cyrenaica, which ended 27 January 1942. The Italians, who had colonized Libya, decided on a "cleaning out" (sfollamento) of all Jews from the province. Over 3,000 Jews were taken to internment and labor camps in Tripolitania between May and October. About 75 percent of these were sent to Giado. The camp was administered by Italian officers. The guards included both Italians and Arabs. Rations and sanitary conditions in Giado were very poor, and a typhus epidemic broke out in December 1942.

By the time the British liberated the camp during the North Africa campaign, in late January 1943, 526 of the inmates had died. Others had been shot trying to escape as the Axis forces retreated westward.

Yet another article:

https://referenceworks.brillonline.com/ ... IM_0008510
On February 7, 1942, following the second British retreat from Libya to Egypt during World War II, Benito Mussolini, the leader of Italy, ordered the Jews living in Cyrenaica to be moved out of the war zone to prevent them from collaborating with the British. Between May and late October 1942, some twenty-six hundred were transferred in convoys of eight to ten trucks, traveling for five days, to an internment camp at Giado, an isolated military post enclosed by barbed-wire fences on the high plateau 235 kilometers (146 miles) south of Tripoli. Italians administered the camp.

From the Yad Vashem article on the Jews of Libya:

https://www.yadvashem.org/articles/gene ... libya.html
The war reached Libya in the autumn of 1940, when Italy attacked British-influenced Egypt from bases in Libya. This campaign was a disastrous defeat for Italy, and the British entered Libya. The Germans deployed their troops in Libya in 1941 and drove the British out of Libya, but the front changed hands five times between December, 1940 and January, 1943, as described by Benjamin Doron in his interview in this newsletter. The Cyrenaica region of Libya, and especially Benghazi, felt the impact of the constant fighting: twice the British army conquered Libya, and twice they were driven back by Italian and German troops. In the city of Tripoli, the Jewish quarter was often used for Italian anti-aircraft positions. As such, it was subject to massive bombing by the British and the French; in one attack, 4 synagogues were destroyed and 30 Jews killed. In other attacks, the Jewish cemetery, also used by the Italian army to position their anti-aircraft guns, was damaged; graves were stripped of their tombstones to build fortifications.2

Each time the British army entered Libya, the Jews showed enthusiastic support for them, since during their conquests, the discriminatory race laws were not applied. But each time Libya was recaptured by the Italians, the Jews were punished severely for their so-called “collaboration” with the enemy. In 1942 the Italians, who had already determined to adopt a more radical policy against the Jews, used the Jewish community’s enthusiastic welcome of the Allied soldiers as a pretext to punish the Jews of Libya for their betrayal. Mussolini determined to disperse or remove the Libyan Jews; this campaign was called “sfollamento”. The sfollamento of the Libyan Jews was different depending on the area in which they lived. In the Cyrenaica area, the Jews were divided into three groups according to their citizenship:

Jews with French citizenship or under Tunisian protection were to be sent to concentration camps in Algeria and Tunisia;
Jews with British citizenship were to be sent to camps in Europe. Though initially they were thrown into detention camps in Italy, once the Germans occupied Italy in 1943 they were taken to Bergen Belsen, in Germany, and Innsbruck-Reichenau, an affiliate of Dachau, in Austria;
Jews holding Libyan citizenship, especially those from the Cyrenaica region, were to be deported to concentration camps in Tripolitania, the most infamous of which was Giado (Jado).

For Jews in the Tripolitania area, the situation was different. Only those holding British or French citizenship were deported with the Cyrenaica Jews to Jado. The Libyan Jews from this area were instead required to supply workers for labor camps in the vicinity, such as the camps at Sidi Azzaz and Buq Buq.3 Approximately 3,000 Libyan Jews were shipped to these camps, where their labor was used to build roads and railroads needed to move war supplies to the front. Though living conditions in these camps were poor, adequate food and medical care were received regularly.

Giado (or Jado), on the border of the desert, 235 kilometers south of Tripoli, was the most brutal of the camps in Libya. Jado was a former army camp, surrounded by a barbed-wire fence. Its commandants were Italian, and the guards were Italian and Arab policemen. By June, 1942, the Italians had deported, in stages, a total of 2,584 Jews to Jado; all but 47 of them were Libyan Jews. Living conditions in the camp were miserable. The camp was overcrowded – tens of families slept in a space of four meters and separated only by bedding and blankets. Daily food rations consisted of a few grams of rice, oil, sugar and coffee substitute. Men over the age of 18 were sent out everyday to forced labor. Water shortages, malnutrition, overcrowding, and filth intensified the spread of contagious diseases. Inmates buried the dead in a cemetery on a hill outside the camp which had been an ancient Jewish cemetery. On top of this wretched existence, the Italian guards of the camp enjoyed humiliating the Jews. Out of the almost 2,600 Jews sent to Jado, 562 Jews died of weakness and hunger, and especially from typhoid fever and typhus.4 This was the highest number of Jewish victims in Islamic countries during World War II.

In January 1943, the camp guards left. Several weeks later, British soldiers arrived, but many of the prisoners could not be moved due to their poor physical condition. The first Jews returned to their homes from Jado in the spring of 1943, and and the last group of prisoners only left Jado in October, 1943.

........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................

As for the 2,000 British citizens sent to Italy, 870 of them were Jews. Though they were treated relatively well in the detention centers in Italy among which they were scattered, this situation changed dramatically after September 8, 1943, when the Germans occupied Italy after it surrendered to the Allies. During 1944, most of them were sent to Bergen Belsen. One of the unique features of the Libyan Jews sent to the camps in Europe, and something that impressed the other prisoners of the camps, was that they maintained their group solidarity, and though it was difficult, maintained their kashrut6 as well.7

All the Libyan Jews sent to Bergen Belsen managed to survive.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by CogCalgary » 30 Jun 2022 11:58

IIRC,Mussolini ordered the camp closed because it was an embarrassment due the high death count.That does not suggest abandonment.
Something dark happened at Djebel Djeloud outside Tunis and the local well kept property records suggest that the Tunisian Jews were not the victims.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 01 Jul 2022 20:47

mufti denies charges.jpg
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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by LAstry2 » 03 Jul 2022 15:34

According to "O Jerusalem" the Mufti worked with the Nazi Foreign Office so that several Hundred Jewish children would not be allowed to leave Hungary.....but instead went in the boxcars to their doom....also it is alleged that the French allowed Him to escape to Syria...when he promised to help them keep their empire in Syra/Lebanon...post World War II....of course his promises were worth nothing (exccept to A.H in regard to doom of the Jews) indeed when after the British engineered his election as Mufti...he said in return he would spy on the French for the British..then he went to the French and said he would spy for the French on the British...then he went to the germans and offered to spy on both the French and British....His grandson-in-law was Yessir Araffat right Hand henchman....till he was blown up

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 03 Jul 2022 17:30

Code: Select all

The Politics of Genocide: The Holocaust in Hungary by Randolph L. Braham 
search: mufti
O matches found

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by LAstry2 » 03 Jul 2022 17:58

THE MUFTI ROLE IN PREVENTING JEWISH EMMIGRATION FROM BULGARIA, ROMANIA AND HUNGARY
https://www.hoover.org/research/mufti-and-holocaust

The Mufti Role in the Shoah
https://jcpa.org/article/haj-amin-al-hu ... aboration/

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wm
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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 03 Jul 2022 20:53

Please, the first author isn't even a historian he is a right-wing propagandist - defending torture (who said "We tortured some folks") and maligning the Muslims. Actually, he is a (pro-torture) philosopher.

The second link leads to an Israeli propaganda outlet. The Israeli government pays tens (hundreds?) of millions each year to produce such poison-the-well, anti-Palestinian results.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by michael mills » 04 Jul 2022 01:09

Much has been made of Al-Husayni's documented opposition to the release of small numbers of Jews from Bulgaria, Romania and Bulgaria so that they could go to Palestine, claiming that he thereby doomed those Jews to death.

However, there appears to be no hard evidence that his opposition had any effect. Some exchanges did go ahead, and where they did not, it is by no means certain that it was his opposition that stopped them, rather than a decision by higher levels in the German Government.

As for Hungary, after the war Eichmann claimed that he had made a deal with the head of the Zionist Organisation in that country, Rezsoe Kasztner, under which he allowed the Zionists to smuggle some thousands of members of their youth organisations across the border to Romania, whence they entered Palestine illegally, in return for their not mounting any opposition to the deportation of the non-Zionist majority of the Jewish population. That demonstrates that the German authorities were in no way opposed to allowing small numbers of Jews to escape if that facilitated the destruction of the great majority.

As a matter of fact, the escape of some thousands of young Jews the border to Romania before and during the mass deportation of Hungarian Jews was later confirmed by some surviving Hungarian Zionist activists, who claimed that they had organised it secretly. Of course they did not say that it was under an arrangement with Eichmann; perhaps they did not know about that arrangement, or perhaps they did know but did not want to sully the reputation of their leader, Kasztner, who had been assassinated by right-wing Jews because of his wartime actions.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by michael mills » 04 Jul 2022 01:14

Please, the first author isn't even a historian he is a right-wing propagandist -
Which historian are you referring to here, Kuenzel or Gensicke?

Kuenzel is most definitely raging islamophobe, and also pathological self-hating German. I don't know about Gensicke.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by CogCalgary » 04 Jul 2022 01:29

wm wrote:
01 Jul 2022 20:47
mufti denies charges.jpg
Believe the details were in a Time Life book which I cannot find ATM,Holocaust Encylopedia also says that Italian diplomats aided Al Husseini in fleeing Iran to Italy in October 1941.He had crossed the border from Iraq.IIRC,OVRA provided a fake passport.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 04 Jul 2022 23:25

michael mills wrote:
04 Jul 2022 01:14
Which historian are you referring to here, Kuenzel or Gensicke?
I meant the guy from the first link (THE MUFTI ROLE IN PREVENTING JEWISH EMIGRATION) - John Rosenthal, a high school(?) philosophy teacher.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by Sid Guttridge » 05 Jul 2022 06:48

Hi Guys,

This thread is 12 years old and 160+ posts long and yet, scrolling through, I can find no hard evidence that the Grand Mufti had a role in the so-called "Holocaust", despite some claims to that effect.

Is the answer to the question "The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?" a "NO"?

Cheers,

Sid?

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 05 Jul 2022 15:12

The problem is Mufti is a vital point on the battlefield between Israeli and Palestinian propagandists. For that reason, nothing written about him should be trusted.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by Sid Guttridge » 05 Jul 2022 18:18

Hi wm,

I guess it rather depends on how far the net of "The Holocaust" is to be thrown.

Was the Mufti part of the general mood music of anti-Semitism exuded by wartime Nazi Germany? It seems the answer was a solid "Yes".

However, did he have a direct role in the murder of millions of Jews by the Nazis in the so-called "Holocaust" itself? The answer from this thread seems to be, "No".

Cheers,

Sid.

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Re: The Grand Mufti of Jerusalem-- A role in the Holocaust?

Post by wm » 06 Jul 2022 23:22

I suppose the term "anti-Semitism" isn't very useful here. It's so generic it means almost anything.

In European colonies, many national liberation movements sought allies abroad. And really the only remotely useful allies to be found were Nazi Germany and Japan.
That Mufti, or for example the Iraqis, or even some Jewish groups, sought such allies didn't mean they wanted to burn people in ovens. They obviously had their own political goals.
For this reason, Mr. Mufti maybe was guilty of poor taste in friends but the fact he sought allies in Germany meant nothing.

The Holocaust was a state secret. For example, initially, the commandant of Auschwitz was required to keep the existence of gas chambers secret even from his own superiors. Outsiders were never informed what it was all about. The deportations were just deportations for this or that reason.
For this reason, that Hitler divulged the secret to Mufti was impossible.
Similarly, Mufti never visited Auschwitz (especially since nobody saw him there, including the underground resistance people.)
Since he didn't know about the Holocaust he didn't prevent the emigration of Jewish children. For that, he had to know they would be gassed. And he didn't.

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