Did Leibstandarte SS Adolf Hitler (LSSAH) in Death Camps

[Exxley]

Ostuf, just imagine if you had served with the SSTK...

Post May 1945 you would have breaking rocks and cutting timber for Kommissar Clarke in the dappled forests of Siberia! Razz

not to mention having to sing the International or the Varshavianka

[Tom Houlihan]

The SS-Totenkopfverbände, is a sad page but nevertheless irrelevant to Totenkopf general history. The early Totenkopf men had to enter a less glamorous branch of the S.S., case closed. The ‘demonisation’ that occurred because of this would only be justified IF it seems everyone one of them liked guarding KZ, or IF they wanted to.

Irrelevant? How could that fact that the Totenkopf Division was formed from men of the Totenkopfverbänden be irrelevant?

In actuality, the Totenkopfstandarten had little to do with Totenkopf, other than when they were disbanded, many of those men, like the men from SS-I.R. 9, ended up in Totenkopf.

Then again, I'm not entirely sure why I'm contributing to this thread. Someone's mind is already made up, and is rather unlikely to change.

I'm going to endorse Mark Yerger's previous recommendation again reference Anatomy of the SS State. There is a lot of good information in there about the early formation and reformation of the SS.

Also, I received my inter-library loan copy of The Camp Men today. I know just in the division I'm researching, he mentions 57 officers who served in the camps. I'll try to find more numbers reference the other divisions. If anyone's interested...

[David Thompson]

Tom -- You may find this thread of interest:

Waffen-SS Officers in the SS-WVHA
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?p=269678

[doch]

Well, you would have to differantiate between the deathcamps and workcamps,and even among the deathcamps themself if you want to analyze the origin of the personel. For instance the deathcamps (pure deathcamps- not work camps expanded to deathcamps with a totenlager) Treblinka, Belzec and Sobibór were almost exclusively manned by former euthanasi personel under the secret organisation T4. These ppl, led by Christian Wirth, were in early 1942 transfered to Lublin area to build and run the mentioned deathcamps. The personel was partly SS men, partly civilians that has been srawn into the euthenasi projekt because they were educated nurses or similar.

So, when Treblinka, Belzec and Sobibór (responsible for the elimination off app. 1.8 million jews) were up and running, the core staff consisted of SS-men (typically about 20 in each camp), some had a history from workcamps and so called Trawniki soldiers, mostly ukrainiens that were used as guads and also took part of the elimination process.

AFAIK, these men had no connection with Totenkopf, but they were part of another organisation- T4 established to successfully fulfull Action Reinhardt, which were a part of the endlosnung.

But this is just Belzec, Sobibór and Treblinka, I dont know whether Auswitz, Chelmno or Majdanek has Totenkopf personel, or any of the workcamps had.

[Luca]

Kommissar Clarke : so you despise the 3rd SS...

Now ,more than ever , I LOVE the Totenkopf division .

Too sad I haven't served with them .

This is the last message of Ostuf Charlemagne before the expulsion.
He was banned cause this message David?
Thank You
Luca

[David Thompson]

Luca -- You asked:

This is the last message of Ostuf Charlemagne before the expulsion.
He was banned cause this message David?

No, Luca. The decision was based on the forum's civility rule, not on anything he said here in the H&WC section. See: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 865#646865

[Marcus]

If anyone has any questions about any banning, please take it through pm or email to myself or one of the moderators and not in the open forum, thanks.

/Marcus

[Nollig]

Members of the Allgemine SS (General SS), primarily guarded concentration camps. They were recruited essentialy for this purpose. However, Waffen-SS troops of all divisions were rotated in on occasions for duty at these centers.

RGDS

[Rob - wssob2]

Members of the Allgemine SS (General SS), primarily guarded concentration camps.

Incorrect. "Allgemeine SS" is an imprecise term used to mean the general/main/primary SS organization, itself subdivided into its 8+ departments and 150+ sub-departments and/or the volunteer paramilitary groups in the Reich. After the war SS veterans used it as a means of saying "the other guys ran the camps, not me."

From August 1940 to March 1942, concentration camps were "Department Six" (Amt VI) of the SS-FHA (main operations office) - the same office that managed the Waffen-SS.

From April 1941 on Concentration camp guards were part of the Waffen-SS, wearing Waffen-SS uniforms and carrying Waffen-SS paybooks.

In March 1942 concentration camps administration was reorganized under Department Group D of the SS Economic & Administrative Office (SS-WVHA).

They were recruited essentialy for this purpose.

The SSTK was founded to guard the KZ (concentration camp) installations.

In December 1939 Himmler transferred 6,000 "Allgemeine-SS" reservists (meaning the guys in the regionally located, volunteer SS battalions all over Germany) into the Totenkopfwachsturmbanne (concentration camp guard units)

In the summer of 1944 Wehrmacht personnel (many of them Luftwaffe) were transferred into the Totenkopfwachsturmbanne for concentration camp and slave labor guard duty. Many of these troops wore the "double swastika" collar tab,

Waffen-SS troops of all divisions were rotated in on occasions for duty at these centers.

Basically correct, although the transferrs were done on an individual as opposed to a unit level. And you wouldn't necessaryily be transferred to "concentration camp duty" - you'd be assigned to SS-WVHA, Amtg D, stationed at Dachau.

Almost all SS departments were involved in the concentration camps. It was the nature of the system.

[Nollig]

Thank you for the time and effort to clarify the subject matter. I believe, or rather am of the faith, that you have given the best answer on this topic. The administration of concentration camps, and I don’t mean to sound cold-hearted, has not interested me much. Perhaps it should. I am most focused on the military efforts and campaigns of the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th, and 12th Waffen-SS Panzer Divisions. My intuition says you probably know more than I about these units’ histories as well.

Best Regards.