Eichmann
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Eichmann
If Eichmann had been able to avoid the authorities after the war and lived in plain site till say the mid 50s,
then handed his self in.Would he have been successfully prosecuted and served a short sentence or had his trial cancelled like some of the other RSHA members and lived the rest of his life out in retirement ? Or would have Israel have still gone after him ?
Jack
then handed his self in.Would he have been successfully prosecuted and served a short sentence or had his trial cancelled like some of the other RSHA members and lived the rest of his life out in retirement ? Or would have Israel have still gone after him ?
Jack
- mikegriffith1
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Re: Eichmann
Does your scenario have Eichmann living in plain sight in Germany? This is what I infer, but you don't specify it. Anyway, if he'd remained in Germany and then turned himself in 10-15 years after the war, I think he would have been prosecuted, but I'm not sure how severe his punishment would have been. I'd like to think that international pressure would have caused Germany to give him at least 20 years in prison with no possibility of early release.
I don't think Israel would have gone after him in Germany. I think that would have been too risky diplomatically. It would have caused a firestorm in Germany.
I don't think Israel would have gone after him in Germany. I think that would have been too risky diplomatically. It would have caused a firestorm in Germany.
Mike Griffith
https://sites.google.com/view/realissueshomepage/home
https://sites.google.com/view/realissueshomepage/home
- Helly Angel
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Re: Eichmann
On the one hand you are right, Germany is not Argentina but remember that at that time, the MOSSAD worked very closely with the BND and before, with the Gehlen Group to the point of having used people like Skorzeny among their ranks (from the MOSSA).mikegriffith1 wrote: ↑22 May 2022, 14:49Does your scenario have Eichmann living in plain sight in Germany? This is what I infer, but you don't specify it. Anyway, if he'd remained in Germany and then turned himself in 10-15 years after the war, I think he would have been prosecuted, but I'm not sure how severe his punishment would have been. I'd like to think that international pressure would have caused Germany to give him at least 20 years in prison with no possibility of early release.
I don't think Israel would have gone after him in Germany. I think that would have been too risky diplomatically. It would have caused a firestorm in Germany.
There are two situations to take into account: 1. the MOSSAD did not pay attention to the multiple complaints against Eichmann, they took three years to process the first complaint and they did it reluctantly., 2. On the other hand, remember the Germany's position regarding the "Heinz Lammerding" case. No and no and it wasn't.
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Re: Eichmann
Yes living in Germany, I asked because reading Wildt's book a lot of the commanders of the Einsatzgruppen who went on trial in Germany in the mid 50s were released on a technicality.So just wondered if Eichmann had made different choices would he have been released as well ?
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Re: Eichmann
I think there would have been massive international pressure for West Germany to have allowed his extradition to face trial in Israel. There would have to be conditions of course, including no death penalty.
Would Israel have agreed to this? Probably.
Even Ohlendorf had no chance of escaping the hangman's noose in 1951. He was deemed the worst of the worst of the remaining war criminals because of his senior rank, his leadership role in the RSHA and his "field experience" with Einsatzgruppen. The best scenario for him would have been life imprisonment without parole. Anything less would be an international outrage.
If Ohlendorf had ever been released in the 1960s or 1970s, he would have succumbed to either a heart attack or an automobile accident within a few years. Same with Eichmann. Someone would have got them in the end.
Would Israel have agreed to this? Probably.
Even Ohlendorf had no chance of escaping the hangman's noose in 1951. He was deemed the worst of the worst of the remaining war criminals because of his senior rank, his leadership role in the RSHA and his "field experience" with Einsatzgruppen. The best scenario for him would have been life imprisonment without parole. Anything less would be an international outrage.
If Ohlendorf had ever been released in the 1960s or 1970s, he would have succumbed to either a heart attack or an automobile accident within a few years. Same with Eichmann. Someone would have got them in the end.
Re: Eichmann
Interesting article in the german newspaper "Welt" about the execution of Eichmann. (published in 2012)
Schalom Nagar: https://www.jewiki.net/wiki/Schalom_Nagar
Hans
Link: https://www.welt.de/kultur/history/arti ... enker.html"Das Los machte Schalom Nagar zu Eichmanns Henker" / "The drawing of lots made Schalom Nagar Eichmann's executioner"
Schalom Nagar: https://www.jewiki.net/wiki/Schalom_Nagar
Hans
The paradise of the successful lends itself perfectly to a hell for the unsuccessful. (Bertold Brecht on Hollywood)
Re: Eichmann
The actual german TV series:
THE ORGANIZER OF THE HOLOCAUST
Link: https://www.br.de/kultur/schwerpunkt-ei ... s-100.html
Everything is Online, unlimited.
Hans
THE ORGANIZER OF THE HOLOCAUST
Link: https://www.br.de/kultur/schwerpunkt-ei ... s-100.html
Everything is Online, unlimited.
Hans
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The paradise of the successful lends itself perfectly to a hell for the unsuccessful. (Bertold Brecht on Hollywood)
- Helly Angel
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Re: Eichmann
It sounds crazy to say it in June 2022, but I think that if Eichmann stays in Germany in the 50s, nothing will happen to him. He would have assumed another identity and they did not extradite him like the case of Herbert Kappler who, against all odds, Italy did not manage to get him returned.
Re: Eichmann
Das braune Exil in Argentinien https://amerika21.de/analyse/51991/brau ... rgentinien
PDF book "Hitlers Shadow..." https://www.archives.gov/files/iwg/repo ... shadow.pdf
(1619 KB download size) 110 pages.
"Die Kriegsverbrecherlobby" https://www.bpb.de/system/files/dokumen ... screen.pdf
Hans
Source: Link above"According to official historiography, Eichmann lived inconspicuously near Celle after the end of the war, first as a lumberjack, then as a chicken breeder. However, according to the released BND files, he stayed mainly in Upper Austria until 1948.1 The victorious power, the USA, had no scruples about using its recently defeated opponents - the Hitlerites - militarily against the Soviet Union, which until recently had been an ally. It was the US Army's CIC secret service and the CIA, founded in 1947, who protected these people from criminal prosecution thanks to their "anti-communist wealth of experience" and used them for their purposes..."
PDF book "Hitlers Shadow..." https://www.archives.gov/files/iwg/repo ... shadow.pdf
(1619 KB download size) 110 pages.
"Die Kriegsverbrecherlobby" https://www.bpb.de/system/files/dokumen ... screen.pdf
Hans
The paradise of the successful lends itself perfectly to a hell for the unsuccessful. (Bertold Brecht on Hollywood)
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Re: Eichmann
Yes I found it strange how some who on paper were far worse than Eichmann, were able to return to normal life and jobs after the war, one who worked for a publisher who admired a jewish writer and would have put her to death during the war.Hard to understand how the so called well educated could instigate such crimes then put it all behind them and go back to normal life ??Helly Angel wrote: ↑01 Jun 2022, 15:01It sounds crazy to say it in June 2022, but I think that if Eichmann stays in Germany in the 50s, nothing will happen to him. He would have assumed another identity and they did not extradite him like the case of Herbert Kappler who, against all odds, Italy did not manage to get him returned.
Re: Eichmann
The answer is simple, these "experts" were "appropriated" because of the interest in their "knowledge" during the so-called Cold War years.
And this does not only apply to the American secret services.
A very bad chapter in post-war history, the blood of the victims was on many hands, not only in Germany...
And almost everything is still "confidential", those responsible at that time long deceased.
Typical of our German politics, as a distant relative of a former RAF terrorist, I unfortunately know only too well how things work...
You only find out something like this at a "kitchen table", certainly not on the Internet.
Hans
And this does not only apply to the American secret services.
A very bad chapter in post-war history, the blood of the victims was on many hands, not only in Germany...
And almost everything is still "confidential", those responsible at that time long deceased.
Typical of our German politics, as a distant relative of a former RAF terrorist, I unfortunately know only too well how things work...
You only find out something like this at a "kitchen table", certainly not on the Internet.
Hans
The paradise of the successful lends itself perfectly to a hell for the unsuccessful. (Bertold Brecht on Hollywood)