Franz Stangl (why was he spared)?

Discussions on the Holocaust and 20th Century War Crimes. Note that Holocaust denial is not allowed. Hosted by David Thompson.
User avatar
trower
Member
Posts: 567
Joined: 14 Apr 2003 14:41
Location: New Brunswick, Canada

Franz Stangl (why was he spared)?

Post by trower » 22 Aug 2003 08:38

From what I understand SS commandant of Treblinka (Franz Stangl) never actually personally mistreated anyone yet 400,000 jews were murdered under his command of the death camp. I find this a bit of an oxymoron. He was arrested by the Americans after the war and escaped to Brazil and was returned to Germany in 1967 and sentenced to life imprisonment where he died 4 years later. Question being what was the difference between his actions and Hoess? From what I understand Hoess never actually personally brutalized anyone yet he was sentenced to death.

David Thompson
Forum Staff
Posts: 23061
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 19:52
Location: USA

Post by David Thompson » 22 Aug 2003 09:01

trower -- One big difference is that Poland had the death penalty and West Germany did not. Another is that the two trials took place about 20 years apart.

Stangl, Franz Paul (1898 or 1908-1971) [SS-Hauptsturmfűhrer] -- police superintendent, Health Care Institute (HuPa - Heil- und Pflegeanstalten) Schloss Hartheim euthanasia facility 1940; commandant, concentration camp (Konzentrationslager - KL) Sobibor May-Sept 1942; commandant, KL Treblinka Sept 1942-Aug 1943; service, Action Command "Reinhard" (Einsatzkommando Reinhard) at Trieste, Italy {captured by American troops 1945; turned over to Austrian court at Linz for prosecution for euthanasia activities; escaped from Glaisenbach POW camp in late 1947 or 1948; fled to Italy; fled to Syria 1948; to Brazil 1950 or 1951; arrested by Brazilian police 28 Feb 1967 at Sao Paolo (NYT 3 Mar 1967:1:8; NYT 5 Mar 1967:21:1); extradition requested by Austria 3 Mar 1967 (NYT 4 Mar 1967:7:2); extradition requested by West Germany 14 Mar 1967 (NYT 15 Mar 1967:25:1); extradition requested Apr 1967 by Poland (NYT 19 Apr 1967:17:3); extradition contested (NYT 25 Apr 1967:3:2; NYT 28 Apr 1967:19:1; NYT 30 Apr 1967:21:5); impending extradition to West Germany announced by Brazilian government 7 Jun 1967 (NYT 8 Jun 1967:9:1); extradited 23 Jun 1967 to West Germany (NYT 24 Jun 1967:5:4); arrested 24 Jun 1967 by West German authorities at Duesseldorf and held for trial on charges of complicity in the murders of 700,000 persons (NYT 25 Jun 1967:5:1); put on trial 13 May 1970 by a West German court at Duesseldorf on charges of complicity in at least 400,000 murders of Bulgarian, Greek, Yugoslavian, Dutch, Austrian and Polish Jews and gypsys (Zigeuner) between Apr 1942 and Aug 1943 (NYT 14 May 1970:4:4; NYT 30 May 1970:13:4); convicted and sentenced to life imprisonment 22 Dec 1970 (NYT 23 Dec 1970:1:5; JuNSV Verfahren Lfd.Nr.746; LG Düsseldorf 701222); died in prison 28 Jun 1971 (NYT 29 Jun 1971:40:4). (Into That Darkness 21; Who's Who pps. 295-7; Encyclopedia of the Third Reich pps. 910-1; Camp Men p. 228; SS: Roll of Infamy pps. 162-3).}

User avatar
trower
Member
Posts: 567
Joined: 14 Apr 2003 14:41
Location: New Brunswick, Canada

Post by trower » 22 Aug 2003 09:41

Thanks David, that makes perfect sense although it seems to me that perhaps the west was far too leinient on individuals whom actually didn't get their hands dirty. It boggles my mind that Stangl spent a mere 4 years in prison. I consider that incredible lucky. Like Chrischa stated, this will be a topic discussed endlessly and no doubt to no sollution.

Manstein
Member
Posts: 1294
Joined: 04 May 2003 06:45
Location: San Ramon, CA

Re:

Post by Manstein » 23 Aug 2003 23:14

From what I've heard, Stangl felt remorseful for his deeds, but that wouldn't spare him from the death penalty in Poland.

User avatar
Scott Smith
Member
Posts: 5602
Joined: 10 Mar 2002 21:17
Location: Arizona

Post by Scott Smith » 24 Aug 2003 23:53

Manstein wrote:From what I've heard, Stangl felt remorseful for his deeds, but that wouldn't spare him from the death penalty in Poland.

Nothing. Which is probably why he copped a plea--lest the Bundestablishment extradite him to Communist Poland to hang. By dealing with him in West Germany a public relations disaster was contained. And the interesting thing about Stangl is that he gives his Walter Mitty exploits but provides almost no pertinent details about his murder-factory.
:)

David Thompson
Forum Staff
Posts: 23061
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 19:52
Location: USA

Post by David Thompson » 25 Aug 2003 00:37

Stangl didn't "cop a plea" (plead guilty); he was convicted after a 7 month trial.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
Scott Smith
Member
Posts: 5602
Joined: 10 Mar 2002 21:17
Location: Arizona

Post by Scott Smith » 25 Aug 2003 01:11

David Thompson wrote:Stangl didn't "cop a plea" (plead guilty); he was convicted after a 7 month trial.

He didn't cop a plea? Nevertheless, as in a medieval trial for witchcraft, he tells his diabolical story, just like Eichmann before him and not substantially contradicting the liturgical Evil. The overall infamy is real, even worse, "infinitely worse than you can imagine--but I was just a fly on the wall doing my duty, see, and therefore I am not guilty. I'll tell you all about the Holocaust--I was there--but I know nothing, nothing." (Not an exact quotation.)
:)

David Thompson
Forum Staff
Posts: 23061
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 19:52
Location: USA

Post by David Thompson » 25 Aug 2003 01:50

For the readers who may not be familiar with the reference to Walter Mitty, there is a droll short story -- "The Secret Life of Walter Mitty" -- written by James Thurber. The character of Walter Mitty is that of a mild-mannered daydreamer, who fantasizes about imaginary derring-do and spectacular exploits. The story is well worth reading, and the tale was turned into a 1947 motion picture of the same name, starring Danny Kaye in the title role.

The question of whether Scott's use of the Walter Mitty metaphor to describe Franz Stangl ["the interesting thing about Stangl is that he gives his Walter Mitty exploits but provides almost no pertinent details about his murder-factory"] is better applied to Scott's argument ["Which is probably why he copped a plea"; "Nevertheless, as in a medieval trial for witchcraft, he tells his diabolical story, just like Eichmann before him and not substantially contradicting the liturgical Evil. The overall infamy is real, even worse, "infinitely worse than you can imagine--but I was just a fly on the wall doing my duty, see, and therefore I am not guilty. I'll tell you all about the Holocaust--I was there--but I know nothing, nothing." (Not an exact quotation.)"], I will leave to the reader to decide.

User avatar
Scott Smith
Member
Posts: 5602
Joined: 10 Mar 2002 21:17
Location: Arizona

Post by Scott Smith » 25 Aug 2003 02:13

David Thompson wrote:I will leave to the reader to decide.

I recommend reading Gitta Sereny's book. It is hard to pin him down on claims because the unfathomable Evil apparently is featureless on details. Furthermore, she has no published notes on her interview with Stangl. It is almost an allegory based on her famous interview.

Into That Darkness is available from Amazon to support this very site ONLY by clicking my link below:

CLICK! Image

Based on 70 hours of interviews with Franz Stangl, commandant of Treblinka (the largest of the extermination camps), this book bares the soul of a man who continually found ways to rationalize his role in Hitler's final soulution.

:)

David Thompson
Forum Staff
Posts: 23061
Joined: 20 Jul 2002 19:52
Location: USA

Post by David Thompson » 25 Aug 2003 02:24

I also recommend the book to the readers of this section of the forum.

Return to “Holocaust & 20th Century War Crimes”