The Siege of Leningrad in German Documents

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Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 19:00

Roberto wrote:
Raymond wrote:Roberto, what is the purpose of your posting about the Leningrad siege?


To the extent that you need to have a “purpose” to post on this forum, I’d say the purpose is to provide information about documentary evidence regarding the planning and conduction of that siege.

I hope you see nothing wrong with providing historical information.


No, i don't see anything wrong, but the decisive question is: does it make any sense, and that is questionable.

Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 19:03

Interesting argumentation.
"Perhaps being... they would have ... still what do I know."
Very convincing.
Perhaps if the granma had a beard she would have been a grandpa...
still what do I know ? 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O
If Britain and America had not seen the beard it would of made them think
that the grandma remained grandma. 8O 8O 8O 8O 8O



Do you ever make such kind of postings? You should perhaps go to a kindergarten instead.

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Marcus
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Postby Marcus » 03 Sep 2002 19:03

Raymond,

Drop the unfriendly attitude!

/Marcus

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Roberto
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Postby Roberto » 03 Sep 2002 19:06

Raymond wrote:
Roberto wrote:
Raymond wrote:Roberto, what is the purpose of your posting about the Leningrad siege?


To the extent that you need to have a “purpose” to post on this forum, I’d say the purpose is to provide information about documentary evidence regarding the planning and conduction of that siege.

I hope you see nothing wrong with providing historical information.


No, i don't see anything wrong, but the decisive question is: does it make any sense, and that is questionable.


If you don't like them, don't read them.

Others will.

atkif
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Postby atkif » 03 Sep 2002 19:18

Raymond wrote:No, i don't see anything wrong, but the decisive question is: does it make any sense, and that is questionable.

I think this is a very interesting point.Yes indeed if to speak in terms of convincing your opponent it probably doesn't make much sense.
Usually the mature opponents are people who made up their mind on the issue in question and no matter how much evidence is being brought up to dissuade them from their convictions it would not wotk.Because they
prefer to see the evidence through their eyes ,picking on what seems to be suitable to their agenda etc.
However there are many people who don't have any formed opinion and
try to find out about some historical facts.
If they are not biased from the start the evidences and strong logical argumentation can assist them to obtain good historical knowledge about the subject they are interested in.
Regards.

atkif
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Postby atkif » 03 Sep 2002 19:30

Raymond wrote:Do you ever make such kind of postings? You should perhaps go to a kindergarten instead.

Good advice.How long ago didn't you get from there ?
I would not say it became already some historical fact.
P.S.BTW .What kindergarten you are going to ?

Lumpy Custard
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Postby Lumpy Custard » 03 Sep 2002 19:47

Quote atkif:
Interesting argumentation !!

I wasnt aware I was involved in argumentation on this topic!!. Who said I was arguing?, obviously you have misconstruded my post. I thought the whole idea of this forum was to discuss issues in a calm, civilised and adult fashion. From what I have seen this seems to cease and is replaced by engagements of childish bickering. Your opinion is your opinion and vice versa, but it seems you wont tolerate anyones opinion on this topic and the fact you are so staunch on "arguing" on it makes a statement to us all!!. I will cease contributions on this topic and leave you to "argue" it out. Chris.

Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 19:54

However there are many people who don't have any formed opinion and
try to find out about some historical facts.


A discussion is not necessary, if the historical fact has been proved.

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Postby Caldric » 03 Sep 2002 19:55

Leningrad was as much a holocaust as any of the death camps, that is good enough reason for posting information on it. The so-called "Siege" was really just the beginning of destroying all of Leningrad and its population. As they said they had no way to care for the population so it was better that they died.

atkif
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Postby atkif » 03 Sep 2002 19:56

Lumpy Custard wrote:
Your opinion is your opinion and vice versa, but it seems you wont tolerate anyones opinion on this topic and the fact you are so staunch on "arguing" on it makes a statement to us all!!.

I didn't want to offend you in any way. I regret if I did.
Simply when you want to share your opinions the constructions such as
"if being so ... they maybe would have done so ..still what do I know "
seem to be dubious in terms of their value.
There could not be any discussion in such a fashion.I would invent my
"if being so " - you would invent yours.
The more so when it comes to the discussion of the horrible historical events such as Holocaust or the siege of Leningrad or the Dresden bombardment. People died...Kids ,women.

Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 19:58

atkif wrote:
Raymond wrote:Do you ever make such kind of postings? You should perhaps go to a kindergarten instead.

Good advice.How long ago didn't you get from there ?
I would not say it became already some historical fact.
P.S.BTW .What kindergarten you are going to ?


Obviously no kindergarten, but a place of serious discussion about historical facts.

Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 20:01

Caldric wrote:Leningrad was as much a holocaust as any of the death camps, that is good enough reason for posting information on it. The so-called "Siege" was really just the beginning of destroying all of Leningrad and its population. As they said they had no way to care for the population so it was better that they died.



Mass killings did ever take place in history by various occasions and by many people, who have called himself human. Leningrad is one of them, a historical undoubtful fact.
Last edited by Raymond on 03 Sep 2002 20:02, edited 1 time in total.

atkif
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Postby atkif » 03 Sep 2002 20:01

Raymond wrote:A discussion is not necessary, if the historical fact has been proved.

Really? There are many people who try to distort and deny the historical evidence in every way possible.Read this forum posts and you will see by yourself.

Raymond
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Postby Raymond » 03 Sep 2002 20:03

atkif wrote:
Raymond wrote:A discussion is not necessary, if the historical fact has been proved.

Really? There are many people who try to distort and deny the historical evidence in every way possible.Read this forum posts and you will see by yourself.



Maybe atkif, but what is the purpose of discussing with deniers? I don't see anyone, it's mostly useless.

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Scott Smith
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Postby Scott Smith » 03 Sep 2002 20:08

Caldric wrote:Leningrad was as much a holocaust as any of the death camps, that is good enough reason for posting information on it. The so-called "Siege" was really just the beginning of destroying all of Leningrad and its population. As they said they had no way to care for the population so it was better that they died.

Caldric, do you really believe this? Since when is it the responsibility of an attacker to support the welfare of a besieged city maintaining resistance? Historically, a city that resists once the wall has been breached is starved and massacred or enslaved. The Germans had no such intentions, although they were reluctant to capture a panacea-target that would not be decisive for their ongoing campaign. But no surrender was offered and the Germans had no responsibility to support the resisting enemy population in any case. Wars kill people but wars are not fought to kill people--except when the enemy is the Nazis, of course, and the Victory of the Good-Guys is fantastic. Never Forget.
:)


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