Depth charges
Depth charges
Who sank RN's champion submarine HMS UPHOLDER? Italian or German destroyers?
Re: Depth charges
What type of sonar/asdic did German Navy use? Was it an active sonar with ping?
Italian Navy?
Italian Navy?
Re: Depth charges
It is possible she was sunk by Italian escort destroyer Pegaso but this isn't certain. There was only 1 German destroyer in Med ex.Greek - until they could get the hands on some Italian ones.
Yes both employed active sonars, some of the Italian ships had Germans models. There were a small number of Italian ships with active sonar at war start but it appears was more or less experimental. Almost all ships had passive sonar, even MAS which was a sort of tube put at sea and a crew member to listen. Looked like a big stethoscope.
Yes both employed active sonars, some of the Italian ships had Germans models. There were a small number of Italian ships with active sonar at war start but it appears was more or less experimental. Almost all ships had passive sonar, even MAS which was a sort of tube put at sea and a crew member to listen. Looked like a big stethoscope.
Re: Depth charges
Some Italian vessels were equipped with German active sonar:
https://rommelsriposte.com/2009/07/15/g ... n-vessels/
https://rommelsriposte.com/2015/12/06/u ... sels-pt-2/
In particular, if Pegaso had been re-equipped by the stated date, she would have carried German active sonar and depth charges on the date that HM/Sub Upholder was sunk:
https://rommelsriposte.com/2015/12/07/g ... sels-pt-3/
https://rommelsriposte.com/2009/07/15/g ... n-vessels/
https://rommelsriposte.com/2015/12/06/u ... sels-pt-2/
In particular, if Pegaso had been re-equipped by the stated date, she would have carried German active sonar and depth charges on the date that HM/Sub Upholder was sunk:
https://rommelsriposte.com/2015/12/07/g ... sels-pt-3/
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42
Re: Depth charges
Germany had active (S-Gerät) and passive (GHG)hydroaccoustics devices.
Detection range for passive devices >30km under optimal conditions against fast ships even at high own velocities (25 kn).
"Meine Herren, es kann ein siebenjähriger, es kann ein dreißigjähriger Krieg werden – und wehe dem, der zuerst die Lunte in das Pulverfaß schleudert!"
Re: Depth charges
Hi
There's a third possibility-a mine!
Until the wreck is found and surveyed then I think only then will we be able to get a better idea of what caused its fate.
Regards
Andy H
There's a third possibility-a mine!
Until the wreck is found and surveyed then I think only then will we be able to get a better idea of what caused its fate.
Regards
Andy H
Re: Depth charges
TBH, the mine theory just sounds like British naval officers unable to admit that Wanklyn could possibly have been lost to enemy action.
http://warfarehistorynetwork.com/daily/ ... th-africa/
http://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono ... holder.htm
https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?16261
http://warfarehistorynetwork.com/daily/ ... th-africa/
http://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono ... holder.htm
https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?16261
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42
Re: Depth charges
Hi UrmelUrmel wrote: ↑06 Aug 2018, 02:50TBH, the mine theory just sounds like British naval officers unable to admit that Wanklyn could possibly have been lost to enemy action.
http://warfarehistorynetwork.com/daily/ ... th-africa/
http://www.naval-history.net/xGM-Chrono ... holder.htm
https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?16261
I wouldn't disagree that that could be the case during the war, but there's nothing concrete thats 'surfaced' since the wars end to suggest categorically that it didn't either. Like with the Bismarck, how/why/who sank it is a small byline in the history books.
Regards
Andy H
Re: Depth charges
Well I believe it's philosphically impossible to prove that a mine strike didn't happen. You could equally argue that aliens from Planet Z abducted Upholder and her crew to benefit from Wanklyn's undoubted combat prowess. There's nothing that has surfaced to suggest categorically that that didn't happen either.
More to the point though, has that radio message one of the commanders who came up with the idea of a mine strike ever been produced?
More to the point though, has that radio message one of the commanders who came up with the idea of a mine strike ever been produced?
The enemy had superiority in numbers, his tanks were more heavily armoured, they had larger calibre guns with nearly twice the effective range of ours, and their telescopes were superior. 5 RTR 19/11/41
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42
The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle 1941/42