Schnellboote S6 - S9 class

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Peter
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Schnellboote S6 - S9 class

Post by Peter » 07 Jun 2004 14:18

Does anybody have a good source of operational data on these boats ?

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Xavier
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Post by Xavier » 07 Jun 2004 14:37

quotes from

"kriegsmarine Schnellboote" by classic warships publishing isbn 0-9710687-4-7
in late november 1933, S-6 was commisioned, the first to be built with diesel engines, but their weight caused a reduction in performance and she was only able to obtain a top speed of 32 knts, S-7 to S-9 were built with the MAN diesel engines, rated at 1320 hp each, but were problematic and had difficultiey attaining the desired power.

This group of boats was also the first to be built with a knuckle in the bow to improve sea keeping. All boats of the previous groups had spray strakes added to the bow. These three boats were commisioned in late 1934 through to mid 1935. Of note, the first S-boat depot ship, Tsingtau, was also commisioned in september 1934.
also:
When germany invade poland in september 1939, the "Kriegsmarine", or german navy had only 18 Schnelllbote in operation, S-6 to S-23 , forming two flotillas....
I will search for mentions of individual actions by these boats now...

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Post by Xavier » 09 Jun 2004 18:28

@ Iltis

sorry, neither kriegsmarine schnellboote by classic warship publishing nor schnellboote in action, by squadron publications gives any specific operational data (by boat number) on the ones requested,

My best guess would be they were deployed with the 1st Flotilla in the black sea (2 groups totalling 18 boats in in april-may 1942).

I guess the boats were lost on different dates before the base in Rumania suffered a massive bombing raid and later was abandoned, 1944, as the number of boats lost on the bombing raid and scuttled to prevent capture do not match any of the series in question (boats lost in 1944: s-26, s-40, s-42, s-52, and s-131 by bombardment, s-148 sunk by amine and s-28, s-45 s-47 s-51 and s-149 scuttled.

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Post by Xavier » 09 Jun 2004 18:46

another interesting bit of trivia:

boats S-1 to S-5 were given to the spanish nationalist navy:

from: http://www.prinzeugen.com/Armada.htm
In 1938 Kriegsmarine sold five decomissioned S-boote, S-1 to S-5 to the Nationalist Navy. These were somewhat worn-out experiemental boats already considered obsolete by the Germans, so their practical military value was doubtful. However, they were the first of a family of seventeen boats which was to survive in Spain as active naval units well into the 1970s.
this leaves the next series(the ones in question) for training, maybe not deployed in the black sea at all.... 8O

also, some S-38 series were transfered too:
In all, six Kriegsmarine S-38 type boats were transfered to the Armada (Spanish navy). Transfer was done in Burdeos (France) in two groups during August 1943. Originally painted in Schnellbootweiss, they were all overpainted in medium grey and given neutrality markings (Spanish flags painted on the hull side) before sailing to Pasajes (Spain) manned by their newly trained Spanish crews
. (numbers given in the page mentioned above)



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Post by Xavier » 09 Jun 2004 20:21

found a nice resume of the destiny of most boats:

from the page: http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/km ... rbleib.htm
S 6 1945 brit. Beute, 1947/48 verkauft
.lt. Gröner: 1937 spanisch Toledo, 1939 LT 14, § 1942
S 7 1945 brit. Beute + 2.5.1946 Nordsee (58.09n 10.50o)
S 8 1945 brit. Beute, 1947/48 verkauft
S 9 1945 USA-Beute, 18.1.46 OMGUS, (+) 2.5.46 Nordsee (58.09n 10.51o)
S 10 1945 USA, 18.1.46 OMGUS, Juli 1947 norw., § 1950, br.
S 11 1945 UdSSR, 5.11.45 TK 1002, § 1955
the list is compelte, but too long to post, if you want the compelte data, , please visit the link on top.

also a diff list, with different info on: http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waffen/S-Boote2.htm
S 6 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12410 23.11.1933 1937 an Spanien verkauft und als TOLEDO in Diesnt gestellt. 1939 in LT 14 umbenannt. 1942 getrichen.

S 7 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12430 10.10.1934 Im Mai 1945 britische Beute und am 2. Mai 1946 in der Nordsee versenkt.

S 8 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12425 06.09.1934 Am 11. September 1940 zur schnellen U-Jagd-Gruppe verlegt. Im Mai 1945 Hulk in Eckernförde, am 17. Mai 1945 in See versenkt.

S 9 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12415 12.06.1935 Am 5. August 1940 zur Schnellen U-Jagd-Gruppe verlegt.
Am 5. April 1941 zur Torpedo-Versuchs-Anstalt als Versuchsboot 1945 US-Beute, 1946 OMGUS. Am 2. Mai 1946 in See versenkt.

S 10 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12435 07.03.1935 Im März 1942 als V 5507 zur 55. Vorposten-Flottille
Anschießend als S 10 zur 51. Vorposten-Flottille 1945 US-Beute, 1946 OMGUS. Im Juli 1974 an Norwegen verkauft, ausgeschlachtet und abgebrochen.

S 11 Fr. Lürrsen, Bremen 12440 03.08.1935 Im März 1942 als V 5508 zur 55. Vorposten-Flottille
Anschießend als S 11 zur 51. Vorposten-Flottille 1945 Beute der UdSSR und am 5. November 1945 in TK 1002 umbenannt. Verbleib unbekannt.


both pages have more extensive listings, of all schnellbots

schnellboots by flotille: http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/km ... frames.htm

ADDENDUM: link to war chronicles, (Chronik des Seekrieges):
http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/chronik.htm very nice organized, much like Christoph Awender's WWII day by day, but marine Kriegsmarine only. only in german, like most of the links mentioned above.

more interesting pages:
http://www.freundeskreis-schnellbootflo ... /reich.htm
http://www.deutschekriegsmarine.de/Will ... lboote.htm


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Post by Xavier » 09 Jun 2004 21:27

the kriegsmarine files (!!) are giving results, at least two of the Schnellboote were involved in the invasion of norway:

from: http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/40-04.htm (april 1940) journal of the kriegsmarine,

homepage at: http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/chronik.htm
Kriegsschiffsgruppe 4 (Kristiansand-Süd und Arendal): Kpt.z.S. Rieve auf dem Leichten Kreuzer Karlsruhe und mit den T-Booten Luchs, Greif, Seeadler sowie Schnellbootbegleitschiff Tsingtau und S-Booten S 7, S 8, S 17, S 30, S 31, S 32, S 33.
in the june 1940 page, at closing of operations in norway, one Schnellboote (no number given) is mentioned as lost in the campaing, among other losses.

up to july 1941, these were the boot of the 1st flotile (lowest numbers):
10.7.1941
Ostsee
Die l. S-Flottille mit S 28, S 26, S 101, S 40 und S 39 greift im Finnenbusen bei Ekholm einen sowj. Verband an. Sie treffen jedoch nur den nach einem Minentreffer am 5.7. auf der Sperre des finn. U-Bootes Vesihiisi (Kptlt. Kijanen) aufgesetzten lett. Dampfer Rasma (3204 BRT).
another mention:
14.7.1941
Ostsee
Die l. S-Flottille mit S 26, S 27, S 28, S 40 und S 101 greift ohne Erfolg einen sowj. Konvoi bei Ekholm im Finnenbusen an
several Schnelboots are mentioned between this last quote and the begining of the russian campaing.

you will find mentions (up to this date) of S-7, S-8, and S-9 but these are Soviet submarines "Die sowjet. U-Boote"

I will continue to surf the site, as is very interesting, any update will be added to this very post.

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Last edited by Xavier on 10 Jun 2004 16:31, edited 1 time in total.

Peter
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Post by Peter » 10 Jun 2004 06:46

thanks guys, this is useful stuff

Pete

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Post by Andy H » 10 Jun 2004 18:53

German S-Boote at War, 1939-1945
Dallies-Labourdette, Jean-Philippe
Paris: Histoire & Collections, 2003

I believe that the above book is a good source book for such information, which you maybe able to get at your local library.

Andy H

TL
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Dallies-labourdette...

Post by TL » 15 Dec 2004 13:34

Hello folks!

I'm actually reading the Schnellbootwaffe book mentioned by Andy at the moment. It has loads of interesting pictures and the text doesn't seem half bad either (note: I'm no expert on the subject, so I cannot really comment on the books actual accuracy). Basically, after a brief glance it looks kosher.

HOWEVER, the translation from French to English and especially the editing is not far at all from appalling. Typos and poor English riddle the text (one plate shows "insignas of Schnellboote in Mediterranean Sea"...need I say more). Embarrassingly, some small parts are still in French as they have obviously been missed by the translator and editor (actually I don't believe there has even been an editor as such working on the text). The text constantly refers to SchnellbootE even if there's only one in a picture etc. (e.g. 2 "one type x Schnellboote in Ostende harbour"), which, I believe, is quite poor German. On top of it all in my copy is missing the pages 96-104 and pages 105-111 appear TWICE (I' too frustrated to contact Powell's, where I got it from through Abebooks).

Uboat.net says that although D-L's book on the Ubootwaffe is full of great pictures the text and captions are riddled with basic mistakes and inaccuracies. Maybe it's the same with this Schnellbootwaffe book?

As far as I can tell, it boils down to almost disastrous editing and nice layout + pictures.

Later,

TL

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Re: Dallies-labourdette...

Post by Tiornu » 15 Dec 2004 15:24

Thanks for pointing this out. I have the book but have looked at it only long enough to be impressed with its visual presentation. Now, I'm checking--at least my copy has pages 96-104....

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Post by Erich » 16 Dec 2004 18:13

The Frecnh edition was printed in two volumes, both the same but with different covers. the French book (which I have) have copied much of it's materials from Classic Warships soft bound as well as the ultimate book so far on the subject in German, Gerhard Hümmelchens "Schnellboote im Zweiten Weltkrieg" by Mittler & Sohn GmbH c 1996, and it's OOP sadly. It is THEE book on the S-booten and operations.
Squadron signal is having work done on the second volume of the S-boots at present covering ops and S-boot personell, etc...........

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Re: Schnellboote S6 - S9 class

Post by Xavier » 18 Jul 2009 15:59

any news on the second part of the Squadron signal book?
Xavier
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