Siebel Ferries and MFPs

Discussions on all (non-biographical) aspects of the Kriegsmarine except those dealing with the U-Boat forces.
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Kloster
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Post by Kloster » 27 Apr 2005 21:49

eisenbahn9 wrote:Are those the same rail ferries modified to carry captured KV-1s to Malta for Operation C3/Herkules?

Also, can anyone translate this:

Ladefahigkeit an schwersten Lasten: 1 Tiger-Panzer + Zubehor

and... Belastungsgrenze fur Klapprampe 70t


This is taken from a Modell-Fan article on the MFP Typ D.
1) loading capacity at heaviest load (Cargo): 1 tiger tank + accessories (shells, fuel, crew, the works)

2) Max limit (weight wise) for the Folding ramp, 70 Tonz

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Post by eisenbahn9 » 28 Apr 2005 01:47

Vielen dank!

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Post by eisenbahn9 » 29 Apr 2005 22:15

Siebel ferries could be disassembled and transported by rail. Were MFPs also rail-transportable? If not, does this mean all MFPs operating in the Mediterranean were constructed in Italian shipyards?

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PT Dockyard
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Post by PT Dockyard » 30 Apr 2005 02:21

I don't think they went by rail, but I have seen pictures of them traveling through France on Truck. Probably between canals. While most in the Med were built there, some were transferred this way.

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Harri
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Post by Harri » 30 Apr 2005 17:53

Siebel barges were used in 1942 also on Lake Ladoga in Finland where Finnish - German - Italian Joint Naval Forces operated against the shipping of Leningrad. German Einsatzstab Fähre Ost (E.F.O.) led by Oberstleutnant F. Siebel had a total 7 heavy, 8 light and 6 transport barges ("column barge") as well as nine infantry boats with the carrying capacity of 50 soldiers. Are there any good site on these Siebel barges (or is "ferry" a better word)? What kind of vessel is "infantry boat"? What were the correct full German names of these vessels (Siebel-Fähre, I-Boot / I-Fähre?)?

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PT Dockyard
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Post by PT Dockyard » 30 Apr 2005 22:36

The I boot is more properly called the Infantrielandungsboote. Here is a picture of one in the Adriatic after it's capture by the British.
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kfbr392
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Post by kfbr392 » 09 May 2005 20:50

eisenbahn9 wrote:Siebel ferries could be disassembled and transported by rail. Were MFPs also rail-transportable? If not, does this mean all MFPs operating in the Mediterranean were constructed in Italian shipyards?
Italian shipyards build over 100 MFP.

MFP's were made assembled from sections. once welded together, the craft could not be disassembled.
There was a way to transport MFP on roads using special trailers and powerful tractors. Over 80 were transported through france in that fashion, 50 through Germany to the danube for use in the black sea, and more through italy and the like.

the major obstacle to bring germany built crafts to the mediteranean was the narrow chanels of france. the route was rhine, rhine-rhone channel, rhone. in january 1944 the first MNL (Marine Nachschub Leichter - navy supplies lighter) was delivered which with its width of 5150mm could travel this way. this was the reason for its construction. MFPs could not.

MAL (Marine Artillerie Leichter) were made of 9 rail transportable sections that were riveted together. they could thus be disassembled.



A+
Last edited by kfbr392 on 11 Mar 2006 21:56, edited 1 time in total.

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Xavier
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Post by Xavier » 01 Feb 2006 16:11


eisenbahn9
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Post by eisenbahn9 » 18 Feb 2006 20:20

Very impressive shot of the MFPs! Any idea where this was taken?

Also, are those Siebelfahren in the background (righthand side of
the picture)? The bridge structure looks about right for that type
of vessel.

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Post by eisenbahn9 » 18 Feb 2006 20:38

Wanted to mention this find: Wolfgang Schneider's book "Tigers in Combat, Vol. I" has three photos of a Siebelfahre transporting a Tiger I tank (and several Mk IIIs) across the Strait of Messina during the evacuation of Sicily. The pictures are close-ups showing mainly the Tiger tank but you see some nice stern details on the Siebelfahre as well.

I didn't buy the book (otherwise I would have posted the pics) but it's worth checking out if you can find it at a local bookstore. One drawback is that the picture reproduction quality throughout the book is IMO less-than-average. It's printed on a somewhat coarse-grade paper.

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Post by PPoS » 27 Feb 2006 00:47

Were there any Kriegsmarine landing crafts fitted with "Flugzeugmotorenantrieb", airplane engines used for locomotion ?
I have a picture with an unknown WW2 landingcraft with two propeller engines on it, but I don't know however it's german or not.

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kfbr392
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Post by kfbr392 » 10 Mar 2006 19:19

PPoS wrote:Were there any Kriegsmarine landing crafts fitted with "Flugzeugmotorenantrieb", airplane engines used for locomotion ?
I have a picture with an unknown WW2 landingcraft with two propeller engines on it, but I don't know however it's german or not.
Yes!

When Germany was peparing the Invasion of England in July of 1940 old 600HP BMW aircraft engines that had run past their 1000 hour life time were used to power engineless barges. Germany had no landing ships at that time only unpowered barges and spare aircraft engines!
Such engines were also fitted to pontoons connected by a deck, creating the first Siebel ferries.

Later Diesel engines were used because they were easier to maintain and consumed less and cheaper fuel that exploded less likely.

Interestingly, the first MFPs had one Diesel and two such aircraft engines, but only a handfull were built in that configurations, all further 1000 MFP had 3 truck Diesels.

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PPoS
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Post by PPoS » 11 Mar 2006 01:59

Thanks alot for that information! Do you know where one can find some pictures of this craft ?

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kfbr392
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Post by kfbr392 » 11 Mar 2006 21:57

there are two german books that have all these pics and lots of info:

Kugler, "Das Landungswesen"
Schneider, "Plattbugkreuzer"

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PPoS
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Post by PPoS » 16 Mar 2006 17:21

Thx for the tip!

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