More IJN Officer Info

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ijnfleetadmiral
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by ijnfleetadmiral » 29 May 2019 14:04

Awesome...thanks for the info! One question:

1) For MOTOBAYASHI Fujiro, if he was commissioned a Surgeon in 1932, how could he have been posted as Surgeon of 1st Minesweeper Division from 15 November 1927 - 1 February 1929? Just curious.
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fontessa
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 30 May 2019 19:40

Oh, it was may mistake.
He was commissioned 昭和2年4月 April 1927. I have mistook to convert 昭和2年 to 1932.

And additional correcion.
was:
1st Minesweeper Division
Medical Officers
LTJG / LTJG KIMURA Masao 木村正雄 (1924): 15 July 1926 - 3 May 1927 (1926.7.16.Frm17 / 1927.5.4.Frm4)
is:
1st Minesweeper Division
Medical Officers
LTJG / LTJG KIMURA Masao 木村正雄 (1925): 15 July 1926 - 3 May 1927 (1926.7.16.Frm17 / 1927.5.4.Frm4)

fontessa

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by ijnfleetadmiral » 30 May 2019 22:47

Thanks for the info and the correction!
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fontessa
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 03 Jun 2019 12:14

Hello ijnfleetadmiral,

I would like to correct the English Translation for 重城石松.
was:
SHIGESHIRO Ishimatsu
is:
ジュウジャヤウ=ジュウジョウ
JUJO Ishimatsu
fontessa wrote:
ijnfleetadmiral wrote: CHOKAI
Surgeons
Medical Officers
LT / LCDR SHIGESHIRO Ishimatsu: 1 November 1934 - 31 October 1935

fontessa
LT / LCDR JUJO Ishimatsu 重城石松 (1926): 1 November 1934 - 31 October 1935 (1934.11.2.Frm15 / 1935.11.2.Frm8)

JujoIshimatsu.jpg

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ijnfleetadmiral
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by ijnfleetadmiral » 03 Jun 2019 22:06

Understood...thanks for the correction!
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fontessa
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 16 Jun 2019 21:23

Hello ijnfleetadmiral,

I was confused about how to read 河野通徳.
fontessa wrote: 4th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
CDR / CDR KONO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 21 November 1921 - 1 December 1922 (1921.11.21.Frm7 / 1922.12.2.Frm10)

11th Submarine Division (2nd Gen.)
Commanding Officers
??? / CDR KAWANO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): ??? - 9 February 1924 (1924.2.13.Frm6)

12th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
(ACTING) LCDR / CDR KONO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.21.Frm7)

13th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
(ADD) (ACTING) LCDR / KONO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.22.Frm7)

14th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
LCDR / LCDR KAWANO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 18 September 1919 - 1 November 1919 (1919.9.20.Frm5 / 1919.11.4.Frm7)

16th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
CDR / CDR KONO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 1 December 1922 - 20 December 1924 (1922.12.2.Frm10 / 1924.12.23.Frm2)

fontessa
河野 of 河野通徳 has two ways of reading.
カワノ KAWANO
コウノ KONO
In the table of contents of 海軍義済会員名簿 Naval Gisei-kai lists, 河野通徳 is included in the category beginning with "カ KA". So his family name was KAWANO, not KONO

So:
4th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
CDR / CDR b]KAWANO[/b] Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 21 November 1921 - 1 December 1922 (1921.11.21.Frm7 / 1922.12.2.Frm10)

12th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
(ACTING) LCDR / CDR KAWANO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.21.Frm7)

13th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
(ADD) (ACTING) LCDR / CDR KAWANO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.22.Frm7)

16th Submarine Division (1st Gen.)
Commanding Officers
CDR / CDR KAWANO Michinori 河野通徳 (32): 1 December 1922 - 20 December 1924 (1922.12.2.Frm10 / 1924.12.23.Frm2)


fontessa

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by ijnfleetadmiral » 17 Jun 2019 03:52

Understood...thanks for the info!
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by Steve E » 19 Jun 2019 14:49

Hi fontessa,
could Kawano Michinori have been the CO of Submarine No-14 (later HA-9) from 18 September 1919 - 1 November 1919 and not CO of the 14th Submarine Division .(1st Gen.) ?
The Naval Data Base has 第14潜水隊艦長 -19.12/1
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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 20 Jun 2019 04:18

Hello Steve,

第14潜水隊司令 CO of 14th Submarine Division was his regular post and 第14潜水隊潜水艦長 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO was his additional post.

KAWANO Michinori
CO of 14th Submarine Division: 18 September 1919 - 1 November 1919
(ADD) 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO: 18 September 1919 - 1 November 1919
14th Submarine Division Submarine CO: 1 November 1919 - 20 November 1920
(ACTING) 12th Submarine Division: 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.22.Frm7)
(ADD) (ACTING) 13th Submarine Division: 20 November 1920 - 21 November 1921 (1920.11.22.Frm7 / 1921.11.22.Frm7)

KawanoMichinori.jpg

第14潜水隊潜水艦長 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO was different from the 第14潜水艦長 14th Submarine CO. Unfortunately I do not know what the former is like.

The below is the list of 14th Submarine COs.
(CEO) LT / LCDR 沢野源四郎: 5 August 1919 - 1 December 1919 (1919.8.6.Frm4 / 1919.12.2.Frm12)
(ADD) (CEO) LT / LT ARIMOTO Akira 有本明 (37): 1 December 1919 - 30 April 1920 (1919.12.2.Frm13 / 1920.5.3.Frm3)
(ACTING) LT / LT ARIMOTO Akira 有本明 (37): 1 December 1919 - 30 April 1920 (1919.12.2.Frm13 / 1920.5.3.Frm3)
VACANT: 30 April 1920 - 1 December 1920
(ACTING) LT / LT OGINO Nakaichiro 荻野仲一郎 (27): 1 December 1920 - 1 April 1921 (1920.12.2.Frm18 / 1921.4.2.Frm9)
LCDR / LCDR SHIRANE Teisuke 白根貞介 (34): 1 April 1921 - 1 December 1921 (1921.4.2.Frm9 / 1921.12.2.Frm11)
LT / ??? MASUOKA Seitaro 枡岡誠太郎 (40): 1 December 1921 - ??? (1921.12.2.Frm12)
VACANT: ??? - 1 December 1922
LCDR / LCDR MATSUNO Seizo 松野省三 (36): 1 December 1922 - 10 November 1923 (1922.12.2.Frm11 / 1923.11.13.Frm4)
VACANT: 10 November 1923 - 1 December 1923
(ADD) LCDR / LCDR ISHII Junzo 石井順三 (36): 1 December 1923 - 9 February 1924 (1923.12.4.Frm12 / 1924.2.13.Frm6)
The following records also remain.
??? / LT KAWANO Shizuo 河野静雄 (39): ??? - 16 February 1921 (1921.2.17.Frm3)
LT / LT SATO Tsutomu 佐藤勉 (40): 16 February 1921 - 1 December 1922 (1921.2.17.Frm3)
There is confusion in the record of 14th Submarine CO.

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by Steve E » 20 Jun 2019 12:53

Hi fontessa,
for No-14 I have:
CEO:Lt.Sawano Genchiro [35]=05/08/1919-01/12/1919;
CEO:Lt.Cdr.Arimoto Akira [37]=01/12/1919-30/04/1920;
CO:Lt.Sawano Genchiro [35]=15/09/1919-01/12/1919;
CO:Lt.Cdr.Arimoto Akira [37]=01/12/1919-30/04/1920;
CO:Vacant:30/04/1920-01/12/1920;
CO:Lt.Kono Shizuo [39]=01/12/1920- ?? KAWANO Shizuo ?? delete ?
(A)CO:Lt.Ogino Chuichiro [37]=01/12/1920- ? ??
CO:Lt.Sato Tsutomu [40]=16/02/1921- ?
CO:Lt.Cdr.Shirane Teisuke [34]=01/04/1921-01/12/1921;
CO:Lt.Masuoka Taro [40]=01/12/1921- ?
CO:Lt.Sato Tsutomu [40]=01/12/1921-01/12/1922; delete? Vacant ??
CO:Lt.Cdr.Matsuno Seizo [36]=01/12/1922-09/11/1923;
CO:Vacant:09/11/1923-01/12/1923;
CO:Lt.Cdr.Ishii Junzo [36]=01/12/1923- ?
CO:

If "第14潜水隊潜水艦長 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO was his additional post" means he was the CO of one of the Submarines in Sub. Div.14 as an additional duty it would have to be RO-11(ex No-19) or RO_12 (ex No-20) who were in S.D.14 from the 18/09/1919 - 1923 or Ha-10(ex No-15) from 01/11/1919-30/04/1920;
It is all very confusing.
Steve.

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 20 Jun 2019 19:09

Hello Steve,
fontessa wrote: The below is the list of 14th Submarine COs.
The source of above is Official Gazette, a trusted source, but in this case there is confusion.
Steve E wrote: It is all very confusing.
I agree.
Steve E wrote: If "第14潜水隊潜水艦長 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO was his additional post" means he was the CO of one of the Submarines in Sub. Div.14
Unfortunately I don’t know what was 第14潜水隊潜水艦長. I could not find any material on this. Instead, I found the 1st Submersible Division, the predecessor of 1st Submarine Divishion.
https://www.jacar.archives.go.jp/aj/met ... 7%E9%95%B7&
Click [表示]

According to it, the composision of 第1潜水艇隊 1st Submersible Divishion on 1 December 1905 was as the below. As shown 1st boat had 2 Cos. I guess CDR OGURI Kozaburo took command by boarding 1st boat. I also think “Submersible Boat CO” show it. Currently I can only guess this much.
1st Submersible Divishion Commanding Officer and Submersible Boat CO
--- CDR OGURI Kozaburo 小栗孝三郎 (15)
1st Submersible Boat Co
--- CDR OGURI Kozaburo 小栗孝三郎 (15)
--- LCDR TOJO Meiji 東条明次 (21)
2nd Submersible Boat Co
--- LCDR MATSUMURA Jun'ich 松村純一 (18)
3rd Submersible Boat Co
--- LTJG TAGUCHI Shigeki 田口刺戟 (29)
4th Submersible Boat Co
--- LT FUKUDA Ichiro 福田一郎 (26)
5th Submersible Boat Co
--- LT SOSA Tanetsugu 匝嵯胤次 (26)

The below is 1st - 5th Holland class submersible boats of 1st Submersible Division.

1stSubmersibleDivision.jpg

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by Steve E » 22 Jun 2019 13:46

Hallo fontessa,
OGURI Kozaburo was the CO of 1st Submersible Division and the CO of 1st Submersible Boat at the same time as an additional duty.

For Kawano Michinori if
"第14潜水隊潜水艦長 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO was his additional post" means he was the CO of one of the Submarines in Sub. Div.14 as an additional duty, not of Sub No-14. It would have to be RO-11(ex No-19) which was in S.D.14 from the 18/09/1919 -04/06/1923.
I have no CO for RO_11 from the 01/11/1919-01/12/1920 so Kawano Michinori could have been the CO.

What do you think?
Steve.

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 22 Jun 2019 23:58

Hello Steve,
Steve E wrote: I have no CO for RO_11 from the 01/11/1919-01/12/1920 so Kawano Michinori could have been the CO.
What do you think?
You got a good point.

Kawano Michinori:
12th Submarine Division Submarine CO: 31 July 1919 - 18 September 1919 (1919.8.11.Frm4 / 1919.9.21.Frm5)
(ADD) 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO: 18 September 1919 - 1 November 1919 (1919.9.21.Frm5 / 1919.11.4.Frm7)
14th Submarine Division Submarine CO: 1 November 1919 - 20 November 1920 (1919.11.4.Frm7 / 1920.11.22.Frm7)

According to your page, RO-11 affiliation was as follows.
12th Submarine Division: 31 July 1919 - 18 September 1919
14th Submarine Division: 18 September - 1919 4 June 1923

So the following is expected.
Kawano Michinori:
RO-11 CO: 31 July 1919 - 20 November 1920

On 1 December 1920, when KASUGA Atsushi was appointed acting CO of RO-11, LT 宮崎平 MIYAZAKI Tadashi (37) was released from of the 14th Submarine Division Submarine CO. He looks like KONO's successor, but he was not appointed as a Submarine CO from November 21st to November 30th, 1920. His appointment was before November 20, and until November 20, KONO and MIYAZAKI were simultaneously in charge of the Submarine CO.

************************
Question:
Do you know the submarines under 13th Submarine Division of the late 1919?


fontessa

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by Steve E » 23 Jun 2019 05:03

Hi fontessa,
Thanks for the info.
The 13th Sub. Div. Submarines were:
HA-1=02/11/1918-15/03/1921
HA-2=02/11/1918-15/03/1921
HA-10=02/11/1918-01/11/1919
HA-7=02/11/1918-01/11/1919
HA-8=02/11/1918-01/11/1919
HA-6=01/11/1919-01/04/1929
RO-14=17/02/1921-01/7/1921
HA-7=15/03/1921-01/04/1929
HA-8=15/03/1921-01/04/1929
01/04/1929=Deactivated;
I-121=15/10/1931-31/05/1943
I-122=15/10/1931-31/05/1943
I-123=25/02/1942-05/10/1942+
31/05/1943=Deactivated;
Steve.

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Re: More IJN Officer Info

Post by fontessa » 23 Jun 2019 19:30

Hello Steve,

Thank you

fontessa

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