German Railways in the East

Discussions on the economic history of the nations taking part in WW2, from the recovery after the depression until the economy at war.
DougENash
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by DougENash » 23 Sep 2021 23:15

Everyone,
This thread is brilliant - the breakdown and description of how the German Armed Forces conducted railway operations is simply mind-boggling. I've never seen anything like this on the internet, anywhere. So this leads me to ask my question - given everything that has been said on all 44 pages of this thread, I haven't seen anything in terms of maps concerning locations of German defensive installations along the railways in the East. I am specifically looking for a single stretch of railway running from Brest Litovsk northwest to Bialystok, running through the eastern outskirts of Wysokie Litevski and Czeremcha. Does a map exist that depicts the location of any or all "forts" constructed along this stretch of vital railway to protect it from partisan attacks? I'm looking for information for the period April to end of July 1944.
Thank you! ---
Doug Nash

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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 30 Sep 2021 10:06

DougENash wrote:
23 Sep 2021 23:15
Everyone,
This thread is brilliant - the breakdown and description of how the German Armed Forces conducted railway operations is simply mind-boggling. I've never seen anything like this on the internet, anywhere. So this leads me to ask my question - given everything that has been said on all 44 pages of this thread, I haven't seen anything in terms of maps concerning locations of German defensive installations along the railways in the East. I am specifically looking for a single stretch of railway running from Brest Litovsk northwest to Bialystok, running through the eastern outskirts of Wysokie Litevski and Czeremcha. Does a map exist that depicts the location of any or all "forts" constructed along this stretch of vital railway to protect it from partisan attacks? I'm looking for information for the period April to end of July 1944.
Thank you! ---
Doug Nash
Unlikely and I have never seen much material for HG Mitte railway area because, of course, Operation Bagration overran the are so quickly that most of the records were lost or abandoned. Some rae held at Holocaust Memorial Museum in New York and some have started to appear in the German-Russian cooperation to digitize German documents in Russian archives but very little has surfaced to date.

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Der Alte Fritz
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 30 Sep 2021 10:18

Document for the Air Force assessing German military capacity in late 1942

The main military-economic base of the enemy is located in Germany, with which the enemy troops are connected by a poorly developed railway network
Describes the period from 09/13/1942 to 09/13/1942.
Directives and guidelines. Document number: 332683с, Date of document creation: 09/13/1942
Archive: TsAMO, Fund: 311, Inventory: 0004495, File: 0014, Document start sheet in the case: 69
Authors of the document: Air Force KA, Air Force Major General Zhuravlev
Describes the combat operation: no data
https://pamyat-naroda.ru/documents/view/?id=454695840

DougENash
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Re: German Railway Forts

Post by DougENash » 30 Sep 2021 11:31

Back to the topic of German railway forts - here's an original 1915 map, depicting the portion of the Brest Litovsk-Bialystok railway that I'm interested in. This map currently resides in the US Library of Congress, and how it got there, I have no idea- except perhaps it was brought back by an American veteran of the war. Anyway, WW1 Maps (I believe this one was produced by Austro-Hungary using Russian data) were frequently used during WW2 if nothing else was available. This particular map may be such an example. One thing of note is that someone has marked the location of some sort of installation, denoted with "W3" or "W2.5." For some of the towns, someone has hand-written the German equivalent of the Russian Cyrillic name of a town, such as Lyszczyce, Kustyn, or Male Zwody. I have found the War Diary (KTB) of Korueck 580, which was headquartered next to the Bahnhof in Stare Lyszczyce during the first half of July 1944; also, this KTB mentions that Russische-Reiter Abteilung 580 was quartered in Kustyn to provide rear area security for Korueck 580. The location of "W3" next to the Bahnhof roughly corresponds to where I think the railway fort was located. Would anyone know what "W3" might signify? That is, might it be a standard design of a defensive installation for the railway? Thanks -
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by GregSingh » 01 Oct 2021 02:21

That's the German copy of Russian pre-WW1 map. These are quite old maps and I would think any notes on them would have been done during WWI perhaps, not WWII. Size of "W" suggests it was a single building rather than a group of them like a "fort".

Pls. see area of Łyszczyce train station on Polish 1931 map. You will see a single building in the spot where "W3" is on WWI map.

1931.jpg

Luckily we have a 1944 aerial photo from National Archives at College Park.
I see a single building there. Looks like a mechanical workshop which possibly could be converted to a stronghold.

1944.jpg
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by GregSingh » 01 Oct 2021 02:45

This is from 1943 on another railroad. They used numbers not letters for "Stützpunkt".
Some of them could host more than 20 people. Unfortunately no clues how they looked like...

1943.jpg
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by GregSingh » 05 Oct 2021 05:39

August 1940 article by Dr.Gerteis (Ostbahn president), outlining important role of railroads in GG in German-Soviet commodities/goods exchange in 1940.
This subject was already covered earlier in this topic, although article mentions incompability of rail systems and confirms that all railway border crossing were used for trade, not only those important ones like Brest or Przemysl.

1940.jpg

Article was written on the occasion of 28th East Trade Fair in Königsberg.
Here is Erich Koch's welcoming message in Russian:

Koch 1940.jpg

A booklet about Soviet economy, prepared for the Fair.
Die UdSSR auf der 28. Deutschen Ostmesse 1940 in Königsberg (Pr)
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TheMarcksPlan
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by TheMarcksPlan » 23 Nov 2021 21:58

Der Alte Fritz wrote:
25 Jan 2014 14:24
We know further details of the Ostbau Programmes from the FMS papers.
I can recommend reading this US report
Is this available online?
https://medium.com/counterfactualww2
"The whole question of whether we win or lose the war depends on the Russians." - FDR, June 1942

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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 24 Nov 2021 05:58

Most of the English language Foreign MIlitary Studies studies are available at
https://www.fold3.com/title/490/wwii-fo ... es-1945-54

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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by TheMarcksPlan » 24 Nov 2021 07:06

Der Alte Fritz wrote:
24 Nov 2021 05:58
Most of the English language Foreign MIlitary Studies studies are available at
https://www.fold3.com/title/490/wwii-fo ... es-1945-54
I had no idea, that's a huge help. I have schlepped an hour or so to my alma mater to get one of these. Thanks!
https://medium.com/counterfactualww2
"The whole question of whether we win or lose the war depends on the Russians." - FDR, June 1942

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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by Der Alte Fritz » 25 Nov 2021 12:49

German versions and ones which were never translated can be found at Bundesarchiv Freiburg I think.

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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by GregSingh » 05 Dec 2021 09:50

Printed in Germany in late 1935 for DR New York office.

August 1935.jpg
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Re: German Railways in the East

Post by Dann Falk » 05 Dec 2021 20:12

Greetings All,

Something that might be of interest.
Deutsche Reichsbahn 1939 - small.jpg
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