Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi All,
We have three U/WakoFest personnel shelters on Alderney; all are of the same design. Attached is a plan,
Trevor D
We have three U/WakoFest personnel shelters on Alderney; all are of the same design. Attached is a plan,
Trevor D
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- Dohlenfeste Personnel shelter.jpg (65.28 KiB) Viewed 1594 times
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi AvB,AvB wrote:The one at Corbiere has been closed for a long time now?
It was entered by the CIOS in 1990/01 and to quote the piece about it in CIOS Review Nr.19
MalcolmThis bunker, sealed in 1951, was well flooded and stripped of most of its fittings. However, more electrical wiring, fuse boxes and telephone equipment was observed than is normal in a personnel shelter. It was also noted that all the floors were tiled, even the gas lock and entrance area. built adjacent is a Tobruk Stand but the two constructions are not linked internally.
David Letto 1991
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hello
Here a other drawing from the Waffen Prü. Fest. range a "Kampfstand mit 3-Schartenturm am steilen Vorderhang"
this bunker looks a lot like the one at Margival , typical is that this type of bunker was never build in the Atlantikwall .
Regards Jos
Here a other drawing from the Waffen Prü. Fest. range a "Kampfstand mit 3-Schartenturm am steilen Vorderhang"
this bunker looks a lot like the one at Margival , typical is that this type of bunker was never build in the Atlantikwall .
Regards Jos
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- Vorhang.JPG (122.92 KiB) Viewed 1468 times
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi All,
Great thread and like M19 Madmal I quite like the U/WakoFest type shelters, they are quirky because they are unique to the Channel Islands and their name (locally) is pretty cool also.
With U/WakoFest Mike Ginns/Rudi Rolf translates this to "Unterstand/Waffen Kommision Festungen". Which makes perfect logical sense and I agree with this.
But in Rudi Rolfs book they are reffered to as "Entwicklungsbericht WaPru Fest", What is the actual translation for this and why different to the anacronym U\WaKoFest? surely it would then be called at E\WaPruFest?
Pretty certain I'm all confused here and would be very grateful if someone could sort me out
thanks for any help
Grappener
Great thread and like M19 Madmal I quite like the U/WakoFest type shelters, they are quirky because they are unique to the Channel Islands and their name (locally) is pretty cool also.
With U/WakoFest Mike Ginns/Rudi Rolf translates this to "Unterstand/Waffen Kommision Festungen". Which makes perfect logical sense and I agree with this.
But in Rudi Rolfs book they are reffered to as "Entwicklungsbericht WaPru Fest", What is the actual translation for this and why different to the anacronym U\WaKoFest? surely it would then be called at E\WaPruFest?
Pretty certain I'm all confused here and would be very grateful if someone could sort me out
thanks for any help
Grappener
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi,
Another 'odd' feature is that the crew room of the U/WaKoFest bunkers in the Channel Islands is always larger in respect to the bunker compaired to the 600 types
Compare the size of the M.G Turret Bunker's crew room to the 633. Both were provided with 9 beds yet the 633's is about 30% smaller
Malcolm
Another 'odd' feature is that the crew room of the U/WaKoFest bunkers in the Channel Islands is always larger in respect to the bunker compaired to the 600 types
Compare the size of the M.G Turret Bunker's crew room to the 633. Both were provided with 9 beds yet the 633's is about 30% smaller
Malcolm
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- From, German Fortifications in Guernsey by Ernie Gavey
- php9ILZeUAM.jpg (75.16 KiB) Viewed 1430 times
Last edited by M19 MADMAL on 13 Mar 2009, 19:14, edited 1 time in total.
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hello All
It looks that every drawing of the Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers have a number , I don't
think that it's a Regelbaunumber but it would be easy to classifed these bunkers .
Regards Jos
P.S. I will make a list as soon as possible .
It looks that every drawing of the Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers have a number , I don't
think that it's a Regelbaunumber but it would be easy to classifed these bunkers .
Regards Jos
P.S. I will make a list as soon as possible .
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi Jos,jopaerya wrote:It looks that every drawing of the Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers have a number , I don't
think that it's a Regelbaunumber but it would be easy to classifed these bunkers.
Do you think that these Numbers should be excepted as a 'offical' recognition for identifying these types.
I'm thinking 'Jersey's German Bunkers' again
Malcolm
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hello Malcolm
They are Zeichnung ( drawing ) numbers , they are not official numbers , but the number represents a bunker .
For example the so called U/WakoFest are know as Zeichnung Waffen Prü. Fest. Nr. 44 .
Regards Jos
They are Zeichnung ( drawing ) numbers , they are not official numbers , but the number represents a bunker .
For example the so called U/WakoFest are know as Zeichnung Waffen Prü. Fest. Nr. 44 .
Regards Jos
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hello
I came across this bunker for a turret for M.G. and a tankturret , was this bunker ever build ??
Informaton = Festung Guernsey ( Thanks Neil )
Regards Jos
I came across this bunker for a turret for M.G. and a tankturret , was this bunker ever build ??
Informaton = Festung Guernsey ( Thanks Neil )
Regards Jos
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- axis bunker.jpg (68.72 KiB) Viewed 1053 times
- AvB
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Yes it is, in Stp Langenberg.
It's closed but there. There are more small Vf designs for 20P7 (like the bunker at Wn Doktorhaus (Jersey)) on the islands. Too much 20P7s left probably! One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
It's closed but there. There are more small Vf designs for 20P7 (like the bunker at Wn Doktorhaus (Jersey)) on the islands. Too much 20P7s left probably! One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Yes a total of 15 20P7 turrets were brought to Jersey in June 1943 and a Dutch floating 100 ton crane (called Anton) was used to unload them. With the run-down of the fortifications construction programme only 7 were mounted in standard 'St' constructions.AvB wrote:Too much 20P7s left probably! One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
The decision was made to ship the other 8 back to France in May 1944 but, due to the events of D-Day 2 were trapped on Jersey so they were put to use and mounted on small non-standard bunkers (Stp. Doktorhaus & Wn. Fort Henry) using whatever materials could be sourced locally.
It looks like the same applied in Guernsey and Alderney with several turret being mounted on whatever could be used to construct a bunker for them.
Did you know that one was also placed between Batterie Dollmann and MP3 on GuernseyAvB wrote:One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
The 1st photo below shows the 20P7 turret installed at Stp. Windmühlenburg. Alderney. The fact that the turret is so high above the ground and banked up with soil would indicate that it must only be placed on a small room/foundation (Alderney Museum).
The second photo shows the 'Vf' bunker at Stp. Doktorhaus under construction in late 1944 (C.I.O.S collection).
Regards,
Malcolm
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"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi Malcolm
That is interesting information on the 15 20P7 turrets , I wonder were the other 6 were placed in France ??
Regards Jos
That is interesting information on the 15 20P7 turrets , I wonder were the other 6 were placed in France ??
Regards Jos
- M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
I have wondered that to I dought that they would have time to emplace the turrets into bunkers due to D-Day. Peter H once mentioned that some 20P7 turrets were 'mounted' onto railway trucks and used for defence in western France, prehaps these were from Jersey.............?jopaerya wrote:Hi Malcolm
That is interesting information on the 15 20P7 turrets , I wonder were the other 6 were placed in France ??
Regards Jos
Regards,
Malcolm
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/
Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi Malcolm
This bunker could be a option for one of the 6 x 20P7 , date is 05-1944 .
Regards Jos
This bunker could be a option for one of the 6 x 20P7 , date is 05-1944 .
Regards Jos
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers
Hi Jos,jopaerya wrote:They are Zeichnung ( drawing ) numbers , they are not official numbers , but the number represents a bunker. For example the so called U/WakoFest are know as Zeichnung Waffen Prü. Fest. Nr. 44 .
This is my thought exactly. We are fixating on the numbers for tobruks right now so much (i.a. Ic 116) but we keep calling these U/WaKoFest. The only right designation for me right now for these Gruppenunterstanden is I 44 and for the Doppelgruppen I 51.
Regards,