Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

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Trevor Davenport
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#16

Post by Trevor Davenport » 11 Dec 2008, 19:31

Hi All,

We have three U/WakoFest personnel shelters on Alderney; all are of the same design. Attached is a plan,
Trevor D
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Dohlenfeste Personnel shelter.jpg
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M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#17

Post by M19 MADMAL » 11 Dec 2008, 22:12

AvB wrote:The one at Corbiere has been closed for a long time now?
Hi AvB,

It was entered by the CIOS in 1990/01 and to quote the piece about it in CIOS Review Nr.19
This bunker, sealed in 1951, was well flooded and stripped of most of its fittings. However, more electrical wiring, fuse boxes and telephone equipment was observed than is normal in a personnel shelter. It was also noted that all the floors were tiled, even the gas lock and entrance area. built adjacent is a Tobruk Stand but the two constructions are not linked internally.
David Letto 1991
Malcolm :wink:
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.

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jopaerya
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#18

Post by jopaerya » 08 Mar 2009, 12:27

Hello

Here a other drawing from the Waffen Prü. Fest. range a "Kampfstand mit 3-Schartenturm am steilen Vorderhang"
this bunker looks a lot like the one at Margival , typical is that this type of bunker was never build in the Atlantikwall .

Regards Jos
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grappener
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#19

Post by grappener » 08 Mar 2009, 13:56

Hi All,

Great thread and like M19 Madmal I quite like the U/WakoFest type shelters, they are quirky because they are unique to the Channel Islands and their name (locally) is pretty cool also.

With U/WakoFest Mike Ginns/Rudi Rolf translates this to "Unterstand/Waffen Kommision Festungen". Which makes perfect logical sense and I agree with this.

But in Rudi Rolfs book they are reffered to as "Entwicklungsbericht WaPru Fest", What is the actual translation for this and why different to the anacronym U\WaKoFest? surely it would then be called at E\WaPruFest?

Pretty certain I'm all confused here and would be very grateful if someone could sort me out :)

thanks for any help

Grappener :D

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M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#20

Post by M19 MADMAL » 08 Mar 2009, 14:53

Hi,

Another 'odd' feature is that the crew room of the U/WaKoFest bunkers in the Channel Islands is always larger in respect to the bunker compaired to the 600 types

Compare the size of the M.G Turret Bunker's crew room to the 633. Both were provided with 9 beds yet the 633's is about 30% smaller 8O

Malcolm :wink:
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From, German Fortifications in Guernsey by Ernie Gavey
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Last edited by M19 MADMAL on 13 Mar 2009, 19:14, edited 1 time in total.
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/

jopaerya
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#21

Post by jopaerya » 13 Mar 2009, 10:24

Hello All

It looks that every drawing of the Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers have a number , I don't
think that it's a Regelbaunumber but it would be easy to classifed these bunkers .

Regards Jos

P.S. I will make a list as soon as possible .

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M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#22

Post by M19 MADMAL » 13 Mar 2009, 19:21

jopaerya wrote:It looks that every drawing of the Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers have a number , I don't
think that it's a Regelbaunumber but it would be easy to classifed these bunkers.
Hi Jos,

Do you think that these Numbers should be excepted as a 'offical' recognition for identifying these types. :)

:idea: I'm thinking 'Jersey's German Bunkers' again :lol:

Malcolm :wink:
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/

jopaerya
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#23

Post by jopaerya » 13 Mar 2009, 22:33

Hello Malcolm

They are Zeichnung ( drawing ) numbers , they are not official numbers , but the number represents a bunker .
For example the so called U/WakoFest are know as Zeichnung Waffen Prü. Fest. Nr. 44 .

Regards Jos

jopaerya
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#24

Post by jopaerya » 10 Oct 2009, 11:44

Hello

I came across this bunker for a turret for M.G. and a tankturret , was this bunker ever build ??

Informaton = Festung Guernsey ( Thanks Neil )

Regards Jos
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AvB
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#25

Post by AvB » 10 Oct 2009, 14:15

Yes it is, in Stp Langenberg.

Image

It's closed but there. There are more small Vf designs for 20P7 (like the bunker at Wn Doktorhaus (Jersey)) on the islands. Too much 20P7s left probably! One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).

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M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#26

Post by M19 MADMAL » 10 Oct 2009, 16:13

AvB wrote:Too much 20P7s left probably! One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
Yes a total of 15 20P7 turrets were brought to Jersey in June 1943 and a Dutch floating 100 ton crane (called Anton) was used to unload them. With the run-down of the fortifications construction programme only 7 were mounted in standard 'St' constructions.
The decision was made to ship the other 8 back to France in May 1944 but, due to the events of D-Day 2 were trapped on Jersey so they were put to use and mounted on small non-standard bunkers (Stp. Doktorhaus & Wn. Fort Henry) using whatever materials could be sourced locally.

It looks like the same applied in Guernsey and Alderney with several turret being mounted on whatever could be used to construct a bunker for them.
AvB wrote:One loose 20P7 was even put on a U.WaKo at Wn Krossen (Guernsey).
Did you know that one was also placed between Batterie Dollmann and MP3 on Guernsey :wink:

The 1st photo below shows the 20P7 turret installed at Stp. Windmühlenburg. Alderney. The fact that the turret is so high above the ground and banked up with soil would indicate that it must only be placed on a small room/foundation (Alderney Museum).

The second photo shows the 'Vf' bunker at Stp. Doktorhaus under construction in late 1944 (C.I.O.S collection).

Regards,
Malcolm :wink:
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phplL2aJRAM.jpg
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"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/

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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#27

Post by jopaerya » 10 Oct 2009, 16:51

Hi Malcolm

That is interesting information on the 15 20P7 turrets , I wonder were the other 6 were placed in France ??

Regards Jos

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M19 MADMAL
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#28

Post by M19 MADMAL » 10 Oct 2009, 18:35

jopaerya wrote:Hi Malcolm

That is interesting information on the 15 20P7 turrets , I wonder were the other 6 were placed in France ??

Regards Jos
I have wondered that to :) I dought that they would have time to emplace the turrets into bunkers due to D-Day. Peter H once mentioned that some 20P7 turrets were 'mounted' onto railway trucks and used for defence in western France, prehaps these were from Jersey.............?

Regards,
Malcolm :wink:
"I had expected only ruins", "It's as if I had only left the bunker yesterday!"
Herr Engelbert Hoppe. M19 bunker Commander 1944/45 when he first returned in 2006.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/StrongpointCorbiereJersey/

jopaerya
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#29

Post by jopaerya » 11 Oct 2009, 19:37

Hi Malcolm

This bunker could be a option for one of the 6 x 20P7 , date is 05-1944 .

Regards Jos
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Nectar
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Re: Waffen Prü. Fest. bunkers

#30

Post by Nectar » 01 Jan 2013, 11:44

jopaerya wrote:They are Zeichnung ( drawing ) numbers , they are not official numbers , but the number represents a bunker. For example the so called U/WakoFest are know as Zeichnung Waffen Prü. Fest. Nr. 44 .
Hi Jos,

This is my thought exactly. We are fixating on the numbers for tobruks right now so much (i.a. Ic 116) but we keep calling these U/WaKoFest. The only right designation for me right now for these Gruppenunterstanden is I 44 and for the Doppelgruppen I 51.

Regards,

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