M262 question

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 18 Dec 2008 18:16

hi,
so it give a regelbau thread, so i post my question directly as following.
Image
here on M262 from longue sur mer.
know you to what service exist this hole on radius?
whas this here, to serve as camo, so example to hang up a fishing net with folliage to camouflage, or serve it for any other tricks?

because shell crater don't are, is too regular and so as i can identify is a bit square form (not round).
or whas this create after ww2?
from any museum?
thank's

User avatar
SES
Financial supporter
Posts: 3935
Joined: 26 Jan 2004 09:07
Location: 05 ON LT 8

Re: M262 question

Post by SES » 18 Dec 2008 19:12

Hi,
The holes in the concrete are there for camouflage purposes. A smooth surface reflects a lot of light, if it cane be made a bit more irregular there is less reflection. The holes were made during the casting of the bunker. Empty cement sacks were fixed to the shuttering boards and when they were removed - viola - there were the holes.
bregds
SES

marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

Re: M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 19 Dec 2008 02:18

many thank's ses!

User avatar
SES
Financial supporter
Posts: 3935
Joined: 26 Jan 2004 09:07
Location: 05 ON LT 8

Re: M262 question

Post by SES » 19 Dec 2008 07:46

:wink:
bregds
SES

marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

Re: M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 19 Dec 2008 21:46

new question on m262!

so now i have found this plan from M262 bunker type (but this plan should are M262 from Callantsoog (Nl) not longue sur mer) but should are plan of M262, so i think measurement on width, length and height are similar by bunker from longue sur mer.

Image

so here as basis measurement, this bunker have a length of 20,8 meter, but bunker of longue sur mer,
here a overall view!
Image
so bunker don't have the back area.

and i have interest to know the measurement from longues sur mer.
so i have start with follow:
i have compare picture size in cm with length distance ("13,8" cm= 20,8 meter)
after i have substract the part we i don't need to know, and so i have found with calculation method, that bunker M262 from longue sur mer, have a length of 16,38 meter.
also from front "roof" to end of length. (see blue color draft)

can this are correct?
or have i forgot any details?
because the M262 should are created into 720 m³ fero-concrete.
but here by substract this two part, here i should going under 720 m³ value or??

User avatar
TH
Member
Posts: 686
Joined: 08 Mar 2007 23:34
Location: Germany

Re: M262 question

Post by TH » 19 Dec 2008 22:45

Hi,
the distance from the front wall to the entrance is 17.00 meters for a standard M 262.
The amount of used conrete should be less than 720m³, as long as no additions were made elsewhere (thicker walls etc).

marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

Re: M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 20 Dec 2008 01:08

waouh danke für alles!

marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

Re: M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 20 Dec 2008 02:26

but now after i compare it more and more time with photo, i find difference on plan.

angular from front have a angular from 210° or behind has 75° so by looking on drawing, the angle of drawning can are correct, but nothing other.
i explain!
see my general photo, and compare with plan, so width =11,40 meter, but the roof with angle reach bassis architecture.
see my green colour draft. (so should looking the longue sur mer bunker).
Image

also the second green draft represent the concrete bassis structure on ground (is larger as roof from Beobachtungsraum or observation room)

two possibilitie, or m262 from Callantsoog (Nl) has smaller room as longues sur mer, or drawner author have only drawn interior view of observation room, so as thickness of concrete not are represented. (black color is not fully on drawning) comparaison with side view from model.

or with this plan
Image

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18503
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Re: M262 question

Post by jopaerya » 20 Dec 2008 10:25

Bonjour Marchal-de-France

I think that most of the fronts of the M 262 are different , please see Longues , Vasouy and Stella-Plage
on the drawing , the one I have seen from M.K.B. Westkappele looks like Lonques but has a emercency
exit . It's the same as Schartenstanden different weapons , different fields of fire

The M 262 at Westkappele was 16.55 by 10.90 and had also no entrance defence not like the other
one's in Holland . Also it's to note that in Holland also the H.K.B. used the M 262 in there batteries .

Regards Jos

P.S. also note the entrance of the M 262 without entrance defence has the entrance in the middle of
the back of the bunker and the M 262 with entrance defence on the left side of the back of the bunker .

marechal_de_france
Member
Posts: 15
Joined: 18 Dec 2008 17:54

Re: M262 question

Post by marechal_de_france » 21 Dec 2008 11:26

ok many thank's jos!

sorry that i don't answer before, because, i have make this model into 3d, but i have take measurement under photoshop with photo, and so i have found that width should have ~10 meter not more (don't have 11,8 width so as other m262), and length to end of square bassis structure from back(also to front observation post) this should have 9,10 meter + observation room length (hypothenuse length) "concrete step" = 5,78 meter and height was looking out from ground should are ~3,5 to 4 meter and thickness of highest observation room "roof" should are ~0,80 meter, and front roof of observation room( 2 meter) 1 meter radius.

sure is, that i can have make error with photo measurement method, but this i have found.

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18503
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Re: M262 question

Post by jopaerya » 24 Dec 2008 10:16

Hello

Maybe you contact Yannick Delefosse who made the 3 drawings of the M 262 you have posted ,
the first drawing of the M 262 with entrance defence in Holland is from J.van Tongeren .

Regards Jos

patrick fleuridas
Member
Posts: 403
Joined: 28 Jan 2004 19:46
Location: France

Re: M262 question

Post by patrick fleuridas » 01 Jan 2009 17:04

Hello

M 262 without rear entrance defense is called 262 a
Patrick

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18503
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Re: M262 question

Post by jopaerya » 02 Jan 2009 21:04

Hi Patrick

Do you or any one else know(s) any original information with the name M 262a ??

Regards Jos

patrick fleuridas
Member
Posts: 403
Joined: 28 Jan 2004 19:46
Location: France

Re: M262 question

Post by patrick fleuridas » 03 Jan 2009 21:19

Hello friend
Drawing from Bernard Paich. Based on original drawing ? I don't know.
Patrick
M 262a_BP_2.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

jopaerya
Member
Posts: 18503
Joined: 21 Jun 2004 13:21
Location: middelburg

Re: M262 question

Post by jopaerya » 06 Jan 2009 16:37

Hello All

I have checked the bauplans from Longues and Westkapelle both give only M 262
and no -a- , anyone have other original information on this M 262 ???

Regards Jos

Return to “Fortifications, Artillery, & Rockets”