Artillery Fire Control Equipment

[Carl Schwamberger]

Spent a hour reviewing this forum for anything pertinant. Made it half way back though 2008. In the back of my mind there is this feeling a complete discussion occured in 2003 or some such. If so hope I find it before it is deleted. Ah well back to the search. I know someone somewhere has photos of the German artillery range & direction calcualtion equipment, all laid out for me

[Carl Schwamberger]

Here are a few photos of a range finder, possiblly armored from a old thread here:

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=92099

Can anyone identify it?

& here are several photos of what were artillery observer vehicals.



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Re: Forward Observer vehicles? Again any confimation or correction is welcome.

viewtopic.php?f=47&t=139641&hilit=observation
viewtopic.php?f=47&t=98271&hilit=+observation
viewtopic.php?f=47&t=22615&hilit=+observation
viewtopic.php?f=47&t=15040&hilit=+observation


And here is the year old thread I was looking for. Lots of photographs & little explination.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic.php?f=70&t=29159

Anyone who can describe how any of the items were used please I beg you let us know.

[jopaerya]

Hello Carl

The photo in the first link is the socalled Seydlitz-turm , please see http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... ilit=zeiss

Regards Jos

[Carl Schwamberger]

Thought I'd move this thread back to the top, & see if anything fresh turned up. I hope to have time for some further data mining soon, so any link or leads are appreciated.

[Carl Schwamberger]

Turned up a couple nice photos & diagrams of the British style Plotting Board on this site:

http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/weapons-te ... ripod.html

Anyone have any similar illustrations for any other armys?

[Sturm78]

Hi Carl,

You can see http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 3&t=164950. The last image

Regards Sturm78

[Carl Schwamberger]

Thanks. I'd thought that part of a director system for a stationary fortress battery. It would be difficult to place in a temporary OP serving a field battery. From the poor photo angle it vaguely resembles some complex equipment for making mechanical or engineering drawings used back in the 1950s & 1960s.

[Clive Mortimore]

Thanks. I'd thought that part of a director system for a stationary fortress battery. It would be difficult to place in a temporary OP serving a field battery. From the poor photo angle it vaguely resembles some complex equipment for making mechanical or engineering drawings used back in the 1950s & 1960s.

Hi Carl

I would agree with you about the Singapore photo, it looks like a plotting room for a coastal battery. Most of the British effort at Singapore pointed out to sea, so when Japan attacked through the back door of Malaya most of the weapons were rendered useless.

The subject of artillery control equipment seems to be one of those dark areas of weapon history, I would love to learn more as without the many instruments, tables etc. most guns would have been a lump of metal. Something that always seems strange to me is the elaborate fire control systems for coastal artillery where the guns had been stationary for years compared to the hand held slide rules that field artillery officers would use and his guns may only have been inplace minutes before they were firing at their target.

[Carl Schwamberger]

Clive... I've been thinking over the same thing, the differences in the methods of the coastal artillery & field artillery. part may have been the mobility requirements of the FA, part must have been the seperation of the two groups. Seperate schools, seperate career track, seperate details in objective.... in the US FA of the 1930s there was also the focus on massing mutiple battery/battalion fires. A very different problem leading to different soulutions.

In terms of mathmatics the two may not have been so far apart. The target location problem is one of geometry and the solutions are problably the same mathmaticaly. Similarly the range to elevation/propellant charge question is nearly identical mathmatically. The differences were in the specific formula & equipment evolved to speed the target location, calculation, aim steps.

Getting back to the Singapore spotting equipment I wonder if both or all the OP were equipped the same, or if the secondary OP had less elaborate equipment? I am assuming here what we are seeing in the photo is the full equiped primary OP or 'plotting room'. Could be wrong of course. I wonder if any of the men wh operated the OP/plotting equipment are still alive to tell us?

[SES]

Just a few observations. In the naval scenario the target moves, a fast naval vessel with up to 15 m/sec. A naval battery was as a rule static so firing data could be transferred directly from the corrector to the guns. Naval engagements were mostly direct fire. The wind over the sea is often much stronger than over land.
bregds
SES

[Carl Schwamberger]

Just a few observations. In the naval scenario the target moves, a fast naval vessel with up to 15 m/sec. A naval battery was as a rule static so firing data could be transferred directly from the corrector to the guns. Naval engagements were mostly direct fire. The wind over the sea is often much stronger than over land.
bregds
SES

Are you a afficiando of naval or coastal artillery? I've been wondering about metorlogical corrections in either.

[SES]

It is definitely not my prime area of expertise. But I have been working especially this issue in connection with my general interest in bunkers. In Denmark an "artillery wind" was measured in three places, three times an day and transmitted to all batteries.
bregds
SES

[Carl Schwamberger]

Excellent. I assume that is from a Dane or German source? Or might it be in English?

The field artillery measured the 'wind' at medium & high altitudes using balloons. Do you know if it was the same for the batterys you refer to?

Tak

[SES]

Hi,
It is from both German and Allied sources and we have identified the "radio-sonde" launching locations and the associated "ballon-tracking" equipment.
bregds
SES

[Carl Schwamberger]

Ok. So they seem to have been using a fairly sophisticated technique. Radio would allow tracking the balloons at longer range & in clouds. Superior to optical tracking, except the bulky equipment would often be a problem for the field artillery. Any indication of what the radio frequencies would be, or any other techincal info?

I wonder if metorlogical corrections had any value for ships guns?