A "small" "discovery"

[Mark89]

Hello Mark

The 39P08 has 600 mm thickniss .

Regards Jos

Quite a bizarre number really. Thought the German defensework doctrine dictated a metal plate to have an equal strength to a slab of reinforced concrete 10 times as thick? But A1 (3.5 meters) was the most bad-ass they've got. How does this fit in? Or had it something to do with the 7 meters of concrete used in the construction of U-boat-bunkers?
But my original intended question was: has the 39P8 ever been manufactured and if so: has anyone got pictures of this beast?

[jopaerya]

Hello Mark

One was made by the firm Rheinmetal-Borsig , I have no picture's .

Regards Jos

[AvB]

One 39P8 was planned for a monstrous A-Werk called "Drei Herscher Berge" in the Oder-Warthe-Bogen Linie. In 1938 the building of this Werk was stopped and only a 'small' Panzerwerk (nr 783) was built. The tunnels underneath however have been built. The 39P8 manufactured by Rheinmetall was probably meant for this A-Werk.

[Mark89]

One 39P8 was planned for a monstrous A-Werk called "Drei Herscher Berge" in the Oder-Warthe-Bogen Linie. In 1938 the building of this Werk was stopped and only a 'small' Panzerwerk (nr 783) was built. The tunnels underneath however have been built. The 39P8 manufactured by Rheinmetall was probably meant for this A-Werk.

Just aching for some pictures now. Man, I love this hobby.

[P. Heijkoop]

Hi,
I seem to remember that the sides of the 428P01 are around 30 cm, but the roof IS
around 42cm thickness

[jbb20p7]

Hello,

Ho la la la la la la la ....... . very nice found ..... not 1, not 2 but 4 panzerturms !!!!!!

Thanks a lot JF for sharing . Is it in France ?
Bye
Jb

[TUS]

One 39P8 was planned for a monstrous A-Werk called "Drei Herscher Berge" in the Oder-Warthe-Bogen Linie. In 1938 the building of this Werk was stopped and only a 'small' Panzerwerk (nr 783) was built. The tunnels underneath however have been built. The 39P8 manufactured by Rheinmetall was probably meant for this A-Werk.

Hi Arthur and Mark

I seem to recall that a 39P8 was installed at the A-Werk at Hillersleben but I am far away from my archive at the moment, so I am not 100% sure.
Nice information regarding the A-Werk at Oder-Warthe-Bogen. Thanks for sharing. From where do you have this information?

Brdgs Toennes

[AvB]

From this nice site:
http://www.fortress.hg.pl/owb/mapa_central.htm

[Bo2]

Bonjour

How did you know about these turrets, any idea where they're from? It looks like they've never been built into bunkers.
Was the U-Boot bunker Bordeaux ever prepared for M19 turrets?

That made a long time that I know the presence of these turrets on the site but that made only 2 weeks that I had a high level contact which enabled me to return on site.
I know that an extension of the base was envisaged, there had it a turret ????
For the moment the accesses to the files (archives) are not possible, the place where they are is still strategic nowadays.
I am not sure that it was German who put them there.

JF

REMEMBER the second is always to take for those which want it, our Dutch friends (IJmuiden, Hoek) or Belgians (Raversijde) are not interested?

[mkappius]

Thanks, these four are nice.

The first 424P01 is very special.
All M19 turrets I know, are from Rheinmetall Borsig. On this first turret is a Logo from Rheinmetall Borsig and Hörder Verein.
Hörder Verein normaly cast the 20P7 and is the only factory (I know) who writes the Logo outside of the turret.
Also the lifting hooks of this 424P01 look like the lifting hooks of a 20P7.
This turret is number"2", so could it be a prototyp of Hörder Verein?

The secound 424P01 has a normal design. It is from BVG (Bochumer Verein für Gußstahlfabrikation).
"Bo2", was the Logo only on the inside or also on the outside?

The second turret has an interesting turret ring. There is the Logo of Rheinmetall Borsig. On the other side of the turret ring
is a Logo of a factory i don't know. It looks like "hh" or "Hn". The same Logo is on the pictures of the armoured caps on the
Berliner Flak Towers (page 7, pictures from "Heimatschuss"). Did someone know this Logo ?

Michael

[JKernwerk]

Like this one?

[mkappius]

Hello JKernwerk,

Yes, that is the Logo.
This is the "Sockelring" of a 424P01 ?

Thanks

Michael

[AvB]

The first 424P01 is very special.
All M19 turrets I know, are from Rheinmetall Borsig. On this first turret is a Logo from Rheinmetall Borsig and Hörder Verein.
Hörder Verein normaly cast the 20P7 and is the only factory (I know) who writes the Logo outside of the turret.
Also the lifting hooks of this 424P01 look like the lifting hooks of a 20P7.
This turret is number"2", so could it be a prototyp of Hörder Verein?

Most of the 424P01s I know are made by BVG. And HV did make the turrets for the leichte Turmhaubitze 73P9.
I also think only the third one is a 424P01 and the other 428P01. See the examples in Hatten, Mutzig and Terneuzen scrap (former Breskens 633). All the same lifting hooks.

The second turret has an interesting turret ring. There is the Logo of Rheinmetall Borsig. On the other side of the turret ring
is a Logo of a factory i don't know. It looks like "hh" or "Hn". The same Logo is on the pictures of the armoured caps on the
Berliner Flak Towers (page 7, pictures from "Heimatschuss"). Did someone know this Logo ?

Looking for this one too. Take a look at http://bunkersite.com/koepel-start.html
Maybe you have some additions? I'm still searching for the 9P7s in the Westwall.

[JKernwerk]

Hi Michael,
The sokkelringe (there are two 424P01 at the museum Abri d'Hatten -Magintline-) were found together with the two 424P01 at a Gießerei in the surrounding area (the owner told me the places but i forgot them).
The owner told me the turrets were not taken from the Gießerei after they were casted in 1938, i do not know why, maybe the quality was not good?
second of the turrets was casted in 1937 by BVG (gußnummer 76) and the sokkelring gußnummer is 138 (casted in 1938), i could not make pictures from the first one on the inside but the gußnummer is 176 and the gußnummer of the sokkelring is in the picture i posted.
So my last weekend was really good, we mostly visited works of the Maginotline but my highlight were the two 424P01 at Hatten.
There is also an other turret there but i do not think it is a German one, it looks more like a Belgium or French observation turret, it does not have any German marks, the cast says AR 6 and thereunder an A.
Greetings Jack.

[AvB]

Hi Michael,
The sokkelringe (there are two 424P01 at the museum Abri d'Hatten -Magintline-) were found together with the two 424P01 at a Gießerei in the surrounding area (the owner told me the places but i forgot them).

Hey Jack, so to be clear, there are two 424P01 at Hatten, but also one 424P01 at Fort Mutzig?