H.K.A.A. 769

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schwarzermai
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by schwarzermai » 09 Mar 2018 21:51

Hello Jos, i'm sorry - my mistake - 416 vs 418 - my confusion -
as i can see on your scan the 416er were temporary only at 2./823 - did the 418er going to Versuchsplatz Westende at the time?
Uwe
viewtopic.php?f=70&t=112552&start=195#p2028003

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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by jopaerya » 10 Mar 2018 09:06

Hi Uwe

Looks there are three different models, looks to me the 15.5 cm K.416 (f) had the last one ??
The Versuchsplatz Westende is a tank https://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic ... suchsplatz

a)
x)
x = taktisch zu E.A.A. 676

CNOCK
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by CNOCK » 10 Mar 2018 09:17

Hi,

one of the camouflaged 17 cm K18 of 2./769 at Berck Plage.
When 769 (K) was at Wenduine, did one of the 4 x 10,5 cm (t) batteries held a position at the later Wn Hinderburg (Oost-Evendijk)?

regards,

Cnock
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pierrot
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by pierrot » 10 Mar 2018 16:53

Hello Eddy,

Yes correct,

The HKB 769 with 3 batteries were in position in Belgium till November 1941 and then moved to France

HQ in Wenduine (later Stp Gneisenau)
1./769 in position in De Haan (Groenestraat) (position named Alt Fritz on a German map)
2./769 in position in Wenduine. Later in 1943, the 3 muni bunkers of this former HKB were re-used inside the WN Bauernhof (Inf. Stp)
3./769 in position in Zeebrugge Evendijk-West. Later in 1944 the bunkers (mainly Wellblech) of the former HKB, were re-used inside the new Stp Hindenburg where some new bunkers were added (668SK, VF,...)

Gr.

Pierrot
HKB 769.JPG
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schwarzermai
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by schwarzermai » 11 Mar 2018 12:24

jopaerya wrote:Hi Uwe

Looks there are three different models, looks to me the 15.5 cm K.416 (f) had the last one ??
The Versuchsplatz Westende is a tank https://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic ... suchsplatz

a)
x)
x = taktisch zu E.A.A. 676
Jos, you are right again - only taktisch zu E.A.A. 676

when were the guns of 2./823 changed? Because 823 were creted with 3 batteries of each 6 x 15,5 cm k. 418 (f)

Uwe
viewtopic.php?f=70&t=112552&start=195#p2028003

My Bookproject: "Organisationsgeschichte der deutschen Heeresartillerie im II. Weltkrieg"

http://balsi.de/Heeresartillerie/

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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by jopaerya » 12 Mar 2018 09:33

I have no idea Uwe , on this list from 10-05-1941 the 2,/823 has 15.5 cm G.P.F. = 418 (f)
but is missing the 1./823 . Only Pierre N. knows maybe more. ( NARA )
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pierrot
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by pierrot » 12 Mar 2018 10:34

Hello Jos and Uwe,

Hereunder, you will find the early evolution of the HKAA 2./823 on the Belgium coast through the Gliederung from the 37.AK and Arko 141 in 1941

Gliederung from 18/02/1941
18-02-1941.jpg
No presence yet of the HKAA 823


Gliederung from 07/03/1941
07-03-1941.jpg
The 2./823 is present with 6x 15.5 GPF 418 (f)


Gliederung from 04/06/1941
04-06-1941.jpg
We can see that the GPF symbol has been write off on the 2./823 of the Gliederung what means the change to 15.5cm Schneider 416 (f) just happened close to this date.

On all the Gliederung after this date, we find 6x 15.5cm 416 (f) till the end of the war.

We can conclude that the 15.5cm GPF from the HKAA 2./823 were in position in Belgium only from March to May 1941, so only for 2 or 3 months.

Gr.

Pierrot
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jopaerya
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by jopaerya » 12 Mar 2018 10:49

Top Pierre :thumbsup:

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schwarzermai
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by schwarzermai » 13 Mar 2018 08:06

Hello Jos and Pierre,

thank you!!

Uwe
viewtopic.php?f=70&t=112552&start=195#p2028003

My Bookproject: "Organisationsgeschichte der deutschen Heeresartillerie im II. Weltkrieg"

http://balsi.de/Heeresartillerie/

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schwarzermai
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by schwarzermai » 15 Mar 2018 19:28

Hello

i wonder because at Dec 19th 1943 - Org.Abt. order says about the guns at 823 all 15,5 cm K. 418 (f)

so maybe the change from 418 to 416 were an unauthorisized change?

or just an Org.Abt. typo?

Uwe

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viewtopic.php?f=70&t=112552&start=195#p2028003

My Bookproject: "Organisationsgeschichte der deutschen Heeresartillerie im II. Weltkrieg"

http://balsi.de/Heeresartillerie/

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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by jopaerya » 16 Mar 2018 08:54

Hello Uwe

All local German information and photo's indicates a 15.5 cm K.416(f) , strange is also that in
1944 the 2./1240 with 15.5 cm K.416(f) was rearmed with 6 x 8.35 M.22 (t) only this battery.

Regards Jos

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Von Kluck
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by Von Kluck » 10 Apr 2018 14:13

Hello,
The first Gliederung posted by Pierrot (18.02.1941) shows that the schw. Art. Abt. 620 and 680 both belonged to the Art. Rgt. Stab z.b.V. 781 at that time. Where had the batteries of these two Abteilungen been located? On the first locations of the batteries of HKAA 823 and 826 ?
Thanks
Von Kluck

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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by jopaerya » 11 Apr 2018 09:19

Hello von Kluck

You can't be sure on maps but it looks the old location of the H.K.B. but then with 15 cm K.16.( germandocsinrussia.org )

Regards Jos
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Von Kluck
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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by Von Kluck » 11 Apr 2018 12:05

Hello Jos,

Thanks for the reply.

1) Has anybody a Gliederung of ArKo 104 prior to 18/02/1941? I'm hoping to find when these Abteilungen arrived in Belgium for coastal duty.

2) According to what I've read on http://users.telenet.be/Atlantikwall-15 ... XIIIAK.htm the coastal artillery on belgian soil was previously commanded by ArKo 111 (prior to 20.12.1940?). Unfortunately I don't manage to find precise information about the Einsatz of the Abteilungen subordinated to it. Can anybody help me?

Thanks in advance
Von Kluck

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Re: H.K.A.A. 769

Post by pierrot » 11 Apr 2018 20:27

Hello Jos

This map is new for me and contains some new information that solve one of the oldest mysteries of the Atlantikwall on the Belgian coast:
Why can we find 6 guns emplacements in the Cabour Divisional battery (Stp Bochum, Adinkerke) although all the Gliederung show always only 4 guns in the batteries that have stand there?
The answer is given by your map, the position the battery of Cabour (use from 1942 to 1944 by 306.Inf.Div, 39.Inf.Div, 171.Res.Inf.Div, 48.Inf.Div) is in fact the previous position from 1940 of the 620. Art.Abt with 6x 15cm guns.

Another mystery solves!

Gr

Pierrot

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