2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

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jopaerya
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2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 06 Dec 2012 10:17

Helllo All

Does somebody knows beside the folding gunshield , what the difference is between the
2 cm-MG C 38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U and 2 cm-MG C 38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 ??

Regards Jos

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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 06 Dec 2012 17:01

Hello Jos,
The difference is in the height of the base-mounting, and this is 0,5m.
The mounts on land, trucks, armoured cars is with 500 mm lower then U type mounting.
In the early variant C/38 in the backward of the barrels was 1 chair for sighting and
quick moving of the guns direction, in variant C/43 was mounted 2 chairs.
Because of the space restrictions on U-boats platform, U variants had not lateral chairs.
For the surface ships this chairs was installed.
Army mounting : Picture # 1 and # 2. Center of vertical rotation height = 0,9 m.
U.bts mounting : Picture # 4, # 5, #6, # 7. Center of vertical rotation height = 1,4 m.
Ships mounting : Picture # 8. Center of vertical rotation height = 1,4 m.
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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 06 Dec 2012 17:03

Regards,
VladAlex.
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jopaerya
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 06 Dec 2012 18:06

Thanks VladAlex 8-)

jopaerya
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 08 Dec 2012 16:33

Hello

Looks that this one has a extra fixation on the base of the mount , picture from Ebay

Regards Jos
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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 08 Dec 2012 19:32

jopaerya wrote:Hello

Looks that this one has a extra fixation on the base of the mount , picture from Ebay

Regards Jos

extra fixation on the base ... Appears in picture # 4 of my post.
In your picture, is clear seen 2 crew chairs in the backward of the barrels.
... like in my post.
Regards,
VladAlex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 09 Dec 2012 11:25

Hello VladAlex

Looks that this 2 cm U boot vierling flak photo has the same thing as on the 3.7 cm Flak ??

Both picture's = Ebay
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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 11 Dec 2012 18:49

Hello Jos,
Interesing remarks about sighting system for 2cm Mauser Vierling build by Rheinmetall.
This systems ( sighting ) was developed all the wartime, permanently.
I know 4 different sighting systems used by Kriegsmarine and by Wehrmacht & Luftwaffe.
The most robust and rugged sighting system has been the simple, but also the most
imprecise, and was, generally, used on the submarines, due to very tough operating
conditions (entry to immersion, difficult conditions of environment, etc.)
He was used mostly at the guns with a single barrel, but also in 4-barrels systems
from the submarines.
I post a reliable sketch for you .
The second picture representis a sailor leading a metallic filter from a vent,
and photo "freeze" the sailor behind the 3.7 cm gun with filter in his hands.
Regards,
VladAlex.
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jopaerya
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 11 Dec 2012 19:22

Thank you very much VladAlex , very interesting . :wink:

Regards Jos

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Schorschl
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by Schorschl » 11 Dec 2012 20:06

Hello Jos, hello Alex,

the mounts of the AA-guns of the German navy had three axes (azimuth, elevation and an axis to cant the whole gun for a compensation of the decline caused by the motion of the sea). The grid (item F 21 in the photos) is an adjustment help. It must be achieved through the so called “Kantrichtwerk”, that the horizon appears parallel to the grid lines (item E 10 = adjustment wheel of the “Kantrichtwerk”).

The last picture shows the effect at a 3,7 cm S.K. C/30 in a twin mount.

Greetings,
Schorschl
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 11 Dec 2012 20:21

All clear now , thanks Schorschl 8O 8O 8O

Regards Jos

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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 12 Dec 2012 12:08

Thank you Schorschl,
Man how time lives, teach relentlessly.
Who don't do this remain ignorant.

By the way, at majority of german naval AA guns,
I do not see this interesting device.
Personally I have doubts, that on a restless ocean,
this device would be so effective, but from history,
this device can be found at the caliber of 8.8 cm SKC/30,
10.5 cm UTOF and 10.5 cm SKC/32 ?

Best Regards,
VladAlex

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Schorschl
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by Schorschl » 14 Dec 2012 15:11

Hello Alex,

actually all guns of the German navy had a dual function as a gun against sea targets and anti-aircraft weapons. However, they were developed first targeted on one of these tasks and in addition could the other more poorly than right with over. This hence the configurations of the mountings as biaxial (used mainly as gun against sea targets) or triaxial (used mainly as AA-weapons). Furthermore, fitting a sea target gun with third axis the mounting was just too heavy or the construction of the mounting would have been too costly.

The single-barreled and twin-barreled weapons of the 2 cm AA-guns (except for Flak 28 and Flak 29) were equipped with a third axis for cross-levelling, but without adjustment aid. The gunner had to leave the weapon to level up on his sense of balance.
The four-barreled mountings were used without cross-levelling axis. There is one exception as the “2 cm Flakvierling C/35” by Mauser. Here, the gunner at the cross-levelling axis used a traverse optical telescope (= Horizontierfernrohr) as adjustment aid.

The 3.7 cm guns used without central fire guidance (this includes in particular the weapons on submarines), had the mentioned grid as an adjustment aid. The exception here is the 3.7 cm S.K. C/30 in 3.7 cm Dopp.L.C/30 with central fire guidance as it was used on destroyers and bigger ships as cruisers, battleships or pocket battleships. In addition to the centrally determined angle of cross-levelling, the weapon had a gyro-stabilization and a traverse optical telescope as a back-up system.

The 8.8 cm and 10.5 cm AA-weapons were equipped with a central fire guidance and traverse optical telescopes as back-up system. The exception of this caliber class is a sea target gun for its role as AA-weapon, so was created a mounting with cross-levelling axis as the “10.5 cm S.K. C/32 n. Fl. in 10.5 cm Flak L.C/35”. The other guns of the mentioned calibers as the 10.5 cm S.K. C/32 or 8.8 cm S.K C/30 or C/35 were equipped with biaxial mountings.

Asking for apologies for the delayed reply
Schorschl
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vladalex
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by vladalex » 14 Dec 2012 17:37

Thank you very much Schorschl

Your last post was very well documented
and I consider, very usefull for all, and for me
in special.

Once again, thank you.
VladAlex.

jopaerya
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Re: 2 cm M.G. C/38 in Vierlingslafette C 38/43 U

Post by jopaerya » 23 Jun 2013 11:51

Here a other picture of this flak gun , picture is from Ebay .

Regards Jos
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