Forward slope
Forward slope
Hello All
We all know that the German "Festungspioniere" had a extensive archive of instructions and guidelines ,
but this change I have never found . My quistion who knows more examples of this way of building ??
You can see the original outerwall is only one meter instead of two meter and a extra outerwall
of two meter, here a example of a 501 , 607 and a 639 .
Drawings Dirk Peeters and Jacky Laurent
Regards Jos
We all know that the German "Festungspioniere" had a extensive archive of instructions and guidelines ,
but this change I have never found . My quistion who knows more examples of this way of building ??
You can see the original outerwall is only one meter instead of two meter and a extra outerwall
of two meter, here a example of a 501 , 607 and a 639 .
Drawings Dirk Peeters and Jacky Laurent
Regards Jos
- AvB
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Re: Forward slope
Well it's still safe right? From StpGr Scheveningen to StpGr Goeree you have these 501s with an extra corridor in front but inside they're 2 meters too.
Besides that I only know the 501s in the Lorient area you've posted.
Besides that I only know the 501s in the Lorient area you've posted.
Re: Forward slope
Hi Arthur,
The 501's at Stp.Gr. Scheveningen and Voorne and the Festung HvH were mostly placed on the thin dune lines and at the Battery's Scheveningen Nord and Vineta they were connected to the covered trenches.
A bit the same as the 607's (i think at Dieppe) these were also connected by a covered trench but not built in a slope.
The 639 was built in a ridge of a hill and the corridor went thru the ridge and made easy acces for the wounded in/on the carts or cars to get near the entrances of the 639.
But as Arthur stated, in Holland they are 2 metres on all sides.
Not really agree with Arthur though about the 1 metre less thick walls, I think someone was playing here with the concrete quantity but if this is oké for the ruggedness of the construction?
The outside walls are 2 metres?
If the enemy can exploid the 1 metre less concrete it is already in the bunker.
Must say i did not see the difference in thickness when we visited the 639.
Greetings JK.
The 501's at Stp.Gr. Scheveningen and Voorne and the Festung HvH were mostly placed on the thin dune lines and at the Battery's Scheveningen Nord and Vineta they were connected to the covered trenches.
A bit the same as the 607's (i think at Dieppe) these were also connected by a covered trench but not built in a slope.
The 639 was built in a ridge of a hill and the corridor went thru the ridge and made easy acces for the wounded in/on the carts or cars to get near the entrances of the 639.
But as Arthur stated, in Holland they are 2 metres on all sides.
Not really agree with Arthur though about the 1 metre less thick walls, I think someone was playing here with the concrete quantity but if this is oké for the ruggedness of the construction?
The outside walls are 2 metres?
If the enemy can exploid the 1 metre less concrete it is already in the bunker.
Must say i did not see the difference in thickness when we visited the 639.
Greetings JK.
- der bunkermann
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Re: Forward slope
i have a german document mentioning about the ''501 neu'' built at scheveningen nord.
i thinks that neu meand that is has a covered entrance...
i'll see if i can find it.
gr, Tim
i thinks that neu meand that is has a covered entrance...
i'll see if i can find it.
gr, Tim
Re: Forward slope
I seem to recall that a couple of the 607's at HKB Marka has the same covered entrance.
Brgds Tønnes
Brgds Tønnes
- der bunkermann
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Re: Forward slope
edit from earlyer post:
attached the document.
the 501 has now 2 entrances (november 1942)
one side of the hall was allways attached to the covert trenches, the other side was next to the battery road so they can move quickly to the fightingpositions.
the 501's at scheveningen nord have a less than 2 meter roof over the hall, probably 1 meter.
another 501 at widerstandnest 66 does have a 2 meter roof over the hall. same as the 502 in the WN.
attached the document.
the 501 has now 2 entrances (november 1942)
one side of the hall was allways attached to the covert trenches, the other side was next to the battery road so they can move quickly to the fightingpositions.
the 501's at scheveningen nord have a less than 2 meter roof over the hall, probably 1 meter.
another 501 at widerstandnest 66 does have a 2 meter roof over the hall. same as the 502 in the WN.
Re: Forward slope
Thanks for your photo's and replies
Regards Jos
Regards Jos
Re: Forward slope
Hello,
On "Ilot St Michel", in front of island, at Lorient, a 621 was built with extra wall
Bye
jB
On "Ilot St Michel", in front of island, at Lorient, a 621 was built with extra wall
Bye
jB
- dirk Peeters
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Re: Forward slope
For the island at Lorient
They must have changed the ventilation system in the 621 ...
I was there but didn t notice at that time
Dirk
They must have changed the ventilation system in the 621 ...
I was there but didn t notice at that time
Dirk
Re: Forward slope
Thanks J.B.
Great picture's of this bunker , I have mist your post
Regards Jos
Great picture's of this bunker , I have mist your post
Regards Jos
- dirk Peeters
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Re: Forward slope
JBB do you have more pics of the 621 ?
We missed that one completely?????????????
Thanks dirk
We missed that one completely?????????????
Thanks dirk
- der bunkermann
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Re: Forward slope
more evidence about the 501 neu...
a german map mentions the 501's at batterie Vineta (festung Hoek van Holland) as 501 NEU
these are 501's with 2 entrances
the roof over the hall is 2 meters thick
see attachments
a german map mentions the 501's at batterie Vineta (festung Hoek van Holland) as 501 NEU
these are 501's with 2 entrances
the roof over the hall is 2 meters thick
see attachments
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Re: Forward slope
Tim, do the ceilings of the 501's at Scheveningen indeed have a thickness of 1 meter? Then there is a important difference to Hoek van Holland, where they have 2 meters.
All of the 501's that were build in the dunes of Hoek van Holland have the outer wall. More inland they are constructed standard or with thicker outer walls of 3 meters. Indeed the reasons seems to be the very small dunes and danger of collapsing.
Like in Katwijk (with the HKB) the 607's from the H.K.B. Monster in Hoek van Holland were also constructed with extra outer walls making a extra corridor. The 2 outer bunkers have there corridors to the east (landside), but the 4 inner bunkers got there entrance towards the sea, making a extra corridor necessary along the side of the bunker to the east. Unfortunately the B.R.V. institute only measured the first outer 607, so there are no drawings of the bigger 607's. I filled in the wall on the drawing below.
All of the 501's that were build in the dunes of Hoek van Holland have the outer wall. More inland they are constructed standard or with thicker outer walls of 3 meters. Indeed the reasons seems to be the very small dunes and danger of collapsing.
Like in Katwijk (with the HKB) the 607's from the H.K.B. Monster in Hoek van Holland were also constructed with extra outer walls making a extra corridor. The 2 outer bunkers have there corridors to the east (landside), but the 4 inner bunkers got there entrance towards the sea, making a extra corridor necessary along the side of the bunker to the east. Unfortunately the B.R.V. institute only measured the first outer 607, so there are no drawings of the bigger 607's. I filled in the wall on the drawing below.
- dirk Peeters
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Re: Forward slope
We have at least 4 501 Neu in France
Dirk
Dirk
- dirk Peeters
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Re: Forward slope
the innerwall is of course 1 meter
an other one has a very small opening for the stairs Yhis one has no outer wall of two meters (to be exactly 1 m 98 hahaha)this is for Arthur who critisize all our drawnings (A joke )and one has no opening for the stairs at all in the roof
Here is that one These three versions are all in 7 KVA C2 StP Va 01
here are thus three plans of 501 Neu in France
But there are some more
but these plans are not finished
Dirk