5 cm KwK used in fortifications

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jopaerya
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by jopaerya » 07 Sep 2013 19:15

Yes Kurt

That could be the reason :idea:

Regards Jos

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M19 MADMAL
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by M19 MADMAL » 07 Sep 2013 22:22

Hi,

Below are 2 photos of a 5cm KwK 39 which is said to be a rare design which was not proceded with and only a few were produced (???).

3 such examples were to be found in the Channel Islands with 1 at Wn. La Motte A on Jersey on the emplacement also shown below and 2 on Guernsey which were both mounted in Type L414A (the only 2 on the Atlantikwall!) found at Wn Gabelsberg and Wn. Perleburg.

Jos has posted in the past that the mounting may be a French naval mount for the 7.5cm 97(f)

Regards,
Malcolm :milwink:
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Lars Bertelsen
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Lars Bertelsen » 08 Sep 2013 10:46

Hi Malcolm
Thanks for sharing these photos.
I guess that this is the first version of the Sockellafette for 5 cm KwK, designed in the summer of 1942 by reusing captured French pedestal mounts. Shortly later, it was decided to use the new Behelfssockellafette for this purpose.
Interesting to see that any of the ex-French mounts with 5 cm KwK were actually used.

greetings
lars

jopaerya
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by jopaerya » 08 Sep 2013 10:53

Here one at the ex Museum at Dieppe .

Regards Jos
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Manuferey
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Manuferey » 08 Sep 2013 15:13

I’m not convinced that the mountings are ex-French. For instance, the conical mounting of the « canon G de 75 mm Mle 1897 » was not as wide. Conical mountings were widely used before WW2 by many nations for small caliber coastal guns or even anti-aircraft guns as it is a simple but robust mounting design. It is possible that the Germans designed a specific conical mounting for the 5 cm KwK .

Separately, all the pictures above with the conical mounting show L/60 guns i.e. with the muzzle brake (removed in case of the gun at Dieppe but the threaded portion is still visible). Therefore, it is difficult to deduct that this mounting preceded the most widely know mounting and could not be a simplified mounting that appeared later or locally. It would be interesting to find a picture of a L/42 gun on a conical mounting.

Emmanuel

Clive Mortimore
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Clive Mortimore » 08 Sep 2013 18:37

Was the L/60 used as a naval weapon on board small craft? If so could that be the origin of this type of mounting?

Clive
Clive

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moonraker
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by moonraker » 08 Sep 2013 19:09

hi,
the similair 50 kwk yet in place,but destroy for the rust !!

Image

Image

jopaerya
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by jopaerya » 08 Sep 2013 19:15

Nice picture Etienne :thumbsup:

Regards Jos

Lars Bertelsen
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Lars Bertelsen » 09 Sep 2013 05:25

Hello
No it is right, it doesn’t really look like the old French pedestal mount. And If it is a former 7.5 cm gun mount, it is strange that the 5 cm gum is fitted with the muzzle brake. This shouldn’t be necessary.
It reminds of an old pedestal mount for a ship gun, and also a bit of the (probably never build) Sockellafette Ib. But the latter was fitted with a square base plate.
greetings
lars

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AvB
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by AvB » 09 Oct 2013 15:01

5cm KwK in the Atlantikwall? Source: ebay.
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AvB
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by AvB » 12 Oct 2013 19:40

Can anyone ID this as a 5cm KwK? Must be a 667?

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Eax-E
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Eax-E » 12 Oct 2013 20:12

Probably yes, there can't be a 2 m thick wall but rather a 1.5 m compared with the men.

jopaerya
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by jopaerya » 24 Mar 2014 19:58

A 5 cm KwK near Calais , photo is from Ebay .

Regards Jos
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Bunkerfreak
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by Bunkerfreak » 25 Mar 2014 20:05

For the open emplacements, does anyone know the name or number for the design? some days ago i saw a german document here on the forum with both the names "Tobrukstand" and "KwK-stand" written on it about the buildings that are built on that location.

Could the name "KwK-stand" be a somewhat official name for this bunkertype? some sources say VF600v, but i've never seen that before on any german document...

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dirk Peeters
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Re: INFO: 5 cm KwK used in fortifications

Post by dirk Peeters » 25 Mar 2014 22:50

some KwK sands are VF 9 but not all and Vf600v was something invented and it s not german at all
Dirk

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