static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
JKernwerk
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#16

Post by JKernwerk » 26 Jan 2020, 23:46

Could they have been Fest.St.Tr.?
JK

jopaerya
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#17

Post by jopaerya » 27 Jan 2020, 11:00

Here a PK photo , Regards Jos
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Manuferey
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#18

Post by Manuferey » 30 Jan 2020, 20:54

jpz4 wrote:
26 Jan 2020, 15:58
Manuferey wrote:
25 Jan 2020, 18:25
If reloading was planned, and if you only have infantry to do it, you would need rockets stored with their fuzes on nearby.
In the case of 7.Armee the launchers were supposed to have ammo for two salvos (Feuerschläge) on site, incl. those already installed on the launchers, one more load in the division ammo stores and two in Armee ammo stores. Ammo was however short and only about half those rounds were available, about 80% being the less effective flame rounds. Triepel however confirms that the launchers in his sector had ammo for two salvos.
After the invasion rockets were taken from other coastal sectors to provide ammo to units at the front.

In addition to Nebeltruppen, Pioniere also seem to have used rockets on a fairly regular base, but I've never really studied those. I assume this happened because Pioniere were used to operating more specialized equipment than regular infantry and not having infantry guns of their own.
Thanks Jpz4.
"Pioniere" (engineers) had indeed the proper training to install fuzes and ignition wires in rockets since it was not much different than doing it with mines and explosives.

Emmanuel

jopaerya
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#19

Post by jopaerya » 13 Mar 2020, 18:01

Found this in the KTB Gren.Reg 1018, Regards Jos
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Simon Trew 1
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#20

Post by Simon Trew 1 » 18 Apr 2020, 12:33

These intelligence sources describe the layouts of two positions of this kind, one behind Gold Beach, the other at Tailleville (Juno Beach):

‘28/32 cm Projector Site in Calvados’, in Martian Report (New Series) No.9, 8 August 1944. This is a description of a Nebelwerfer (rocket launcher) site that was located at Meuvaines, towards the western end of Gold Beach, on D-Day. The report is illustrated by a sketch of the layout of the position, and is in an intelligence summary that can be found in the UK National Archives, WO 219/1944.

‘Emplacement for 28/32 cm rocket’. This report (and an attached diagram) describes a Nebelwerfer (rocket launcher) site at Tailleville, a short distance inland from Juno Beach. It is in Part II to British Second Army’s Intelligence Summary No.45, issued 20 July 1944 (UK National Archives, WO 171/221).

Hope this is of interest.

Best,

Simon

jopaerya
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#21

Post by jopaerya » 18 Apr 2020, 13:45

Thanks Simon

Very useful , could you please place the lay-out here in this Forum ??

Regards Jos

Simon Trew 1
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#22

Post by Simon Trew 1 » 19 Apr 2020, 09:50

Hi Jos,

If I can master the technology, I will. Forgive me, I am the wrong generation to easily do all the clever stuff inserting photos or extracts of photos. Also, I have one of the documents as a photocopy (from about 2004) and it is not of good quality. The WO 219 SHAEF papers at Kew are poorly reproduced copies of the original paper copies, which are in NARA II (as I'm sure you know already). A photocopy of a poor original, photographed by me and then inserted into this forum, may not be especially legible. But if I can manage to do so, I will add it. Otherwise, I will PM you and can Wetransfer a photograph of the document to you. As for the WO 171/221 reference, I have that as a photo somewhere on my laptop. The photo was taken literally the last day Kew was open before the Covid-19 thing shut it down. Again, I will try to find it and put it on this thread if I can.

In the meantime, I've re-keyed the text of the WO 219/1944 document and reproduce it below. This omits the sketch diagram of the battery's layout, which is half-way through the document, but the text is still quite informative.

Annex II to Martian Report No.9 (New Series), dated 8 August 1944 (UK National Archives, WO 219/1944)

‘28/32 cm projector site in Calvados’

“A ground inspection of a Rocket Projector site located near COURSEULLES has furnished the following details of the position.

[N.B. I was confused by this reference initially, as it seemed to suggest this report was describing the position at Tailleville, which is covered in WO 171/221. But it is clear both from the reference to ‘Meuvain’ below, and also by the grid reference given in the 3rd paragraph – which I have checked – that the subject of this report is actually a site at Meuvaines, towards the western end of Gold Beach.]

This position was detected on air photographs late in May, but despite the complete lack of camouflage in the constructional stages, it was not recognised for what it was. It was in fact the first position of its kind seen in the WEST. A stereo pair is attached.

[N.B. I photocopied this document maybe sixteen years ago. I cannot recall if the air photograph referred to was or was not attached to the report.]

The battery was located near the village of MEUVAIN [sic] (G.S.G.S. 4250, 7E/5/8985) about 2000 yds from the coast. Direct observation on the beach which lay due NORTH of the position was unobtainable. It is thought, therefore, that a forward observation post was required. Since no trace of such an observation post could be found, it seems likely that observation was carried out from an infantry strongpoint on the coast, either by an F.O.O. or by the infantry themselves.

The site itself consisted of two rows of eight emplacement, each emplacement approximately eight feet square built to contain four projectors.

[Sketch diagram follows.]

The forward [seaward side] row was displaced slightly to one side, thus affording a clear field of fire forward to the rear row of projectors, and was completely occupied, having 32 projectors ready and wired for firing: the only item missing to complete the installation was the generator firing key. On the other hand the rear row of pits was unoccupied, and the equipment for these pits was stored in a camouflaged dump to one side of the installation. No facilities were available for the close-in storage of additional rockets, which might indicate that battery was meant to fire once only.

Ground photographs of a similar projector battery in the COTENTIN were issued with MARTIAN REPORT No.5, paragraph 7.”

[Sorry, I don’t have that one and because the Kew archive is closed at the moment, I can’t get it.]

Hope this helps, at least until I can get a photo posted here.

Best,

Simon

Simon Trew 1
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#23

Post by Simon Trew 1 » 19 Apr 2020, 10:11

And here is the material about the site at Tailleville:

Part II of British Second Army Intelligence Summary No.45, information up to 2359 hrs 19 July (issued 20 July) 1944 (UK National Archives, WO 171/221).

‘ENEMY EQUIPMENT.

[PARAGRAPH] 5. Emplacement for 28/32 cm Rocket.

At [GRID REF] 992826 near TAILLEVILLE is a site for 28/32 cm rockets.

Appendix “C” [not reproduced here] shows the layout of the emplacements and the type of pit dug. The rockets have been reported on previously in connection with the SCHWERES WURFERGERAT 40 and 41.

Each pit shown in the diagram contains a wooden frame (schweres Wurfergerat 40) holding four rockets which are fired from the frame in their travelling crates. Details of the rockets follow:

[Figures are weight of projectile // weight of shell // range respectively.]

28 cm HE: 183 lbs // 133.5 lbs // 2440 yds
32 cm incendiary: 174 lbs // 124.5 lbs // 2430 yds

Owing to the type of mounting and the size of ammunition this equipment, especially as dug in as shown in the diagram, is unlikely to be found in anything but a static defence line.”

Again, hope this helps. By the way, I tried copying the photo I took of Appendix C into this post but can't master the technology. Please forgive my stupidity. I will PM you.

Best,

Simon

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Manuferey
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#24

Post by Manuferey » 19 Apr 2020, 11:31

Simon Trew 1 wrote:
19 Apr 2020, 09:50
Ground photographs of a similar projector battery in the COTENTIN were issued with MARTIAN REPORT No.5, paragraph 7.”
[Sorry, I don’t have that one and because the Kew archive is closed at the moment, I can’t get it.]
Hope this helps, at least until I can get a photo posted here.
Best,
Simon
Hi Simon,

The location of this projector battery in the Cotentin would be of particular interest to me as well as the photographs. :D I suspect it is the static rocket battery near Utah Beach (described in a US report at Wn8, different from the SWR 101. battery at Brucheville). There was also a static rocket battery near Morsalines in early June 1944 but the Germans removed the rockets afterwards to feed the launchers of the remaining SWR 101. units. Therefore, there was probably not much left at that location afterwards.

Emmanuel

JKernwerk
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Re: static 28/32 Wurfkörper = Artillery or Infantry

#25

Post by JKernwerk » 19 Apr 2020, 12:41

At Omaha there was a similar battery but nothing is visible today.
JK

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