88mm(r) ?

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stril
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88mm(r) ?

Post by stril » 17 Oct 2003 15:41

I wonder if this gun is a rebuildt russian 85mm, rebored up to 88mm ?
Note the shape of muzzle.

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Xavier
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h

Post by Xavier » 17 Oct 2003 15:55

hello
Yes, by the breech looks like a russian, but the Muzzle looks more like a Muzzle cover than a Muzzle brake.

can you post the complete picture or provide a link?

regards

Xavier
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Aufklarung
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Post by Aufklarung » 17 Oct 2003 15:59

stril

Do you have more of the pic you could show us?

Could be a muzzle cover.

The carriage, recuperator, etc would be helpful in a more positive ID.

regards
A :)

Ooops, didn't see Xaviers post. He knows AAA better than I.

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Erik E
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Post by Erik E » 17 Oct 2003 17:48

I agree to...
It looks very similar to the Russian gun, with muzzle cover.

Here is a breech block from a 8,8cm Flak39(r)
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stril
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.

Post by stril » 17 Oct 2003 19:02

Hello, thanks for answering.
Here it is more of the picture.
Last edited by stril on 02 May 2005 20:15, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Mark V » 17 Oct 2003 19:35

Hi,

http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=17198

Look at the pics Robert has posted - in the end of page. It is an muzzle brake - sort of pepperbox-style. Not an uncommon sight in Soviet guns.

Mark V

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Xavier
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Post by Xavier » 17 Oct 2003 19:42

MarK

Indeed, you are correct , also it makes more sense, since the gun seems already in use,

Regarding the original post, I doubt the germans would have re-bored the gun, stocks of original 85 ammo must have been plentiful on the eastern front, at least until mid-war.


regards

Xavier
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Post by Mark V » 17 Oct 2003 20:39

It may be in original calibre, or re-bored. Germans did convert those 85s to 88 when they ran out of ammo....

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stril
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Post by stril » 19 Oct 2003 17:56

Hello
Thanks for answering.
I was kind of wondering if it was a rebored russian 85mm,
as i was told they had some kind of device on the muzzle.
Your answers did provide the info i needed.If i got it right, i understand that the other captured russian AA gun(7,62mm?) did not get this as the german changed the barrels(88mm) taking them from own stock ?
Regards
stril

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Jay Felsberg
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boring out barrels

Post by Jay Felsberg » 20 Oct 2003 06:37

Accroding the Arco WWII Fact file series, the Germans also bored out a few 7.62cm Flak M.31(r) and 7.62cm Flak M.38(r) to 8.8cm when they ran out of ammunition. These were weapons which were taken back to Germany for use by auxilliary and Hitler Jugend units.

One has to wonder how much boring out that much weakend the barrel...or were Hitler Jugend units that expendable? (my bad, sorry) :roll:

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stril
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Post by stril » 20 Oct 2003 10:09

In his book DeutcheFlug-Abwehr im 20.Jahrhundert O.Renz mention that the russian 7,62cm M31 was scrapped, but they used the 7,62cm M38.
In a norwegian book, "Tyske Kysfort i Norge"(German Coastal Fortress in Norway) ISBN 82-990878-1-3 Fjørtoft mention the 7,62cm and the 8,5 cm.
He mention the 8,5cm was rebored and got a device reducing the flameburst.(mundingsdemper ?), that isnt a muzzlebrake is it ?
The 7,62cm he wrote got 88mm barrels from german 88mm FLAK 18 and got a device reducing the recoil, is that whats refered as a muzzlebreak ?
As i my english isnt that good and my knowledge of technical terms is even worse i might be far out in the woods in this matter.
What do i have to look for when trying to seperate the 88mm(r) made from 7,62cm and 8,5cm. ?
As for the matter of the barrel being weakend i have no knowledge.
Regards
Stril

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Post by Mark V » 20 Oct 2003 15:31

Re-bored Russian AA-guns were heavily tested on aerial defence of Helsinki in winter-44. I think they were formerly 85mm, but i am not sure.

They were usable as weapons, but couldn't cope as much continued firing as "real" 88s (which were also in use at same Flak-regiment), before they started to develope malfunctions.

Same weapons served as training weapons for coastal-forces for decades after war, so they couldn't be all that bad.

Regards, Mark V

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