Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Discussions on the small arms used by the Axis forces.
G, Y?
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by G, Y? » 16 Mar 2022 03:51

You're correct Roland and both the Soviets and the Germans were aware of it. For the Soviets, normal ammunition considerably shortened the useable lifespan of the washers that trapped most gases. Also, they wanted quiet kills for sentry or target removals and a sonic crack defeats that.

The Allies use of suppressors was mostly for assassinations. Not that suppressed SMGs weren't issued to some soldiers. I knew one fellow who carried one briefly until he found that it wasn't quiet (somebody ruined it).

ROLAND1369
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by ROLAND1369 » 16 Mar 2022 17:53

Most people, accustomed to Hollywood movie silencers/supressors, would be amazez at the noise the bolt makes when cycling on an automatic weapon. On the supressed version of the M3a1 US SMG "Grease gun" we found it necessary to insert a piece of felt on the chamber face to silence the noise of the collision between the bolt and it. The noise was almost as loud as the firing face. In the case of a silenced 22 cal Ruger automatic pistol the noise of the bolt is like a person chopping wood. A benifit of the Silenced M3a1 SMG is that a normal 45 caliber round is subsonic and you need no special ammunition. Of course the changing off the sound from a gunshot to a sound of chopping wood can be a tactical advantage. As to the other weapons with supersonic ammunition it is more complicated than just switching to a subsonic round. It is usually necessary to replace the recoil spring and frequently the bolt as well. Some weapons such as the British Sterling SMG avoid this by having enough holes drilled in the barrel within the silencer to lower the muzzle velocity to a subsonic level prior to leaving the barrel. As an aside we found that if fired on full automatic the silencer on the Mark 2S STEN gun was only good for about 100 rounds prior to being burned out. Of course modern suppressors are constructed differently and last longer. Just my ramblings of experiences.

G, Y?
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by G, Y? » 16 Mar 2022 22:55

Thank you Roland1369 for sharing your experience.

G, Y?
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by G, Y? » 12 Apr 2022 01:47

Roland1369 - you're right, but if you use supersonic cartridges you burn out those rubber washers much faster. The Soviet instructed their partisans to pull the bullet and remove 1/2 the powder. BTW, finally came across an account that mentioned suppressors by guerillas. They used them to remove sentries on RR they wanted to destroy.

G, Y?
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by G, Y? » 21 Jun 2022 19:27

While what you state is generally true, considering the construction of the BraMit, I suspect that the higher gas pressure from normal ammunition could blow out the two rubber gaskets on the BraMit. That would require the gaskets to be replaced more frequently.

LineDoggie
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by LineDoggie » 21 Jun 2022 19:38

G, Y? wrote:
12 Apr 2022 01:47
Roland1369 - you're right, but if you use supersonic cartridges you burn out those rubber washers much faster. The Soviet instructed their partisans to pull the bullet and remove 1/2 the powder. BTW, finally came across an account that mentioned suppressors by guerillas. They used them to remove sentries on RR they wanted to destroy.
The Maxim sound suppressor didn't use wipes but used vanes to disrupt the flow of gases

https://www.forgottenweapons.com/wp-con ... 916885.pdf
"There are two kinds of people who are staying on this beach: those who are dead and those who are going to die. Now let’s get the hell out of here".
Col. George Taylor, 16th Infantry Regiment, Omaha Beach

G, Y?
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Re: Use of Captured Soviet Rifles (with Silencers) by Snipers

Post by G, Y? » 26 Jun 2022 00:03

I know. Rubber can be blown out easier though and those gaskets had to be replaced everynow and then - just much faster with supersonic ammo. They came with extra gaskets and the advent of superior American material for gaskets increased the useful life of each gasket.

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