(Grease Gun)

Discussions on the small arms used by the Axis forces.
yantaylor
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(Grease Gun)

Post by yantaylor » 05 Sep 2021 20:13

Hi everyone.

Did the M3 Sub-Machine Gun ever replace the Thompson in WW2?, as rifle companies go, the squads were equipped with M1 Rifles and BARs, any SMGs seemed to be kept at company HQ and issued for patrol leaders.
Did the M3 mainly get issued to truck drivers, despatch riders and tank crews?
Did the first M3s reach the front before 1944?

Thanks for any help
Ian

wwilson
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by wwilson » 06 Sep 2021 06:41

Hi Ian,

If you check out the last batch of posts in this thread viewtopic.php?f=113&t=160421 , I think it will answer most if not all of your questions.

Did not replace the Thompson (well, it did, but postwar) but supplemented it.

Cheers

yantaylor
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by yantaylor » 06 Sep 2021 20:47

Thanks WW, good link.
I have noticed that YAN guy before on the site, he is pretty smart :lol:

Ian

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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 09 Sep 2021 14:10

Our German collector friend had the M3 in his personal possession, in the 1970s this was still possible, but not anymore.

We considered the gun very inferior, no one dared to shoot it.
In a comparison to the German submachine guns of the time, a very carelessly made weapon, especially in this powerful caliber.

Shooting the M3A1 Grease Gun



Hans
Es ist im Leben wichtig, viel zu wissen.
Manchmal ist es noch wichtiger, zu wissen, daß man nichts weiß.

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Poot
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Poot » 09 Sep 2021 16:17

I actually prefer shooting the M3 to the Thompson. The M3 proved more reliable for us and had a rate of fire that allowed the shooter to stay on target with ease.

I'm not sure if the issue with the Thompsons were the issued magazines or the gun itself, but it wasn't the first time I saw one experience stove-piping.
He who lives by the sword, should train with it frequently.

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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 09 Sep 2021 17:12

The American MP M3, and the various Beretta MPs were not shot, for good reasons.
Inferior stuff, who equipped his soldiers with this garbage, sent his men straight to hell.

Hans
Es ist im Leben wichtig, viel zu wissen.
Manchmal ist es noch wichtiger, zu wissen, daß man nichts weiß.

ROLAND1369
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by ROLAND1369 » 10 Sep 2021 15:25

Hans unlike you who judge the M 3 SMG with out any experience, it I carried and used it in Viet Nam and later and found it to be a reliable and rugged weapon. I never had a malfunction and have fired and observed its firing on numerous ranges and have never seen or read of any major firing failure. I found a single shot could easily be tapped off and it was accurate out to 100 yards. As with all weapons of this class 90 percent of failure to fire was the result of magazine failures easily cured by double springing the magazines. This and normal cleaning as well as cleaning your magazines each time you clean the weapon made it one of the most reliable weapons in this class, much more reliable than the vaunted well made Thompson SMG in a hostile environment.

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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 11 Sep 2021 10:13

Roland, you are of course right, my personal judgment was hasty, I apologize for that.

Of course, I have nothing to say against the personal statements of American veterans. :oops:


Hans

P.S. Interesting in this context, that the M3 was not even adopted into the arsenal of the German Bundeswehr in the 1950s/1960s.

List of hand weapons of the German Armed Forces https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_der ... Bundeswehr
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Manchmal ist es noch wichtiger, zu wissen, daß man nichts weiß.

ROLAND1369
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by ROLAND1369 » 11 Sep 2021 15:34

As I recall neither was the MP 40.

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ROLAND1369

Post by ROLAND1369 » 11 Sep 2021 15:37

Despite not being produced since the Korean war, the M3 remained in service in its original purpose as an armored crew weapon as late as the mid 90s. Quite a record for a Junk weapon.

ROLAND1369
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by ROLAND1369 » 11 Sep 2021 15:43

Incidently we found several fully functional M 3s in Afghanistan as late as 2003. They were only limited by a lack of 45 cal ammunition.

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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 11 Sep 2021 16:20

Roland,

German small arms were extensively supplied by the former GDR to other communist states, in very large numbers.
A very dark chapter of German post-war history, but unfortunately a fact.

The attached photo tells the whole story...
The red-coated Nazis in the GDR sold everything, for valuta, without any inhibitions, very bad, there are hundreds comparable photos with German weapons, in the hands of the PAVN.


Hans

P.S. As far as I know, variations of the Sturmgewehr 44 were produced exclusively for African nations in the postwar years.
Please correct me, if I am wrong about this.
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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 11 Sep 2021 16:59

As I recall neither was the MP 40.

That's right, we were trained on the UZI back then, a small and mean MP, that never failed, never.

Uzi


Good!, the very best MP I ever had to shoot with.


Hans
Es ist im Leben wichtig, viel zu wissen.
Manchmal ist es noch wichtiger, zu wissen, daß man nichts weiß.

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Hans1906
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by Hans1906 » 11 Sep 2021 17:22

Of course, fully automatic weapons of war do not belong in anyone's hands.
But there is no question, that handling is important, in whatever unimaginable situation...

If you don't have a clue about this subject, you'll blow your own or your loved ones' asses off one day, most likely. :wink:

At my age, I don't trust myself to do that anymore, too old, too thinned out.
There is not a single firearm left in my house.
Here in germany, all this is still not necessary. :wink:

* The American ladyfriend with a modern Glock pistol in the house, is a horror for me, that is not good.


Hans
Es ist im Leben wichtig, viel zu wissen.
Manchmal ist es noch wichtiger, zu wissen, daß man nichts weiß.

paulrward
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Re: (Grease Gun)

Post by paulrward » 12 Sep 2021 05:03

Hello All :

Mr. Hans1906 stated :
Of course, fully automatic weapons of war do not belong in anyone's hands.
But there is no question, that handling is important, in whatever unimaginable situation...

If you don't have a clue about this subject, you'll blow your own or your loved ones' asses
off one day, most likely. :wink:

At my age, I don't trust myself to do that anymore, too old, too thinned out.
There is not a single firearm left in my house.
Here in germany, all this is still not necessary. :wink:

* The American ladyfriend with a modern Glock pistol in the house, is a horror for me,
that is not good.

" Fully automatic weapons of war " belong ONLY in the hands of free people who use them to defend
themselves against tyranny, both foreign and domestic. They NEVER belong in the hands of people who
are nothing more than slaves, living in a Tyrannical Police State.

" If you don't have a clue about this subject, you'll blow .......... . :wink: " The answer to this is
self discipline and training. He who lives by the sword, should train with that sword regularly.....

" At my age, I don't trust myself.... " If you cannot trust yourself, no one should trust you.......

"The American ladyfriend with a modern Glock pistol in the house, is a horror for me " If, in 1933,
a well armed, courageous, and disciplined German people had been armed with weapons like modern
Glocks, and had risen up against the rising tide of Hitler's Madness, would this Forum even exist ?


Respectfully :

Paul R. Ward

P.S. - Today I sold a Model 1863 musket and a .22 caliber revolver, and used the proceeds to purchase
( and take delivery of ) a more powerful revolver.

" The Right to Own Weapons, is the Right to Be Free ! " A. E. VanVogt

" A Well Armed Society is a Polite Society..." Robert A. Heinlein

" From My Cold, Dead Hands ! " Charleton Heston
Information not shared, is information lost
Voices that are banned, are voices who cannot share information....
Discussions that are silenced, are discussions that will occur elsewhere !

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