Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

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Urmel
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Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Urmel » 07 Jan 2017 21:18

Does anyone know when these were first used in battle?
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

nmao
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by nmao » 08 Jan 2017 01:08

Hi.

According to the post on Comando Supremo forum http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... erformance
diario storico del comando divisione dell'Ariete, che alla data del 12 novembre recita:
"Vengono assegnati n.200 proiettili da 75/27 ad effetto E.P."
this post may also be useful
http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... eto-pronto

regards,

-Nuno

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Urmel
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Urmel » 08 Jan 2017 09:10

Thanks Nuno, great help!
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

nmao
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by nmao » 09 Jan 2017 11:41

Hi.
Please check further details here:
http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... -speciale/

and pages 82&83 of
http://ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USA/ref/TM/ ... -Italy.pdf

regards,

-Nuno

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Urmel
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Urmel » 09 Jan 2017 18:32

Thanks again!
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

Dili
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Dili » 09 Jan 2017 19:57

Those 200 rounds probably have come with the first Semoventi 75/18 in Africa.

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Urmel
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Urmel » 09 Jan 2017 22:11

No Semoventi until January 1942, so no. :)

Also there is mention of the 100mm E.P. being tested at Saunnu in March.
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Dili » 10 Jan 2017 12:55

Thanks.

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Urmel
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Urmel » 26 Feb 2017 21:17

The power of the 75 and 100mm guns against armour was multiplied by the use of shaped charge projectiles
Experience shooting P.E. projectiles [these are Effetto Pronto (E.P. - HESH type rounds)] of 75mm and 100mm calibre as well as using the Solothurn at Saunnu (North Africa) against the side of a Mark VI tank at a range of 500m. Results were that a single shot from the 75mm removed a half meter square section of the 30mm armour of the vehicle shot at.
A 75mm shell hitting the 2 joint of two plates 30mm and 20mm thick respectively on the front of the hull opened the metal and curled back the metal tearing the upper inclined plate making a hole 30 x 50cm.
A 100mm shell hitting the front of the turret made from 2 x 20mm plates (40mm total) tore the face off the turret
A second shot at the turret tore it off leaving it on the ground
Conclusion of tests was that P.E. shells were more effective than normal shells
- Source for that test is 'Materiali in allestimento presso il 12 Autogruppamento' - NARA T821 roll 250
http://forum.worldoftanks.com/index.php ... 60#topmost
In March 1942, in the Saunnu (Cyrenaica) area, the 12th
Autoraggruppamento (the Italian "experimental" unit in North Africa)
put the EP rounds for the WWI vintage 75/27 field gun and 100/17
howitzer to the test. Two 75mm and two 100mm EP rounds were shot at a
captured Crusader MkVI tank at a distance of 550 yards. The 75mm
rounds easily smashed and penetrated the side and frontal armor
plates, with plate shrivelling (presumably due to the "boiling jet"
effect). The 100mm rounds disintegrated the frontal armor and popped
the turret out of the tank.

The overall effect of the rounds was described as being decidedly
superior to that of the regular AP shots for those calibers.
Considering the obsolescence of the 75/27 and the 100/17 guns, it was
a remarkable upgrade. Such EP rounds should be quite effective even
against Grants and Shermans. Of course there were too few EP rounds
available.
http://www.comandosupremo.com/forums/to ... to-pronto/

Does anyone have that roll?
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

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David W
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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by David W » 15 Apr 2018 12:41

In what sort of quantities were the E.P rounds available in North Africa?

Does anyone know of any figures to back up the statement "decidedly superior" in relation to the 100mm round?

Also did they do an E.P round for the 65mm & 77mm guns in Italian service?

Thanks in advance,
David.

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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by Dili » 16 Apr 2018 01:51

I am not surprised it is decidedly superior, even more in 100 Obice than the 75 gun either were low velocity weapons more so the 100. So kinetic energy rounds would never make much damage except by explosive power.

There weren't EP for 77mm afaik. I have not found any information on 65 EP but should be an improvement probably putting it better than the 47 AP but i suspect it wasn't widely distributed.

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Re: Issue of Effetto Pronto rounds in North Africa

Post by David W » 16 Apr 2018 06:44

Thanks.

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