viewtopic.php?f=66&t=224592
Guaporense wrote: millions of German soldiers started surrendering (the Western Allies took 7.7 million German prisoners in the Western front.............
Guaporense wrote: millions of German soldiers started surrendering (the Western Allies took 7.7 million German prisoners in the Western front.............
"Effective combat casualties"...Michael Kenny wrote:Note that there are no charts for MIA/POW. The millions of Germans in Allied POW camps simply don't exist in this fantasy world. However in his alternate fantasy world he uses the POW figures to promote another fiction that the reason Germany lost WW2 was because they simply decided to give up and ran into Allied POW camps to avoid the Soviets.
viewtopic.php?f=66&t=224592
Guaporense wrote: millions of German soldiers started surrendering (the Western Allies took 7.7 million German prisoners in the Western front.............
Hi, Ljadw, only the half of Sixth Army was encircled ? but many books mention it lost all twenty divisions.ljadw wrote:1) Torch happened before Uranus,thus there was no reason to not send forces to NA
2 ) On 1 april 1943 the strength of the German forces in NA (army only ) including the PAA AND the 5th Panzer Armee was 130000,of which 25000 returned ,thus Hitler did not send 150000 + men to Tunesia
3 Only half of 6 th Army was encircled at Stalingrad (figures from the now defunct WW2 stats com site)
4 ) At second Alamein,Rommel had 103000 men (half of which were Italians) of which 70 % were saved .
It is about this page:Kelvin wrote: Hi, Ljadw, only the half of Sixth Army was encircled ? but many books mention it lost all twenty divisions.
Hi, Art, in accordance with Beever book Stalingard, Sixth Army had 290,000 men, 236,000 of which were German soldiers, another 55,000 were Hiwi and about 10000 Romanian or some Croats in 100. Jager division. About 25,000 were evacuated by air. Given Soviet numercial superiority, I do believe German LOC were perfectly sealed except by air.Art wrote:It is about this page:Kelvin wrote: Hi, Ljadw, only the half of Sixth Army was encircled ? but many books mention it lost all twenty divisions.
https://web.archive.org/web/20160411190 ... _abwa.html
I would take it rather skeptically, for example the number of personnel evacuated from the pocket from alternative sources was almost twice as high (about 30 000). According to our former member Qvist in December 1942 the actual strength of 6 Army's elements outside the pocket was 55 000 men, out of original 300 000. This info also fits the known data about the ration strength of the encircled force.
It's a known misinterpretation of original documents:Kelvin wrote: Hi, Art, in accordance with Beever book Stalingard, Sixth Army had 290,000 men, 236,000 of which were German soldiers, another 55,000 were Hiwi
nickdfresh wrote - If you disagree with Tooze's main thesis, then why do you cite him? Is it because you're a disingenuous liar seeking to validate his own beliefs rather than actually present or inform himself about historical truths?
usually name calling reflects badly on a person .... Your Historical truths are what you should lead with not trite small minded insultsIf you're going to cite speeches, cite the date and the source text, stop acting like a pedantic middle school child and this
I think that small minded people feel insulted when one questions their beliefs about any subject.doogal wrote:usually name calling reflects badly on a person .... Your Historical truths are what you should lead with not trite small minded insults