Himmler's mistress

Discussions on the role played by and situation of women in the Third Reich not covered in the other sections. Hosted by Vikki.
User avatar
Helge
Member
Posts: 1500
Joined: 12 Jun 2010 07:09
Location: Finland

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Helge » 21 Dec 2011 08:46

Yes Max, but often not wrong. Important is that we Axis History does not make mistakes or, worse, we appropriate photos, articles, research, without citing the source, but this does not happen to us I am happy if others copy Axis History: here we have scholars, researchers, important authors. What do we want more? Here is an example of a complete copy of which is about this post
http://deuxiemeguerremondia.forumactif. ... gmentaires

Helge
Sota ei päätä kuka on oikeassa, vain sen että kuka on jäljellä.
War does not decide who is right but only those who are left.

Max Williams
Member
Posts: 10166
Joined: 04 Feb 2003 16:57
Location: London

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Max Williams » 21 Dec 2011 11:57

I agree it is important to be correct, but this man doesn't even have the courtesy to ask. If he found the information on the internet, then others can, and do. Instead of just posting images in "his" gallery as if they are his, he could at least have the courtesy to quote the source. I have been sent the photos of Potthast by someone and if I ever reproduce them, I will quote the source. Why can't he?
Max.

User avatar
Eddy Marz
Member
Posts: 559
Joined: 12 Mar 2007 11:32
Location: France

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Eddy Marz » 21 Dec 2011 15:25

No-one has tried to pretend (or even has the slightest interest in doing so) that pictures were "his" - but just to illustrate for this french forum an article about Potthast. No-one in that forum thinks that the pictures are the author's property; they are just used as illustration. France is very poor on nazi documentation and the article was only for informative reasons. Nowhere is there any will to sell, publish, or make money or anything of the sort, or even seem the ayatollah of nazi photographic documentation. Sources are cited at the end of the article as they are labeled, and if it so happens that such or such pic from NAC or Bundesarchiv are someone's personal property then it is a mistake and deserves a sincere apology which I hereby submit. Shall I commit hara-kiri right now ? Or will banishment from the place where all the scholars and important people are be enough ?

User avatar
Annelie
Member
Posts: 4872
Joined: 12 Mar 2002 02:45
Location: North America

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Annelie » 21 Dec 2011 15:42

While I agree with you generally that it is not about making money but
somehow it would be nice if people would give credit for the photos they
use.

Once someone puts photos on the web its pretty much impossible to stop
people from using them but its also common courtesy to give credit where
its due.

Everyone enjoys the Gebhardt's site only issue again is that there is no
credit for the photos acquired. Personally I am pleased to see such
collections. Its obvious that his interest began some years ago
and made a habit to meeting some of those people.

Max Williams
Member
Posts: 10166
Joined: 04 Feb 2003 16:57
Location: London

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Max Williams » 22 Dec 2011 12:29

Eddy Marz wrote:No-one has tried to pretend (or even has the slightest interest in doing so) that pictures were "his" - but just to illustrate for this french forum an article about Potthast. No-one in that forum thinks that the pictures are the author's property; they are just used as illustration. France is very poor on nazi documentation and the article was only for informative reasons. Nowhere is there any will to sell, publish, or make money or anything of the sort, or even seem the ayatollah of nazi photographic documentation. Sources are cited at the end of the article as they are labeled, and if it so happens that such or such pic from NAC or Bundesarchiv are someone's personal property then it is a mistake and deserves a sincere apology which I hereby submit. Shall I commit hara-kiri right now ? Or will banishment from the place where all the scholars and important people are be enough ?
Annelie wrote:While I agree with you generally that it is not about making money but
somehow it would be nice if people would give credit for the photos they
use.

Once someone puts photos on the web its pretty much impossible to stop
people from using them but its also common courtesy to give credit where
its due.

Everyone enjoys the Gebhardt's site only issue again is that there is no
credit for the photos acquired. Personally I am pleased to see such
collections. Its obvious that his interest began some years ago
and made a habit to meeting some of those people.
Exactly Annelie, and no need for the stupid overreaction from the previous poster. Von Gebhardt may be providing photos and documentation, but that still does not abrogate him from the courtesy of recognizing the owners of images he is circulating. This is a common courtesy expected by most forum sites, including this one. Whether Eddy likes it or not, the setup of Gebhardt's site is such that the impression given is one of ownership, regardless of his piecemeal attempt to list sources. I know the owners of a number of the images he has used who have not been mentioned and who have not given Gebhardt permission to use them. The whole point of forums is to discuss and learn from others, but the actions of a few can be counter-productive when contributors are concerned that their items might be misused. I used to freely post images on forums until a number of my photos were used without my permission, some even offered for sale as originals on the internet. I am now reluctant. So, Annelie is quite right.....all it takes is a simple request.
Max.

User avatar
Eddy Marz
Member
Posts: 559
Joined: 12 Mar 2007 11:32
Location: France

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Eddy Marz » 22 Dec 2011 12:57

Max Williams wrote: Exactly Annelie, and no need for the stupid overreaction from the previous poster. Von Gebhardt may be providing photos and documentation, but that still does not abrogate him from the courtesy of recognizing the owners of images he is circulating. This is a common courtesy expected by most forum sites, including this one. Whether Eddy likes it or not, the setup of Gebhardt's site is such that the impression given is one of ownership, regardless of his piecemeal attempt to list sources. I know the owners of a number of the images he has used who have not been mentioned and who have not given Gebhardt permission to use them. The whole point of forums is to discuss and learn from others, but the actions of a few can be counter-productive when contributors are concerned that their items might be misused. I used to freely post images on forums until a number of my photos were used without my permission, some even offered for sale as originals on the internet. I am now reluctant. So, Annelie is quite right.....all it takes is a simple request.
Max.
Hi Max;
I did not find the NAC and Bundesarchiv photos on Gebhardt's site (which I have just discovered recently), but on the Internet in general. Had I known, I would have obviously asked for permission and will be more careful from now on, you can rest assured. The article on the french forum did list the sources as follows :

- NARA
- NAC
- Ullsteinbild
- Bundesarchiv
- BeeldbankWO2

Which is how I found them.

My 'stupid overreaction' was directed at Helge's equally stupid and pseudo-elitist aloofness :
we appropriate photos, articles, research, without citing the source, but this does not happen to us I am happy if others copy Axis History: here we have scholars, researchers, important authors. What do we want more?
I'm perfectly able to recognize my mistakes when they are pointed out to me, readily apologize for them, and make sure they don't happen again, without having to put up with an upstart comment suggesting ignorance and lack of seriousness from anything that is not AHF.

Sorry again for the pics
Best regards
8-)

User avatar
Annelie
Member
Posts: 4872
Joined: 12 Mar 2002 02:45
Location: North America

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Annelie » 22 Dec 2011 13:09

Eddy,

Helge tries very hard to make contributions to this forum.
His English language skills are not always up to saying what he means.
He does mean well and spends a lot of time searching.

Again his remark wasn't "stupid and pseudo-elitist aloofness"
just that he wasn't able to convey what he meant. English isn't
his first language.

User avatar
Eddy Marz
Member
Posts: 559
Joined: 12 Mar 2007 11:32
Location: France

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Eddy Marz » 22 Dec 2011 13:18

Annelie wrote:Eddy,

Helge tries very hard to make contributions to this forum.
His English language skills are not always up to saying what he means.
He does mean well and spends a lot of time searching.

Again his remark wasn't "stupid and pseudo-elitist aloofness"
just that he wasn't able to convey what he meant. English isn't
his first language.
OK, no harm done. I have nothing against anybody, quite on the contrary.
:wink:

User avatar
Helge
Member
Posts: 1500
Joined: 12 Jun 2010 07:09
Location: Finland

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Helge » 25 Jan 2012 12:15

Bescheinigung eines Truppenarztes für Hedwig Potthast aus Brückenthin, z.Z. Prenzlau, vom 12.2.1945.

Originalunterschrift eines Stabsarztes (Hptm.) und Abteilungsarztes der Divisions-Nachschubtruppen 300 der 4. SS-Polizei-Panzer-Grenadierdivision. (Feldpostnummer 34213)

Certificate from a doctor for Hedwig Potthast troops from thin bridge, currently Prenzlau, from 12/02/1945.
Original signature of a staff physician (Capt.) and Department of physician supply division 300 troops of the 4th SS-Panzer-Grenadier Division police. (Field post number 34 213)

http://www.militaria321.com
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Sota ei päätä kuka on oikeassa, vain sen että kuka on jäljellä.
War does not decide who is right but only those who are left.

User avatar
Annelie
Member
Posts: 4872
Joined: 12 Mar 2002 02:45
Location: North America

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Annelie » 25 Jan 2012 13:00

Thanks Helge,

But, I don't understand what the document from the doctor is for?
Travel, illness?

User avatar
Eddy Marz
Member
Posts: 559
Joined: 12 Mar 2007 11:32
Location: France

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Eddy Marz » 25 Jan 2012 14:11

Annelie wrote:Thanks Helge,

But, I don't understand what the document from the doctor is for?
Travel, illness?
Nor do I; also, the document is issued by a truppenarzt (military doctor)

User avatar
Dieter Zinke
Forum Staff
Posts: 9686
Joined: 02 Dec 2003 09:12
Location: Koblenz / germany

Re: Himmler's mistress and Digipuratum

Post by Dieter Zinke » 25 Jan 2012 15:06

In today’s view a fairly non-scientific treatment for the “invigoration” of the heart (in terms of - for example - : poor circulation, heart palpitation, excited or stress-related heart-trouble) in the form of a “Digitalis-Kur” [curative application of Digitalis - like to take the waters]).

Digipuratum: das erste deutsche Digitalis-Präparat mit konstantem Wirkungswert: Knoll & Co. (Ludwigshafen) haben ein von unwirksamen Beimengungen (Zersetzungsprodukten) gereinigtes Extrakt der Digitalisblätter hergestellt: Extract. digital, depuratum Knoll, (Digipuratum titriert).

The use of Digipuratum in heart disease:
http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/conten ... /VII/4/551

The comparative strength of Digipuratum:
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/LIV/2/129.extract

Pharmacology of circulation - Digipuratum:
http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/h ... -hci.shtml

Digipuratum (kuk Militärmedikamentendirektion) - Militaria Archiv
Ausrüstung
http://www.militaria-archiv.com › Militaria Forum 1918 - 1945 › Ausrüstung


Dieter Z.

User avatar
Eddy Marz
Member
Posts: 559
Joined: 12 Mar 2007 11:32
Location: France

Re: Himmler's mistress and Digipuratum

Post by Eddy Marz » 25 Jan 2012 15:47

Dieter Zinke wrote:In today’s view a fairly non-scientific treatment for the “invigoration” of the heart (in terms of - for example - : poor circulation, heart palpitation, excited or stress-related heart-trouble) in the form of a “Digitalis-Kur” [curative application of Digitalis - like to take the waters]).
Well, thanks Dieter... So, Miss Potthast may have been suffering from poor circulation like millions of people, but also from stress-related heart-trouble. Interesting.

User avatar
Helge
Member
Posts: 1500
Joined: 12 Jun 2010 07:09
Location: Finland

Re: Himmler's mistress

Post by Helge » 25 Jan 2012 16:04

It seems that this product is prepared for the treatment of primary and secondary heart disease. The doctor Karl Gebhardt, who was working only a few km from Brückenthin: Heilanstalten Hohenlychen. is its medical officer was also present at the birth of her children. Interestingly, at that time, Hedwig was not in Bavaria.

Digipuratum : http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article ... -0063b.pdf
Sota ei päätä kuka on oikeassa, vain sen että kuka on jäljellä.
War does not decide who is right but only those who are left.

User avatar
Helge
Member
Posts: 1500
Joined: 12 Jun 2010 07:09
Location: Finland

Re: Himmler's mistress and Digipuratum

Post by Helge » 25 Jan 2012 16:06

Dieter Zinke wrote:In today’s view a fairly non-scientific treatment for the “invigoration” of the heart (in terms of - for example - : poor circulation, heart palpitation, excited or stress-related heart-trouble) in the form of a “Digitalis-Kur” [curative application of Digitalis - like to take the waters]).

Digipuratum: das erste deutsche Digitalis-Präparat mit konstantem Wirkungswert: Knoll & Co. (Ludwigshafen) haben ein von unwirksamen Beimengungen (Zersetzungsprodukten) gereinigtes Extrakt der Digitalisblätter hergestellt: Extract. digital, depuratum Knoll, (Digipuratum titriert).

The use of Digipuratum in heart disease:
http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/conten ... /VII/4/551

The comparative strength of Digipuratum:
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/LIV/2/129.extract

Pharmacology of circulation - Digipuratum:
http://www.ebooksread.com/authors-eng/h ... -hci.shtml

Digipuratum (kuk Militärmedikamentendirektion) - Militaria Archiv
Ausrüstung
http://www.militaria-archiv.com › Militaria Forum 1918 - 1945 › Ausrüstung


Dieter Z.
Thanks Dieter, it's all very interesting!
Dieter :it would be interesting to see who was the doctor who signed the prescription
Helge
Sota ei päätä kuka on oikeassa, vain sen että kuka on jäljellä.
War does not decide who is right but only those who are left.

Return to “Women in the Reich”