Soviet Naval Battles

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lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 09 Nov 2019 15:52

igorr wrote:
01 Aug 2018 04:37
28
While life is taking time with new job, family etc. Sporadically i've some time to cover-up some old things.
Re-reading some of my notes and collections of data, i found one episode we briefly convered but it's not detailed in Arctic:


20 March 1945 in Arctic.
Depth charges launched against sub U-997 by Soviet guard boat "Smerch", causing light damage.
I read/know she had support of "BO" /submarine chasers. It is known their identity? (could be interesting to know if they were project122, or it was a use for the lend-leased allied boats).

igorr
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by igorr » 11 Nov 2019 03:54

There was 9 BO in all in area, i know only 4 (131, 133, 135, 136). Which ships was with SMERCH and even how many - i don't know. Perhaps named four.

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 11 Nov 2019 17:19

Thank you!

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 15 Nov 2019 19:06

igorr wrote:
11 Nov 2019 03:54
There was 9 BO in all in area, i know only 4 (131, 133, 135, 136). Which ships was with SMERCH and even how many - i don't know. Perhaps named four.
Sorry to bother you with another question so early, just that i found a bit an impasse for that question i tried to research/ask a couple of time and apparently few authors on tsushima.su got an interest for it (the action on April 1945 off Pillau).
If you've time, to take a brief look at my latest post in the forum ((http://tsushima.su/forums/viewtopic.php?id=3199&p=25 )), there are some hints/confirmation to at least properly identify the gunboats that engaged with the MFPs? Because i've not understood if they were BKA 508, 513 (and others) of 1125 class OR the larger MBK .
To know already this, it would be a starting point to shed some clarity over that fight.
(I see there are a number of documents pics, but i cannot read them)

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 16 Apr 2020 17:14

igorr wrote:
11 Nov 2019 03:54
There was 9 BO in all in area, i know only 4 (131, 133, 135, 136). Which ships was with SMERCH and even how many - i don't know. Perhaps named four.
Greetings again igor (hope you're also fine with the covid situation).
Recently was scrolling over pages and data of the forum and detected a sub attack in Arctic for some reason i missed to notice on HMA,
U-585 reported damage after depth charges on 24 March 1942, "db-aanval tot 04u53,3 U-jagers,schade,terugmars"
In this old post you wrote that GREMYASHCHIY was responsable viewtopic.php?t=239696
But do you know also the identity of the different British minesweepers?

Thanks in advance

igorr
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by igorr » 17 Apr 2020 05:41

This is totally strange case. GR. with SPEEDWELL, HARRIER, HUSSAR, NIGER and GOSSAMER arrived in Kola bay 09.30msk that day. Maybe HMS ORIBI also was somewhere in sea, but i'm not sure. There is two main problem. GR. and M/S's didn't reported any DC attacks that mourning. OK, U.585 has bombed many times with 2-3 DC only, so ships may made only occasionally "profilactical" bombing. But other thing is U.585's report. Commander see through periscope "Destroyer with 2 funnels and 2 twin guns on back". GR. has only 1 funnel and single guns. Also, all 3 ships worked with english asdics. I can't say now, who was this.

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 18 Apr 2020 16:26

igorr wrote:
17 Apr 2020 05:41
This is totally strange case. GR. with SPEEDWELL, HARRIER, HUSSAR, NIGER and GOSSAMER arrived in Kola bay 09.30msk that day. Maybe HMS ORIBI also was somewhere in sea, but i'm not sure. There is two main problem. GR. and M/S's didn't reported any DC attacks that mourning. OK, U.585 has bombed many times with 2-3 DC only, so ships may made only occasionally "profilactical" bombing. But other thing is U.585's report. Commander see through periscope "Destroyer with 2 funnels and 2 twin guns on back". GR. has only 1 funnel and single guns. Also, all 3 ships worked with english asdics. I can't say now, who was this.
Thank you for your explain. Also Oribi and British M/S had one barrel-guns: maybe it was some smaller ship with dual-barrels AA guns, or just some mis-identification. Anyway, with some more free-time i made some extra checks on HM to see updates or data i missed. There is one incident for Arctic.


On 30 April 1945, (from tsushima)
At 02.30, the Catalina aircraft of the 44th SAP 12 miles north of Cape Set-Navolok discovered a submarine under the periscope and dropped 8 PLA-100 on it. The result is not set.
Square AC8852. Attacked by U-968.
On 1 May 1945, indeed U-968 reported "U968 op snorkel, bommen, schade periscoop (TF)".
Damage seems light to moderate, the two reports match to each other?
On the same 30 April there was another case we already checked of U-711 also bombed by Soviet B-25 Mitchell, but should be unrelated

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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by igorr » 20 Apr 2020 03:05

I think U.968 cases taken from one source.

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 20 Apr 2020 16:02

igorr wrote:
20 Apr 2020 03:05
I think U.968 cases taken from one source.
Well... its quite reasonable that on 30 Apr 45 with war almost over, and if you have some confirmation or clear denial (like report of the attack, but with no damage indicated) its welcome

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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by igorr » 21 Apr 2020 03:45

Lokks like this is ULTRA-interception but i can't find any links to DEFE 3 number.

lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 21 Apr 2020 12:39

igorr wrote:
21 Apr 2020 03:45
Lokks like this is ULTRA-interception but i can't find any links to DEFE 3 number.
Just found it in DEFE 3/743 (I went straight there because it focused solely on U-boats.
Here a stamp: https://i.imgur.com/otg42MJ.jpg
By hour could match? doesn't give a specific hour but it's close or after midnight between 29/30 April


PS: these latests DEFE are interesting, nearby these pages there are reports for example of U-427 that was quite in trouble after Canadian ships attacks in AC8829, it also reported a Catalina attack in AC8439 but described as unsucessful.

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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by igorr » 22 Apr 2020 02:52

U-boat give hour as 01.00 and soviet Catalina as 02.30, so, as German time was Msk-1, only half of hour difference, quite little.

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tigre
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by tigre » 22 Apr 2020 20:12

Hello to all :D; more.....................................

Kronstadt 1941.

Source: LIFE 11 May 1942.

Cheers. Raúl M 8-).
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lupodimare89
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Re: Soviet Naval Battles

Post by lupodimare89 » 20 May 2020 12:50

Well, thans tigre even if so far we have kept this years-long topic just focused on specific info/data checking of clashes and battles ^^

On this subject, i would like to copy my latest info-gathering over clashes occurred in Pillau during 1945. Sadly while there are growing info of German losses (thanks HM site) it's somewhat mysterious the exact identity of the BKA involved into two separate incidents that are strongly connected with surface losses of minor german crafts. I copy the text here for future reference/interest/need.

--------------------------------------



16 March 1945
The Original Soviet claim sure appears a bit exagerated, but there are elements to see that something happened:
2У гавани Пайзе 5 бка атаковали караван плавсредств неприятеля, потопив 2 вооруженные бдб, 2 несамоходные баржи и большое число шлюпок с солдатами. 5 тка искали врага у Пиллау, 2 из которых вели бой с 8 ска неприятеля.
Attacking group was composed by BKA 200, 201, 202, 204, 205, 206, 212, 213 and 214
In the past was proposed that German PiLb-554 reportedly lost by mine on the area on the same day could be involved in the action.
On HMA there are actually two possible victims:
16.04.1945 Vor der Frischen Nehrung fällt das in Begleitung le.Stubo vom Weichseldurchstich nach Pillau laufende s.Stubo 252 der 2./771 mit 60 Soldaten an Bord einer Mine zum Opfer.[
With the interesting details that other StuBo were engaged in a firefight:
16.04.1945 Verlust eines s.Stubo durch Minentreffer vor Pillau. Zu Hilfe kommende le.Stubo von russ. Schnellbooten zusammengeschossen.[
Concerning the PiLb-554 there is both an older report of sinking at 16 March but also a "double" subsequent report at 17 March
17.04.1945 PiLB 554 wird auf seiner letzten Fahrt von Peyse nach Pillau vor Kamstigal durch eine Magnetmine zerrissen.[
17.04.1945 Verlust eines Labo durch Minentreffer bei Kamstigall.[
In the end both BiLB-554 and StuBo-252 are reported as lost due mines, not with thousands of dead, but clearly many dozens. Also a firefight with Soviet boats is mentioned, but it is unclear the effect of the fight on both side (as for the possiblity that BKA finished the damaged crafts, or hit them directly on first place).


25 April 1945
I have already wrote above of this second battle, somewhat more interesting for the direct capture of German soldiers/sailors on sea.
Finally, the HMA give some extra clue of the two barges lost due BKA action with the following description:
25.04.1945 Verlegung der 2. und 3. Kp nach Schiewenhorst. -- 4 L-Boote geraten auf dem Marsch in einen russ. Landungsverband vor Neutief, 2-LBoote sinken im Feuer der russ. Fahrzeuge.[
Number of crafts sunk match the Soviet claim and for the first time we have a more defined identification, could be interesting to understand/know which kind PiLB boats was used by the PiL 771 unit

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