Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

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ShinjiMimura
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Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by ShinjiMimura » 28 May 2007 22:43

Can someone help me get a detailed OOB of a Soviet cavalry corps?

Numerous searches on both t'internet and AHF have turned up mostly blanks, so I thought a concerted effort might come up with better results.

Some essential details I'd like to know are:

a). Realistic strength of WW2 (post-'41) Cavalry Corps.
b). How they were organised (was it along infantry lines like Divisions, or along cavalry lines like squadrons/regiments/troops etc?)

Thanks in advance for any info you're able to provide! I'll do my best to gather some myself.

Shinji.

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Post by Gregory Deych » 29 May 2007 05:59

Some of your question is answered here: http://www.feldgrau.net/phpBB2/viewtopi ... highlight=

As for the rest, realistic strength is a highly variable entity during WW2. At the outset of operation, the strength of a cavalry division could be 100%, whereas by the end it could be combat incapable due to combat losses. Obviously during the "in between" period it went through the entire gamut of conditions. I'll say that the cavalry units did tend to take casualties at a higher rate then many other units, and due to being used in penetration role (where replacements were difficult to supply) would be used up faster then some others. Glantz cites some units at selected times, and strength varied from overstrength to as low 19%.

The organization was "cavalry style" - a cavalry regiment consisted of 4 squadrons, field artillery battery, AT battery, mortar battery and several miscellaneous platoons. A machine-gun squadron was deleted by 1943.

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Post by ShinjiMimura » 29 May 2007 19:13

Many thanks, Greg!

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Wirgil
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Post by Wirgil » 30 May 2007 20:06

Here is some more info about Soviet Cavalry Corps.

On 22 of June, 1941, there were 4 Cavalry Corps'es in Soviet Army. Three of them consisted of 2 cavalry divisions each, ane the forth had 3 divisions. Every Corps then had an independent communications batallion. Generally, that was the organization of Cavalry Corps until the end of 1942.
At the beginning of 1943 all CC were given mortar regiments (1 in each Corps), horse artillery batallions (1 in each CC) and anti-tank batallion (1 in each CC).

Another reorganization took place at the end of 1943/beginning of 1944.
CC consisted then of:

2-3 cav.divisions,
a regiment of self-propelled guns,
a regiment of anti-tank artillery,
a regiment of mortars,
a regiment of anti-aircraft artillery,
an independent anti-tank batallion,
an independent batallion of mortars,
an independent communications batallion.
This organization remined until the end of war.

Then, a Cavalry division in 1941 consisted of:
3 cavalry regiments, each having 1369 men and 1588 horses, consisting of:
- 4 cavalry squadrons
- a machine guns squadron (16 heavy MGs)
- a horse-artillery battery (4xregimental 76,2mm)
- an anti-tank battery (4x45mm)
- an anti-aifcart battery (3x37mm and 3 MGs).

a tank regiment (64xBT7 or BT5, 18 armored cars (BA-10, BA-20)))
a horse artillery batallion (8x76mm, 8x122mm)
an anti-aircraft batallion (8x76,2mm)
a pioneer squadron
a communications squadron
a squadron of "chemical defense"
a medical squadron

At all, Cavalry Division had 9240 men and 7625 horses.

Divisios were reorganized in late 1941.
Find below OOB of Cavalry Division since December, 1941:

3 cavalry regiments, each having 910 men and 1018 horses, consisting of:
- 4 cavalry squadrons
- a machine guns squadron (12 heavy MGs)
- a horse-artillery battery (4xregimental 76,2mm; 2xanti-tank 45mm)

an armored squadron (10 armored cars)
a horse artillery batallion (12x76mm, 4 mortars 82mm)
a reconnaissance squadron
a pioneer squadron
a squadron of "chemical defense"
a medical squadron
a communications platoon

AT all, division had, after reorganization, 2939 men and 3147 horses.

Source: http://www.rkka.ru

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ShinjiMimura
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Post by ShinjiMimura » 31 May 2007 14:54

Thanks a lot, Wirgil!

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Post by Art » 02 Jun 2007 16:05

According to Stavka order of 31st December the existing cavalry division should be reorganiazed by 15th March 1944 according to the following OOB:
1. Divisional HQ - 113 men, 97 horses
2. 3 cavalry regiments (1138 men, 1294 horses), each with 4 sabre squadrons (170 men, 180 horses), battery of 76-mm guns (4 guns, 100 men, 132 horses), battery of 45-mm guns (4 guns, 85 men, 3 horses), battery of 82-mm mortars (12 mortars, 113 men, 131 horses), signal platoon (38 men, 48 horses), engineer platoon (23 men, 26 horses), chemical platoon (14 men, 26 horses) and service units (50 men).
Each sabre squadron with 4 sabre platoons (27 men, 29 horses), machinegun platoon (4 heavy machenguns, 26 men, 30 horses) and anti-tank rifles platoon (6 ATR, 21 men, 23 horses).
3. Artillery-mortar regiment with two batteries of 76-mm guns SIZ-3 - total 8 guns, 134 men and 168 horses in each battery and three batteries of 120-mm mortars - total 18 mortars, 100 men and 130 horses in each battery. Total 700 men and 820 horses in the regiment.
4. Tank regiment (352 men, 23 T-34, 16 T-70).
5. Separate AA battalion (250 men, 184 horses, 27 DShK 12,7-mm AA machineguns, 6 37- or 25-mm AA guns).
6. Signal squadron (86 men, 83 horses).
7. Engineer suadron (85 men, 75 horses).
8. Sepaarte chemical defence platoon (32 men, 34 horses).
9. Artillery depot (143 men, 112 horses).
10 Food transport (56 men).
11. Medical platoon (50 men)/
12. Fual supply platoon (11 men)
13. Veterinary ambulance (4 men, 9 horses).
14. Saddle-boots workshop (21 men).
15. Prosecutor's office (2 men).
16. Special department ("Osobiy otdel") platoon (16 men).
Total in division:
5352 men
5298 horses
12 regimantal 76-mm guns
8 76-mm ZIS-3 guns
12 45-mm guns
36 82-mm mortars
18 120-mm mortars
48 heavy machineguns
113 light machineguns
37 DShK machineguns
1049 submachineguns
72 ATRs
3497 rifles and carabines
23 T-34 tanks
16 T-70 tanks
3 armoured cars
8 cars
156 trucks
33 automobiles of special types.
According to the next order issued the same day artillery units of cavalry coprs consisted of:
1. Tank-destroyes artillery regiment (motorized) - 5 batteries of 76-mm ZIS-3 guns, total 20 guns and 488 men.
2. AA machinegun squadron - 12 DShK machineguns, 73 men, 110 horses.
3. Separate mortar battalion - 18 120-mm mortars, 373 men, 449 horses.
In addition the following rear units were introduced in the OOB of corps:
Commmandant squadron - 135 men, 127 horses.
Field bakery - 93 men.
Divisional exchange point (most adequately translated as depot) - 17 men.

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Post by Stephan » 02 Jun 2007 20:24

About the high losses.

I suspect they were not necessary all personal losses.

If a cavallerist lost his horse, and there wasnt no reserve horse, or horse of some dead camrade, he also was lost...

A well trained cavallery horse was also a heavy factor in these numbers.

and a horse do has a number of reasons why it wouldnt be unserviceable. Most of damages in the legs for example.

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Post by ShinjiMimura » 04 Jun 2007 14:32

Thanks to all for info!

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Re:

Post by Kelvin » 21 Aug 2010 19:21

Art wrote:According to Stavka order of 31st December the existing cavalry division should be reorganiazed by 15th March 1944 according to the following OOB:
1. Divisional HQ - 113 men, 97 horses
2. 3 cavalry regiments (1138 men, 1294 horses), each with 4 sabre squadrons (170 men, 180 horses), battery of 76-mm guns (4 guns, 100 men, 132 horses), battery of 45-mm guns (4 guns, 85 men, 3 horses), battery of 82-mm mortars (12 mortars, 113 men, 131 horses), signal platoon (38 men, 48 horses), engineer platoon (23 men, 26 horses), chemical platoon (14 men, 26 horses) and service units (50 men).
Each sabre squadron with 4 sabre platoons (27 men, 29 horses), machinegun platoon (4 heavy machenguns, 26 men, 30 horses) and anti-tank rifles platoon (6 ATR, 21 men, 23 horses).
3. Artillery-mortar regiment with two batteries of 76-mm guns SIZ-3 - total 8 guns, 134 men and 168 horses in each battery and three batteries of 120-mm mortars - total 18 mortars, 100 men and 130 horses in each battery. Total 700 men and 820 horses in the regiment.
4. Tank regiment (352 men, 23 T-34, 16 T-70).
5. Separate AA battalion (250 men, 184 horses, 27 DShK 12,7-mm AA machineguns, 6 37- or 25-mm AA guns).
6. Signal squadron (86 men, 83 horses).
7. Engineer suadron (85 men, 75 horses).
8. Sepaarte chemical defence platoon (32 men, 34 horses).
9. Artillery depot (143 men, 112 horses).
10 Food transport (56 men).
11. Medical platoon (50 men)/
12. Fual supply platoon (11 men)
13. Veterinary ambulance (4 men, 9 horses).
14. Saddle-boots workshop (21 men).
15. Prosecutor's office (2 men).
16. Special department ("Osobiy otdel") platoon (16 men).
Total in division:
5352 men
5298 horses
12 regimantal 76-mm guns
8 76-mm ZIS-3 guns
12 45-mm guns
36 82-mm mortars
18 120-mm mortars
48 heavy machineguns
113 light machineguns
37 DShK machineguns
1049 submachineguns
72 ATRs
3497 rifles and carabines
23 T-34 tanks
16 T-70 tanks
3 armoured cars
8 cars
156 trucks
33 automobiles of special types.
According to the next order issued the same day artillery units of cavalry coprs consisted of:
1. Tank-destroyes artillery regiment (motorized) - 5 batteries of 76-mm ZIS-3 guns, total 20 guns and 488 men.
2. AA machinegun squadron - 12 DShK machineguns, 73 men, 110 horses.
3. Separate mortar battalion - 18 120-mm mortars, 373 men, 449 horses.
In addition the following rear units were introduced in the OOB of corps:
Commmandant squadron - 135 men, 127 horses.
Field bakery - 93 men.
Divisional exchange point (most adequately translated as depot) - 17 men.
Hi , Art, did Cavalry Corps consist of two or three cavarly division ? And I see some sources that Corps troop also had two tank regiments and one SU-85 regiment, was it correct ? :)

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Re: Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by Art » 29 Aug 2010 08:26

Hi , Art, did Cavalry Corps consist of two or three cavarly division ?
In 1944-45 three was a rule.
And I see some sources that Corps troop also had two tank regiments
No, tank regiments were in divisions, corps didn't have any.
and one SU-85 regiment
Yes.

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Re:

Post by Kelvin » 09 Nov 2018 08:27

Art wrote:
02 Jun 2007 16:05
According to Stavka order of 31st December the existing cavalry division should be reorganiazed by 15th March 1944 according to the following OOB:
1. Divisional HQ - 113 men, 97 horses
2. 3 cavalry regiments (1138 men, 1294 horses), each with 4 sabre squadrons (170 men, 180 horses), battery of 76-mm guns (4 guns, 100 men, 132 horses), battery of 45-mm guns (4 guns, 85 men, 3 horses), battery of 82-mm mortars (12 mortars, 113 men, 131 horses), signal platoon (38 men, 48 horses), engineer platoon (23 men, 26 horses), chemical platoon (14 men, 26 horses) and service units (50 men).
Each sabre squadron with 4 sabre platoons (27 men, 29 horses), machinegun platoon (4 heavy machenguns, 26 men, 30 horses) and anti-tank rifles platoon (6 ATR, 21 men, 23 horses).
3. Artillery-mortar regiment with two batteries of 76-mm guns SIZ-3 - total 8 guns, 134 men and 168 horses in each battery and three batteries of 120-mm mortars - total 18 mortars, 100 men and 130 horses in each battery. Total 700 men and 820 horses in the regiment.
4. Tank regiment (352 men, 23 T-34, 16 T-70).
5. Separate AA battalion (250 men, 184 horses, 27 DShK 12,7-mm AA machineguns, 6 37- or 25-mm AA guns).
6. Signal squadron (86 men, 83 horses).
7. Engineer suadron (85 men, 75 horses).
8. Sepaarte chemical defence platoon (32 men, 34 horses).
9. Artillery depot (143 men, 112 horses).
10 Food transport (56 men).
11. Medical platoon (50 men)/
12. Fual supply platoon (11 men)
13. Veterinary ambulance (4 men, 9 horses).
14. Saddle-boots workshop (21 men).
15. Prosecutor's office (2 men).
16. Special department ("Osobiy otdel") platoon (16 men).
Total in division:
5352 men
5298 horses
12 regimantal 76-mm guns
8 76-mm ZIS-3 guns
12 45-mm guns
36 82-mm mortars
18 120-mm mortars
48 heavy machineguns
113 light machineguns
37 DShK machineguns
1049 submachineguns
72 ATRs
3497 rifles and carabines
23 T-34 tanks
16 T-70 tanks
3 armoured cars
8 cars
156 trucks
33 automobiles of special types.
According to the next order issued the same day artillery units of cavalry coprs consisted of:
1. Tank-destroyes artillery regiment (motorized) - 5 batteries of 76-mm ZIS-3 guns, total 20 guns and 488 men.
2. AA machinegun squadron - 12 DShK machineguns, 73 men, 110 horses.
3. Separate mortar battalion - 18 120-mm mortars, 373 men, 449 horses.
In addition the following rear units were introduced in the OOB of corps:
Commmandant squadron - 135 men, 127 horses.
Field bakery - 93 men.
Divisional exchange point (most adequately translated as depot) - 17 men.

Hi, Art, is it alternative to TOE of Artillery Mortar Regiment ? in accordance with Charles Sharp book Red Sabre Soviet cavalry corps, he mentions 12 x 76mm field guns and 12 x 120mm mortar. This version is ad hoc or also official TOE too ? /thank

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Re: Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by Art » 09 Nov 2018 16:49

Organizational diagram for the 1943 type divisions shows two 76-mm and three 120-mm mortar batteries in the regiment, total 8 guns and 18 mortars. I don't know what was Sharp's info.

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Re: Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by Nakhodchanin » 09 Nov 2018 18:04

I greeting all! If anyone is interested in this document - ''The calculation of Table-Organizational number of Cavalry Division with divisional units as of November 20, 1944'' on 3 pages, it is here https://pamyat-naroda.ru/documents/view/?id=110355105.

Best regards

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Re: Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by Nakhodchanin » 04 Dec 2018 18:20

Once again, greetings to all! I want to continue in the development of this topic viewtopic.php?f=79&t=238167 it is here lay out this document:
Rearmament by SMGs in 1st Grd.CavC 30.V.1943.jpg
NKO-SSSR
________
S T A F F
1st
GUARD CAVCORPS
OPERATIONAL DEPARTMENT
"30" 5 1943
№ 0157
_______
Active Red Army

THE COMMANDERS of 1,2,7 GrdCavDiv
_________________________________

According to the order of Stavka VGK № 46175 of 22.5.43 about rearmamen in each company of
one platoon instead of rifles - submachine guns,
COMMANDER OF CORPS ORDERED:
1.To 5.6.43 rearm by submachine guns instead rifles in each squadron of cavalry regiment the first platoons,
leaving the number of machine guns unchanged. In the remaining cavalry subunits additionally to arm by submachine guns:
commanders of squads, platoons and squadrons. the platoons of submachine gunners 12-row composition.
2.To proceed immediately to the preparation of the platoons of submachine gunners.
On the implementation of this order to report of 18:00 5.6.43.

CHIEF OF STAFF OF GRD.CAVCORPS
GUARD COLONEL
/RADZIEVSKIY/

here is the link: https://pamyat-naroda.ru/documents/view/?id=451539447
this document is interesting that no indications of intermediate organizational orders /directives specifically intended for cavalry. This order comes directly from the directive, which was intended for rifle troops. The moment that surprised me, you can see that the passage: "the platoons of submachine gunners 12-row composition", reprinted after, surprises the content itself. "12-row composition" - organizational structure or tactical order (marching or combat)? Very interesting! Unfortunately there is no time to dig in this direction, Soviet Сavalry - not my object of study.

Best regards
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Re: Soviet Cavalry Corps breakdown

Post by Paul_Atreides » 05 Dec 2018 06:25

Nakhodchanin wrote:
04 Dec 2018 18:20
The moment that surprised me, you can see that the passage: "the platoons of submachine gunners 12-row composition", reprinted after, surprises the content itself. "12-row composition" - organizational structure or tactical order (marching or combat)? Very interesting!
"14. Полный ряд - два всадника, стоящие в затылок друг другу. Если за всадником первой шеренги нет всадника второй шеренги, то ряд называется глухим". (Строевой устав конницы РККА. 1938 г.)

15-row platoon

15-row.jpg

12-row platoon

12-row.jpg
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