Hi,
I am looking for information on the 69th Guards Fighter Aviation Regiment during WWII.
I already have some information on them: their place in the VVS structure after summer 1942 was as following - 69th GIAP, 23rd GIAD, 6th GIAK, 2nd VA, 1st Ukranian Front. Before the regiment received guards designation (I am assuming it was the air corps which received the designation, not the regiment itself) they were within the 7th IAK of the Moscow PVO forces. I assume the Guards designation was given for meritous performance in the defence of Moscow. Some regiments of the 7th IAK/PVO were sent to reinforce Leningrad in the winter '41/42, and these regiments, I believe, flew P-40s. There were other regiments in the 7th IAK/PVO which flew I-16 Ishaks, but I'm not sure which they were.
I also know that the 69th GIAP, together with the 21st GIAP (also within the 23rd GIAD), were retrained to fly Aircobras by 22d ZAP, and were posted back to the front with this aircraft on October 1st 1943. I have been led to believe that the regiment flew cobras until the end of the war.
Unfortunately, I only have details of 2 of their pilots: Chizh, Vasilij Ivanovich with 13 confirmed kills, and Proshenkov, Nikolaj Ivanovich with 19 confirmed kills, and 4 shared kills. Proshenkov was a Hero of the Soviet Union, and commander of the 69th from May 1945, and had previously served in the 21st GIAP.
Basically, I have almost no other information on the regiment before January 1942, including their original designation, their commanding officer, or in fact any of the pilots in service with the regiment. I would like to find out who served with the regiment, their original designation before the summer of '42, any citations received by pilots of the regiment, a kills list, casualty list, which battles they participated in, etc, etc.
I would appreciate greatly anyone who can give me information on any of these aspects, or can point me to somewhere I can get this info.
Thank you.
69th Gv.IAP in WWII
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=69.GIAP=TOOZ
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Must say that have also very few information on this unit. But until now i have seen following ...
Formed on March 18th 1943 on basis of 10th Fighter Air Regiment (but have also seen mentioned that 69th GIAP has been formed from 63rd or 169th IAP).
About other pilots in Regiment - Yefimov, Piotr Ivanovich. Hero of SU, was deputy Squadron Leader.
And yes, squadron finished the war on Cobra's.
rgrds
Toomas
Formed on March 18th 1943 on basis of 10th Fighter Air Regiment (but have also seen mentioned that 69th GIAP has been formed from 63rd or 169th IAP).
About other pilots in Regiment - Yefimov, Piotr Ivanovich. Hero of SU, was deputy Squadron Leader.
And yes, squadron finished the war on Cobra's.
rgrds
Toomas
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=69.GIAP=TOOZ
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Thank you Toomas, that is very helpful.
Do you remember where you saw this information? Whether it was in a book, or on a website? And are you sure that the regiment was not formed until 1943? I was given to believe that it was formed in the summer of 1942. Perhaps I am mistaken.
Thanks you,
Mikael.
Do you remember where you saw this information? Whether it was in a book, or on a website? And are you sure that the regiment was not formed until 1943? I was given to believe that it was formed in the summer of 1942. Perhaps I am mistaken.
Thanks you,
Mikael.
Hi!
Unfortunately can't say the source of my information at the moment. I have mostly collected info on Red Army aviation units from soviet/russian journals and books. Last few years also from web.
But definetly 69th GIAP wasn't established at 1942. As all units in VVS got their numbers in chronological order, in summer 1942 this order was somewhere around 20. And in November of 1942 got next big patch of units Guards title (26th - 36th Guards Air Regiments)
But about your opinion that whole Corps got Guards title - it's quite possible. According to my data on this day got Guards title following units.
64. Gv IAP 271. IAP 18.03.1943
65. Gv IAP 653. IAP 18.03.1943
66. Gv IAP 875. IAP 18.03.1943
67. Gv IAP 436. IAP 18.03.1943
68. Gv IAP 46. IAP 18.03.1943
69. Gv IAP 10. IAP 18.03.1943
Will dig bit deaper and let you know when will find the source or any other useful information...
rgrds
Toomas
Unfortunately can't say the source of my information at the moment. I have mostly collected info on Red Army aviation units from soviet/russian journals and books. Last few years also from web.
But definetly 69th GIAP wasn't established at 1942. As all units in VVS got their numbers in chronological order, in summer 1942 this order was somewhere around 20. And in November of 1942 got next big patch of units Guards title (26th - 36th Guards Air Regiments)
But about your opinion that whole Corps got Guards title - it's quite possible. According to my data on this day got Guards title following units.
64. Gv IAP 271. IAP 18.03.1943
65. Gv IAP 653. IAP 18.03.1943
66. Gv IAP 875. IAP 18.03.1943
67. Gv IAP 436. IAP 18.03.1943
68. Gv IAP 46. IAP 18.03.1943
69. Gv IAP 10. IAP 18.03.1943
Will dig bit deaper and let you know when will find the source or any other useful information...
rgrds
Toomas
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=69.GIAP=TOOZ
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Excellent, that is really helpful.
I was wondering why the 69th was in the 23rd GIAD with the 21st GIAP. I do know that the 6th GIAK/VVS was formed in 1942 from the 7th IAK/PVO, and I am guessing that all elements within that corps were given guards status. But then, why does the 23rd GIAP not contain the 20th and 21st GIAPs?? So perhaps the 69th was transferred later in the war, or, all the elements were not given guards status along with the corps in 1942.
I will need to do some investigating myself.
Thank you for your help.
Tooz
I was wondering why the 69th was in the 23rd GIAD with the 21st GIAP. I do know that the 6th GIAK/VVS was formed in 1942 from the 7th IAK/PVO, and I am guessing that all elements within that corps were given guards status. But then, why does the 23rd GIAP not contain the 20th and 21st GIAPs?? So perhaps the 69th was transferred later in the war, or, all the elements were not given guards status along with the corps in 1942.
I will need to do some investigating myself.
Thank you for your help.
Tooz
Hi again 
I had a look on Guards Air Divisions. Seems so, that Divisions under question here are 4th, 5th and 6th Guards Fighter Air Divisions.
About 4th GvIAD - formed on 17th March (but there are also other dates mentioned in documents, up to 22nd) March 1943 from previous 274th IAD. It is mentioned that 64th Gv IAP and 66th Gv IAP belonged to this Division, so - probably also 65th.
5th Gv IAD - formed on 17th or 18th March 1943 from previous 239th IAD.
About 46th IAP (soon will become 68th IAP) it's mentioned that it was included in the end of November into 239th IAD. Used Kittyhawk fighters on this period, and became also on 18th of March 1943 Guards unit.
67th Gv IAP was previous 436th Fighter Air Regiment. Was established as PVO unit for Murmansk air defence. Used Kittyhawk fighters. But was soon moved to more southern areas. Participated in January 1943 on Kittyhawk's in aerial fighting in Staraja Russa area. In beginning of 1943 took into use Airacobra's. In June 1943 was moved to 1st Fighter Division and participated in Kursk battles. But i don't have any info into what unit it belonged in this Staraja Russa period.
About regiments what belonged to 239th IAD, and 5th Gv IAD in the future.
239th IAD was formed in June 1942. I have found until now only one unit what is mentioned that belonged to the division at this moment - 485th IAP, this became later 72nd Gv IAP.
On 1942 239th IAD fought over Demjansk pocket. On this period into Division also belonged 402nd IAP. But this unit was moved on the 10th February of 1943 to 265th IAD.
In the end of November 1942 into Division was included 46th IAP, future 68th Guards Fighter Regiment. On Kittyhawk's. In same time there were in Division 28th Guards Fighter Regiment (on Cobra's), and 485th Air Regiment (future 72nd GvIAP).
28th Guards Regiment was brought into Division from Leningrad area probably in summer 1942. Earlier it participated on defence of Road of Life over Ladoga. And got it's Guards title probably for those fights already in new Division, November 1942.
And one more unit about which it is mentioned that it belonged to Division in the end of 1942 is the 10th Air Regiment. On 30th December 1942 was killed in aerial fighting over Pola railway station commander of the 10th Regiment Nikolay Terechin. In this battle participated 7 Regiment's Kittyhawk's.
So. it look's like Division was raised to Guards status. 28th Regiment already was Guard's unit. 46th IAP became 68th Gv IAP. Not sure about 67th GvIAP (former 436th IAP), did it belong to 4th or 5th GvIAD.
But 69th probably belonged to 5th Gv IAP, and quite possible that it was 10th Fighter Air Regiment. Because was in Division in the end of previous year, was also on lend-lease aircraft as other regiments of the division, and at least in some source(s) it is mentioned that was reformed to 69th Gv IAP.
Don't know now anything about 70th and 71st Fighter Air Regiments. Where they existing? Or just missed on some reason? But 72nd is again in 5th Guards Fighter Division.
And 6th Air Fighter Division was formed in Stalingrad area, from previous 269th Air Fighter Division. Units in it were 9th and 31st Guards Fighter Regiments (had those titles earlier) and 73rd and 83rd Guards Fighter Regiments.
rgrds
Toomas
I had a look on Guards Air Divisions. Seems so, that Divisions under question here are 4th, 5th and 6th Guards Fighter Air Divisions.
About 4th GvIAD - formed on 17th March (but there are also other dates mentioned in documents, up to 22nd) March 1943 from previous 274th IAD. It is mentioned that 64th Gv IAP and 66th Gv IAP belonged to this Division, so - probably also 65th.
5th Gv IAD - formed on 17th or 18th March 1943 from previous 239th IAD.
About 46th IAP (soon will become 68th IAP) it's mentioned that it was included in the end of November into 239th IAD. Used Kittyhawk fighters on this period, and became also on 18th of March 1943 Guards unit.
67th Gv IAP was previous 436th Fighter Air Regiment. Was established as PVO unit for Murmansk air defence. Used Kittyhawk fighters. But was soon moved to more southern areas. Participated in January 1943 on Kittyhawk's in aerial fighting in Staraja Russa area. In beginning of 1943 took into use Airacobra's. In June 1943 was moved to 1st Fighter Division and participated in Kursk battles. But i don't have any info into what unit it belonged in this Staraja Russa period.
About regiments what belonged to 239th IAD, and 5th Gv IAD in the future.
239th IAD was formed in June 1942. I have found until now only one unit what is mentioned that belonged to the division at this moment - 485th IAP, this became later 72nd Gv IAP.
On 1942 239th IAD fought over Demjansk pocket. On this period into Division also belonged 402nd IAP. But this unit was moved on the 10th February of 1943 to 265th IAD.
In the end of November 1942 into Division was included 46th IAP, future 68th Guards Fighter Regiment. On Kittyhawk's. In same time there were in Division 28th Guards Fighter Regiment (on Cobra's), and 485th Air Regiment (future 72nd GvIAP).
28th Guards Regiment was brought into Division from Leningrad area probably in summer 1942. Earlier it participated on defence of Road of Life over Ladoga. And got it's Guards title probably for those fights already in new Division, November 1942.
And one more unit about which it is mentioned that it belonged to Division in the end of 1942 is the 10th Air Regiment. On 30th December 1942 was killed in aerial fighting over Pola railway station commander of the 10th Regiment Nikolay Terechin. In this battle participated 7 Regiment's Kittyhawk's.
So. it look's like Division was raised to Guards status. 28th Regiment already was Guard's unit. 46th IAP became 68th Gv IAP. Not sure about 67th GvIAP (former 436th IAP), did it belong to 4th or 5th GvIAD.
But 69th probably belonged to 5th Gv IAP, and quite possible that it was 10th Fighter Air Regiment. Because was in Division in the end of previous year, was also on lend-lease aircraft as other regiments of the division, and at least in some source(s) it is mentioned that was reformed to 69th Gv IAP.
Don't know now anything about 70th and 71st Fighter Air Regiments. Where they existing? Or just missed on some reason? But 72nd is again in 5th Guards Fighter Division.
And 6th Air Fighter Division was formed in Stalingrad area, from previous 269th Air Fighter Division. Units in it were 9th and 31st Guards Fighter Regiments (had those titles earlier) and 73rd and 83rd Guards Fighter Regiments.
rgrds
Toomas
Hi =69.GIAP=TOOZ
Posted my first answer before read your reply.
Must say that this Soviat aviation unit's history stuff is very tricky question. I have tried to get some undertsanding on it, but probably it will be impossible to solve all question without visiting some archieves.
But what i can tell.
In the beginning there were only Guards Air Regiments. No Divisions. 1st Guards Air Divisions were formed in Stalingrad, on 31st January 1943. And from this time part of Regiments started to get Guards numbers together.
But there still remained those Guards units which got their statues before it. And they were also included in Guards Divisions step-by-step.
And in same time were Regiments moved from Division to Division, what also mixed up numbering.
And very confusing factor is also that similar numbers were used between different branches. So, there were numbering schemes for VVS, for ADD, for VVS VMF, and for PVO. And sometimes units were transfered from one branch to another. And sometimes it remained it's old number, sometimes it was renumbered. And units were renumbered also on other reasons. etc...
And about 7th Corps of PVO. It wasn't in Moscow air defence. Moscow Air Defence was 6th Corps of PVO. 7th Corps of PVO was in Leningrad Air Defence. It was raised to Guards statues and became 2nd Guards Fighter Corps. But it happened on 7th July 1943. When blockade of Leningrad was broken.
And 7th IAK what became on 27th October 1944 6th Guards IAK wasn't PVO unit, as much as i understand.
But i am not sure about it also
rgrds
Toomas
Posted my first answer before read your reply.
Must say that this Soviat aviation unit's history stuff is very tricky question. I have tried to get some undertsanding on it, but probably it will be impossible to solve all question without visiting some archieves.
But what i can tell.
In the beginning there were only Guards Air Regiments. No Divisions. 1st Guards Air Divisions were formed in Stalingrad, on 31st January 1943. And from this time part of Regiments started to get Guards numbers together.
But there still remained those Guards units which got their statues before it. And they were also included in Guards Divisions step-by-step.
And in same time were Regiments moved from Division to Division, what also mixed up numbering.
And very confusing factor is also that similar numbers were used between different branches. So, there were numbering schemes for VVS, for ADD, for VVS VMF, and for PVO. And sometimes units were transfered from one branch to another. And sometimes it remained it's old number, sometimes it was renumbered. And units were renumbered also on other reasons. etc...
And about 7th Corps of PVO. It wasn't in Moscow air defence. Moscow Air Defence was 6th Corps of PVO. 7th Corps of PVO was in Leningrad Air Defence. It was raised to Guards statues and became 2nd Guards Fighter Corps. But it happened on 7th July 1943. When blockade of Leningrad was broken.
And 7th IAK what became on 27th October 1944 6th Guards IAK wasn't PVO unit, as much as i understand.
But i am not sure about it also
rgrds
Toomas
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=69.GIAP=TOOZ
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I was under the impression that the 7th IAK/PVO was allocated to the Moscow defence, but then in late 1941, the 123rd and 158th IAP, together with some of the Baltic Felet regiments, were transferred to Leningrad. These both flew P-40s.
I'm not sure what happened after the winter, whether all of the 7th IAK were allocated to the defence of Leningrad or not. But I am sure that there were some regiments who flew I-16s in the Moscow PVO forces, and these regiments were units of the 7th IAK/PVO. Slesarchuk, Gazin, and Perevera are names of 3 pilots whom I believe flew in one of these regiments up until the spring of 1942 (although I have not yet been able to find any other information on them).
It is most confusing, and is increasingly frustrating that there can be so little information, or rather, so little coherent information about such a simple thing as the history of a regiment!!
As for your idea that perhaps the 69th was originally the 169th IAP, I too have a little information that suggests that is the case. I found a site detailing soviet regiments during the Korean War and found the 69th listed. The 169th IAP was given as the original regiment, and that they flew Mig-15bis in 1950/51 in the Korean theatre.
I would very much like to visit some sort of archive which my contain information on this, and many other regiments during WWII, but I doubt I will have the chance.
Oh well, thank you for your help. It is much appreciated.
Mikael.
I'm not sure what happened after the winter, whether all of the 7th IAK were allocated to the defence of Leningrad or not. But I am sure that there were some regiments who flew I-16s in the Moscow PVO forces, and these regiments were units of the 7th IAK/PVO. Slesarchuk, Gazin, and Perevera are names of 3 pilots whom I believe flew in one of these regiments up until the spring of 1942 (although I have not yet been able to find any other information on them).
It is most confusing, and is increasingly frustrating that there can be so little information, or rather, so little coherent information about such a simple thing as the history of a regiment!!
As for your idea that perhaps the 69th was originally the 169th IAP, I too have a little information that suggests that is the case. I found a site detailing soviet regiments during the Korean War and found the 69th listed. The 169th IAP was given as the original regiment, and that they flew Mig-15bis in 1950/51 in the Korean theatre.
I would very much like to visit some sort of archive which my contain information on this, and many other regiments during WWII, but I doubt I will have the chance.
Oh well, thank you for your help. It is much appreciated.
Mikael.
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Craig Crofoot
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- Location: Madison, Wisconsin
This is from THE JOURNAL OF THE SOVIET ARMY
Soviet Air Force Regiments Study Group
Background:
Our Group started with a few members doing research on the order of battle of the Soviet Air Force on the first day of the German invasion of the USSR on 22 June 1941 back in early 2002. When then expanded our purview to the entire war. Once we started to realize that this would be a bigger and more costly Project, we added additional members. We then decided to provide this as a central part of The Journal of the Soviet Army magazine.
We will be carrying historical summaries of the Regiments, first on the pre-June 1941 units, then that information during the war. The project will document in great detail Air Regimental assets during the Second World War and in the immediate post-war period. This will include the Regiment’s location, it’s assignments, it’s ground service supporting it and the number and type of aircraft on-hand. The project's scale can be appreciated when we consider the estimated number of regiments is between 1200 and 2400.
We currently have on hand 79 Regimental files covering 93 different designations.
We have begun a new series detailing the Aviation formations that were part of the Active Army (those units on an active combat front) for the Second World War. For the fight against the European Axis nations, this was 22 June 1941 to 11 May 1945 and for the Japanese, 9 August 1945 to 3 September 1945. Those that have already started it is to try and obtain 10 pages every month until completed (Note: I believe it would be approximately 200 pages in length).
Craig
Soviet Air Force Regiments Study Group
Background:
Our Group started with a few members doing research on the order of battle of the Soviet Air Force on the first day of the German invasion of the USSR on 22 June 1941 back in early 2002. When then expanded our purview to the entire war. Once we started to realize that this would be a bigger and more costly Project, we added additional members. We then decided to provide this as a central part of The Journal of the Soviet Army magazine.
We will be carrying historical summaries of the Regiments, first on the pre-June 1941 units, then that information during the war. The project will document in great detail Air Regimental assets during the Second World War and in the immediate post-war period. This will include the Regiment’s location, it’s assignments, it’s ground service supporting it and the number and type of aircraft on-hand. The project's scale can be appreciated when we consider the estimated number of regiments is between 1200 and 2400.
We currently have on hand 79 Regimental files covering 93 different designations.
We have begun a new series detailing the Aviation formations that were part of the Active Army (those units on an active combat front) for the Second World War. For the fight against the European Axis nations, this was 22 June 1941 to 11 May 1945 and for the Japanese, 9 August 1945 to 3 September 1945. Those that have already started it is to try and obtain 10 pages every month until completed (Note: I believe it would be approximately 200 pages in length).
Craig
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=69.GIAP=TOOZ
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- Location: Glasgow, Scotland
Hi Craig, thanks for that.
Is this an online project, or something that is being published in a regular format of some kind? Is there a website or anything for this journal??
It does sound like a mammoth task, especially with a great amount of soviet records being locked up until the fall of the Soviet Uniion, and subsequently being lost. I would love to get involved, but I have limited resources with which to research such a subject.
Mikael.
Is this an online project, or something that is being published in a regular format of some kind? Is there a website or anything for this journal??
It does sound like a mammoth task, especially with a great amount of soviet records being locked up until the fall of the Soviet Uniion, and subsequently being lost. I would love to get involved, but I have limited resources with which to research such a subject.
Mikael.
-
Craig Crofoot
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- Joined: 13 Sep 2003, 15:04
- Location: Madison, Wisconsin
nublu,
Just got to: http://www.journalsovietarmy.org
Everything you need to subscribe (how to) is there). Just follow the links.
Craig
Just got to: http://www.journalsovietarmy.org
Everything you need to subscribe (how to) is there). Just follow the links.
Craig