*Soviet armored cars in WWII (photos of BA-10/BA-20/BA-64)

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BIGpanzer
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Post by BIGpanzer » 16 May 2005 14:51

Last edited by BIGpanzer on 17 May 2005 10:02, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by BIGpanzer » 16 May 2005 14:55

It will be quite interesting to know your opinions about Russian armored cars of WWII period :) As I understand they produced many models of armored cars in 1930s, but 4x2 or 6x4, so all Russian armored cars had quite bad cross-country ability. Nevertheless the armament of Russian middle armored cars was comparable to tank (45mm cannon + 2 MGs). During WWII only light BA-64 (4x4) with single MG was produced. The Russians focused their attention to tank and SPG production, which was much more important for heavy battles with Germans. Also Lend-Lease half-tracks and scout cars were delivered in large quantities (comparable with the production of BA-64 during 1942-1945).

P.S. Here are the photos and pictures of the Soviet heavy armored cars.

BA-5:
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/broneprototips/BA5.jpg (side view)
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/broneavtom ... /ba5_1.jpg (rear view)

BA-11:
http://armor.kiev.ua:8100/Tanks/BeforeW ... ba11_1.jpg (BA-11D with diesel engine)
http://autoraritet.by.ru/sia/sia4/img7.jpg (note the removable caterpillars)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... A11pic.jpg (colour picture)
http://armor.kiev.ua:8100/Tanks/BeforeW ... ba11_3.jpg (camouflage picture, Leningrad Front, 1942)
http://armor.kiev.ua:8100/Tanks/BeforeW ... ba11_8.jpg (Germans destroyed and captured several BA-11s)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... 1draft.jpg (blueprints)
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 17 May 2005 15:45, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by BIGpanzer » 17 May 2005 09:50

Photos and pictures of BA-10 - the most well-known Soviet medium armored car:

http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_11.jpg (communication BA-10, Winter War)
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_47.jpg (on the way to front, summer 1941)
http://autoraritet.by.ru/sia/sia4/img4.jpg (note the removable steel caterpillars for back wheels in transport position)
http://www.smallafv.nn.ru/pics/museum_ba10_slide10.jpg (autumn 1941, near BA-10 - the famous Soviet tank commander colonel [later general] Katukov)
http://www.war.ee/earth/ussr/armcars/ba ... a10_03.jpg (BA-10 with caterpillars, Leningrad Front, 1943)
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_12.jpg (BA-10 as troop-carrier)
http://www.war.ee/earth/ussr/armcars/ba ... a10_01.jpg (BA-10 supports the attacking infantry)
http://www.war.ee/earth/ussr/armcars/ba ... a10_04.jpg (destroyed BA-10)
http://www.waronline.org/blindage/images/foto108.jpg (destroyed BA-10, near Smolensk, 1941)
http://www.russianwarrior.com/1930vecindex_BA10pict.htm (BA-10 was captured by the Germans)


http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_4.jpg (colour picture)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... A10_04.jpg (excellent 3-side view colour picture)

http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_1.jpg (BA-10 preserved in Finland)
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/ba10/ba10_6.jpg (another trophy BA-10 preserved in Finland)
Last edited by BIGpanzer on 04 Jul 2005 15:51, edited 5 times in total.

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Post by BIGpanzer » 17 May 2005 14:29

I am trying to find the info about Soviet amphibious armored cars, several models of which were produced (small series) in 1930s. Did they participate in any combats?

P.S. Also any additional combat photos of Soviet armored cars are very welcome :) :)
Please your opinions about the info and photos I've posted for your pleasure :) :) :)

Regards, BIGpanzer.

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Post by BIGpanzer » 18 May 2005 18:45

Really, does anybody know something about Soviet amphibious armored cars of 1930s?

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Soviet amphibious armored cars

Post by BIGpanzer » 21 May 2005 11:37

Nobody wants to write any info :( :( :( :)

So, what I found by myself during the last three days :D

In 1931-1932 the first experimental amphibious armored car BAD-2 was built by Izhora factory (Leningrad). The abbreviation BAD mean “armored motor water car”. BAD-2 was based on “Ford-Timken” 6x4 chassis and presented one of the first universal armored cars with heavy armament in the world. It had the framized body of boat shape, could swim (with the help of screw propeller) and railway move (with the help of removable steel railway wheels). For increasing of cross-country ability the removable steel caterpillars for the 2nd and 3rd axles were possible to use. BAD-2 had the radio station, two gas-cylinders for smoke screen and pump for the pumping-out water. In 1933 BAD-2 could swim across the Neva river (1200 m wide) during the Leningrad military parade and thus very impressed the members of the parade.
Specifications of BAD-2: weight 4,6 t; dimensions 5,85x2,05x2,15 m; crew 4 men; armor 4-6 mm; armament 37mm cannon + 4x7,62mm DT MGs (two of them were reserve); ammunition 60 shells + 3000 MG shells; engine 40 hp; speed 70 km/h - road, 90 km/h – railway, 6 km/h – water; range 120 km.

In 1933 the more reliable PB-4 with better armament in T-26 light tank turret and armor was developed and serially produced in 1933-1934 (small series). PB-4 means “Plavajushi Broneavtomobil” (floating armored car). It was based also on “Ford-Timken” 6x4 chassis. PB-4 was equipped with engine outboard water heat exchanger, screw propeller and two side pontoons, filed with cork. Also removable caterpillars could be used as in all Soviet models of 6x4 armored cars. PB-4 was quite successful amphibious armored car, but its power and cross-country ability (especially on marshland) was insufficient.
Specifications of PB-4: weight 5,28 t; dimensions 5,3x1,98x2,25 m; clearance 25,4 cm; crew 4 men; armor 4-7 mm; armament 45mm tank cannon mod. 1932 + 2x7,62mm DT MG; ammunition 52 shells + 2268 MG shells; engine 40 hp; speed 50 km/h – road, 4 km/h – water; range 140-200 km.

In 1936 the lightweight and more maneuverable PB-7 modification was built as small series (6x4 GAZ-AAA chassis, 50 hp, 4.5 t, speed 60 km/h – road, 5 km/h - water), but it was armed only with single 7,62mm ShKAS MG (1000 shells). PB-7 had a new hull without side pontoons, 3 men crew and armor 4-8 mm.

It should be noted that Soviet army had many quite good amphibious light tanks T-37A and T-38 in 1930s, so bulky amphibious armored cars with insufficient cross-country ability remained not numerous.

Photos of BAD-2:
http://ww-2.com/modules/Static_Docs/dat ... g_0166.jpg
(the small picture below is PB-4)
http://armoredzone.by.ru/Pred/bad-2zhd.jpg (railway BAD-2)
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_32.jpg (excellent photo, note the removable caterpillars)

Photos of PB-4:
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_33.jpg (Leningrad, 1935)
http://ww-2.com/modules/Static_Docs/dat ... g_0168.jpg
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_34.jpg (crossing the river)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... PB4_06.jpg (excellent colour picture)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... 4right.jpg (preserved in Russia, Kubinka tank museum)
http://www.jagdtiger.de/SovietTanks/PB-4-02.jpg (the same preserved PB-4)
http://mkmagazin.almanacwhf.ru/armor/ba_64_06.gif (picture)

Photos of PB-7:
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_35.jpg (during the trials, equipped with caterpillars)
http://armoredzone.by.ru/Pred/Pba-7.jpg (during the trials)
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_37.jpg (back view, note the screw propeller)

The photo of the Soviet amphibious armored car PB-4 (1933-1934, near 10 copies) is from
http://mk-armour.narod.ru/2003/01/Photo_34_small.jpg
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Post by BIGpanzer » 21 May 2005 14:47

But I still couldn't find any info about the using of those amphibious armored cars in any combats in 1939-1945.
Any ideas?

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KSP-76 SP gun

Post by BIGpanzer » 22 May 2005 10:24

I found a short info about the very interesting Soviet experimental armored car – wheeled self-propelled gun KSP-76 (GAZ-68 ). I didn’t know about such AFV before.

It was built by Gorky car factory (GAZ) in May 1944 in one copy, based on 4x4 experimental truck GAZ-63 chassis with excellent cross-country ability. KSP-76 had low and open from above armored hull with 76,2mm divisional gun and radio station. The front armor could withstand the hits of armor-piercing bullets, also the tires were bulletproof. The engine GAZ-202 with modified cooling system was located from the rear.

Specifications of KSP-76 (GAZ-68 ): 4x4; weight 5,34 t; dimensions 6,35x2,05x1,55 m; clearance 27,3 cm; crew 3 men; armament 76,2mm cannon ZiS-3 (58 shells); armor 5-16,5 mm; engine GAZ-202 85 hp; speed 62-77 km/h; range 430-580 km (with 140 l fuel).

Serial KSP-76s were intended to use as high-speed SP gun for infantry support during the Soviet offensive in Europe, front scout car and mobile tank destroyer. But the serial production of unique KSP-76 was abandoned because of light SU-76M production in huge amounts, despite the fact that KSP-76 was two times lighter, had lesser dimensions and was much more maneuverable. Its cross-country ability was almost the same as tank chassis had.

Photos and pictures of KSP-76:
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/sau_dr/ksp76_2.jpg (during the trials)
http://fotoarmor.narod.ru/gun/ksp01b.jpg (preserved at Kubinka tank museum, Russia)
http://bronetehnika.narod.ru/sau_dr/ksp76_5.gif (side view colour picture)
http://denisovets.narod.ru/brone/bronep ... P76_08.jpg (another excellent picture)

The photo of the Soviet experimental anti-tank self-propelled gun KSP-76 (1944)
is from http://legion.wplus.net/guide/army/tr/gaz68-3.jpg
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Post by BIGpanzer » 22 May 2005 15:07

How do you think is it possible to find any data about losses of Soviet armored cars in 1941?

I read that the huge amount of the light FAI/BA-20 and the medium BA-6/BA-10 were destroyed and abandoned during the first days of the war. BA-20s were used as scout and commander's cars almost in all mechanized, tank units and in many infantry units; BA-6s/BA-10s were used very intensive for the artillery support of the infantry and even against German tanks in front combats. So their losses during the Soviet defensive battles in 1941 were great. But I don't have exact data...
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Post by BIGpanzer » 23 May 2005 10:15

Nobody knows, even guys from Russia?! :(

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Milorg
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Post by Milorg » 23 May 2005 22:36

A bigpanzer
I am not contributing(sp?) but i must say i read al of your post on this tread.
Tumbs up to you :D

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Post by G. Trifkovic » 23 May 2005 22:48

Milorg wrote:A bigpanzer
I am not contributing(sp?) but i must say i read al of your post on this tread.
Tumbs up to you :D
I agree wholeheartedly-two tumbs up!

Cheers :wink:

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Post by BIGpanzer » 24 May 2005 09:54

Thanks, guys! :wink:

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Post by kordts » 06 Jun 2005 15:58

BIGpanszer,
congrats to you. It seems like you have found an area of interest that is off the beaten path. So you can be a pioneering type and collect facts and do research in an unmined area! Who knows, maybe you could write a book about Soviet armored cars :D

Peace out,

Kordts

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Post by BIGpanzer » 06 Jun 2005 18:28

Hello, kordts!
Thank you for the kind letter!

I think that the theme of Soviet armored cars of WWII period is very well researched in the military historical literature. But as for me - I wanted to combine the short info about all models of Soviet armored cars, participated in WWII, and to post it here for my knowledge and for the pleasure of all forum members :) . Also - I would like to find combat photos of armored cars.
As RoW already wrote, a very good book about Soviet armored cars (1930-2000) already existed. See the link here: http://ww-2.com/modules/Static_Docs/dat ... /index.htm

Best regards, BIGpanzer

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